Heard from my friend say ACCA cannot enter SQP thus unable to get CPA.

Kyoji83

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At HR point of view for accounting position in Public accountant firm, one must have CPA in order for you to growth with the organization which there are chances you will stay with the organization for long. Those without CPA will end their career at junior manager while their peers move on to be partners. In this case those without CPA will get demoralize & affect the rest. This group without CPA will not stay long to growth with the organization in the long run. So that the reason why we should not employed them in the first place.

For Private firm at fresh/junior accounting position, I buy your Justification. However for senior position, I do not buy your Justification since experiences over right your academic knowledge & capability.

Those with CPA Sg is valuable credential & also a testament to their well-grounded knowledge, integrity and commitment. The experience and high standards of professionalism of CPA Sg makes a difference and used as a Quality Assurance (QA) when it comes to the interest of business, employer and/or client.

Unlike engineering, there are 2 types of accountants, public accountants and private accountants. For public accountants, sadly, you need CPA and thus government recognition. However, without CPA, you can still work as a public accountant, just that you will never be able to reach the partner position whereby you can sign off documents. For private accountants, government recognition or CPA is never an issue.


For your second question, it depends on the job.

Job 1 - Public accountant firm (i.e. big 4) with a career progression to become partner:
Need to have CPA, therefore, no choice but to hire the one with CPA.


Job 2 - Public accountant firm without progression to partner. (i.e. progression limited to junior manager)

OR

Private firm hiring an accountant to do internal accounting functions such as audit.

If everything is the same, job experiences, salary, etc.... Then it depends on the degrees the candidate has and their previous job's appraisal.

As a general guide, ACCA > Private degrees such as Plymouth.
Local Degree > ACCA


Justification? Simply because ACCA is more rigourous, more breadth and depth, and harder to pass than private degree. Therefore, I presume this ACCA graduate as having a better academic knowledge and capability.

Moreover, CPA does not matter for this job 2, so the employee simply having CPA will not add any tangible value to the company.
 

nitokit

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At HR point of view for accounting position in Public accountant firm, one must have CPA in order for you to growth with the organization which there are chances you will stay with the organization for long. Those without CPA will end their career at junior manager while their peers move on to be partners. In this case those without CPA will get demoralize & affect the rest. This group without CPA will not stay long to growth with the organization in the long run. So that the reason why we should not employed them in the first place.

For Private firm at fresh/junior accounting position, I buy your Justification. However for senior position, I do not buy your Justification since experiences over right your academic knowledge & capability.

You said the 2 candidates have the same experiences but different qualification, so I kept it at that.

And do you know that it is almost impossible for private degree holders (CPA or not) to move up to become a partner? Do you know how many people make it to become a partner? Most people in big 4 joined knowing it is impossible for them to rise to become a partner :s13:


Those with CPA Sg is valuable credential & also a testament to their well-grounded knowledge, integrity and commitment. The experience and high standards of professionalism of CPA Sg makes a difference and used as a Quality Assurance (QA) when it comes to the interest of business, employer and/or client.

Since when? :s13::s13::s13::s22::s22::s22:

So your cert gets recognised and you got your CPA after 3 years of working, then all of a sudden, you are considered to have well-grounded knowledge, integrity, commitment, professionalism?!?!
So those who didn't apply to get CPA after 3 years of working don't have all this qualities?!?!

WOW, I didn't know this CPA designation is so powerful, being able to change one's character etc *sarcasm*
 
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HaizHaiz

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At HR point of view for accounting position in Public accountant firm, one must have CPA in order for you to growth with the organization which there are chances you will stay with the organization for long. Those without CPA will end their career at junior manager while their peers move on to be partners. In this case those without CPA will get demoralize & affect the rest. This group without CPA will not stay long to growth with the organization in the long run. So that the reason why we should not employed them in the first place.

For Private firm at fresh/junior accounting position, I buy your Justification. However for senior position, I do not buy your Justification since experiences over right your academic knowledge & capability.

Those with CPA Sg is valuable credential & also a testament to their well-grounded knowledge, integrity and commitment. The experience and high standards of professionalism of CPA Sg makes a difference and used as a Quality Assurance (QA) when it comes to the interest of business, employer and/or client.

Do you know cima is not of the ccab member in uk? Since u lazy to read, cima is not allow to do audit in uk, can to explain to me how they remain prestigious in uk?

Do u know China accounting body do not recognise acca for audit? can u explain to me how acca gain its fame in china?

are u going to tell me uk is uk, china is china, sg is sg?

Do u bad the situation was between CPA(hong kong) and ACCA, yet a partial recognition was achieved? Are u sure acca and icpas cannot reach some sort of agreement(be it partial or full)? Since u are lazy to read, ACCA threatens to sue cpa(hong kong)

after reading some of ur posts in other threads, I concluded, u have very little knowledge about accounting job scope and the accounting sector. Secondly, u have inferiority complex because you are from EM3/NT/ITE. Lastly, u have very little knowledge in accounting sector and u are lazy to read up, why are u giving comment while acting like a professional(but u don't know anything)? inferiority complex?

Initially, I thought u are fellow acca student, but it turns out then u just want to belittle another professional. IF u have a lot of relevant knowledge and give constructive advice, sure go ahead. Again, you have very limit knowledge about his sector.

Try belittling any other professional qualification(which u dun belong to), I am sure no one will like, esp when u have so little knowledge. It like a foreigner coming to sg and belittling singaporean
 
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HaizHaiz

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Just one question to Kyoji:

Why do you belittle ACCA so much? It is a fact that ACCA is harder to pass than most private degrees, and the content is much more intensive as well.

ACCA is meant for those interested in working in the accounting field. Those who wants to go other field should not take it in the first place. Thus, I see no reason why you should argue that employers wouldn't hire ACCA graduates for non-accounting positions since ACCA graduates should not go into these fields either.


What you should compare is the capability of ACCA graduates in an accounting position. And I see no reason why a competent hiring manager would belittle or give less recognition to ACCA. A competent hiring manager shouldn't be influenced by what the SG government does, as what the government does wouldn't affect ACCA course syllabus and the competence of their graduates.......



Therefore, based on all that you said, i've found you ridiculous and doubt your capability as a hiring manager.

I think he attempted acca but failed miserably. He became jealous.

look at Kyoji other post: I used to work as HR & I do recruit Account & Finance positions. I also have been a Hiring Manager but not for Account & Finance positions. MOE & Govt think I am stupid cause I am EM3, NT GCE N & ITE but I manage to get a degree & be HR & Hiring Manager to recruit & hire NUS/NTU/SMU/etc graduate base on my judgement. I believe other HR will share the same opinion as me & that is some position like business analyst & etc, we will rather hire a business graduate over an ACCA graduate because ACCA only focus on Accounting & did not learn economic, sale & etc.

He has inferiority complex, but force himself to believe he higher than NUS/NTU/SMU. Then he follow to belittle ACCA when he doesn't even know what are we studying(go read his other thread).
 

Kyoji83

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You said the 2 candidates have the same experiences but different qualification, so I kept it at that.

And do you know that it is almost impossible for private degree holders (CPA or not) to move up to become a partner? Do you know how many people make it to become a partner? Most people in big 4 joined knowing it is impossible for them to rise to become a partner :s13:


Regrading this, I am not sure. Maybe someone from public accounting firm like Big4 can share with us.


Since when? :s13::s13::s13::s22::s22::s22:

So your cert gets recognised and you got your CPA after 3 years of working, then all of a sudden, you are considered to have well-grounded knowledge, integrity, commitment, professionalism?!?!
So those who didn't apply to get CPA after 3 years of working don't have all this qualities?!?!

WOW, I didn't know this CPA designation is so powerful, being able to change one's character etc *sarcasm*


Anyone who have a CPA Sg act as a licence to work in accounting related job. If CPA Sg holder do something wrong, the whole world know. But if a non CPA Sg holder do something wrong, not much people know about it. This act as a QA that CPA Sg holder will not play a fool because their reputation is at risk which is the reason why they are more integrity, commitment & professionalism.
 

Kyoji83

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Do you know cima is not of the ccab member in uk? Since u lazy to read, cima is not allow to do audit in uk, can to explain to me how they remain prestigious in uk?

Do u know China accounting body do not recognise acca for audit? can u explain to me how acca gain its fame in china?

are u going to tell me uk is uk, china is china, sg is sg?

Do u bad the situation was between CPA(hong kong) and ACCA, yet a partial recognition was achieved? Are u sure acca and icpas cannot reach some sort of agreement(be it partial or full)? Since u are lazy to read, ACCA threatens to sue cpa(hong kong)

To tell you the true, I am no interested to debate with you because I am lazy to check & read it up.

after reading some of ur posts in other threads, I concluded, u have very little knowledge about accounting job scope and the accounting sector. Secondly, u have inferiority complex because you are from EM3/NT/ITE. Lastly, u have very little knowledge in accounting sector and u are lazy to read up, why are u giving comment while acting like a professional(but u don't know anything)? inferiority complex?

Initially, I thought u are fellow acca student, but it turns out then u just want to belittle another professional. IF u have a lot of relevant knowledge and give constructive advice, sure go ahead. Again, you have very limit knowledge about his sector.

Try belittling any other professional qualification(which u dun belong to), I am sure no one will like, esp when u have so little knowledge. It like a foreigner coming to sg and belittling singaporean

I am more interest to debate on this. Yes, I have very little knowledge for Public firm in accounting sector. However I believe I am competent to comment since I used to recruit accounting related job for both SME & MNC. This mean that before you get an interview & your resume is shown to the Hiring Manager, I am the one who screen you. Hahaha, if one day all Recruiter in SG have the mindset like me, you can forget about looking for an accounting related job in Sg.
 

Kyoji83

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I consider ACCA before but after weighing the pro & con, I decided to take a degree cause what ACCA graduate can do, a degree graduate can also do but what a degree graduate can do, ACCA graduate cannot do.

I do not like what Govt & MOE have done to my education path however I do not feel inferiority.

ACCA graduate do not even learn economic. Do you know what is supply & demand? Common Sense also know.

If your ACCA is recognize by CA Sg, the market value remain in SG. If your ACCA is not recognize by CA Sg, the market value will drop in SG. As simple as that & do not needs a tertiary education to know that.

I think he attempted acca but failed miserably. He became jealous.

look at Kyoji other post: I used to work as HR & I do recruit Account & Finance positions. I also have been a Hiring Manager but not for Account & Finance positions. MOE & Govt think I am stupid cause I am EM3, NT GCE N & ITE but I manage to get a degree & be HR & Hiring Manager to recruit & hire NUS/NTU/SMU/etc graduate base on my judgement. I believe other HR will share the same opinion as me & that is some position like business analyst & etc, we will rather hire a business graduate over an ACCA graduate because ACCA only focus on Accounting & did not learn economic, sale & etc.

He has inferiority complex, but force himself to believe he higher than NUS/NTU/SMU. Then he follow to belittle ACCA when he doesn't even know what are we studying(go read his other thread).
 

Kyoji83

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I am a male Singaporean who serve NS can tell you on your face. When we wear uniform, we are worst then dogs! We are the lowest life form in Sg. How often you see a girl or foreigner serve NS?

* Already reported that 70% 2G male PR AWOL from NS.
* 100% 1G male PR do not needs to serve NS.
* 100% female PR do not needs to serve NS.
* 100% male foreigner (holding work pass) do not needs to serve NS.
* 100% female foreigner (holding work pass) do not needs to serve NS.
* 100% female Singaporean do not needs to serve NS.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
So it is 100% male Singaporean & 30% male PR serve NS which form the minority.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------

In this case out of 100% people in Singapore, only 18.57% serve NS while 81.43% do not needs to serve NS.

Foreigner coming to Sg can tell you in your face that he or she do not needs to serve NS while you needs it & it is a must to serve NS. You just s.u.c.k thumbs cause it is the true unless you downpes to 'Pes F'!

It like a foreigner coming to sg and belittling singaporean
 

nitokit

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To Kyoji:

Being a hiring manager, and being a COMPETENT hiring manager, is different.

I do not want to insult you, but from what you have written so far, I can conclude that you are far from being a competent hiring manager. It is the misfortune of your company to have put you in charge of such a position, and the misfortune of ACCA jobseekers to meet you.


You have little knowledge of ACCA and the accounting field, and yet, you act knowledgeable. You have a very narrow and prejudice view of ACCA.



Since you have always been very critical of streaming and EM3, I thought you would look at people with less mainstream (i.e degree) certification with less prejudice. But, I was wrong!!!!




(BTW, are you sure private degree holders have learnt economics and many other 'useful' modules that ACCA graduates do not have any knowledge of? And, with regard to accounting knowledge, ACCA graduates are presumably far superior)
 

HaizHaiz

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I am a male Singaporean who serve NS can tell you on your face. When we wear uniform, we are worst then dogs! We are the lowest life form in Sg. How often you see a girl or foreigner serve NS?

* Already reported that 70% 2G male PR AWOL from NS.
* 100% 1G male PR do not needs to serve NS.
* 100% female PR do not needs to serve NS.
* 100% male foreigner (holding work pass) do not needs to serve NS.
* 100% female foreigner (holding work pass) do not needs to serve NS.
* 100% female Singaporean do not needs to serve NS.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
So it is 100% male Singaporean & 30% male PR serve NS which form the minority.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------

In this case out of 100% people in Singapore, only 18.57% serve NS while 81.43% do not needs to serve NS.

Foreigner coming to Sg can tell you in your face that he or she do not needs to serve NS while you needs it & it is a must to serve NS. You just s.u.c.k thumbs cause it is the true unless you downpes to 'Pes F'!

Still rmb what happened to the China NUS student who scolded Singaporean 'dogs' on his blog. If that person touch on more sensitive topic like national service? suck thumb? I think he will be packing his bag getting ready to fly back China.
 

nitokit

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To tell you the true, I am no interested to debate with you because I am lazy to check & read it up.



I am more interest to debate on this. Yes, I have very little knowledge for Public firm in accounting sector. However I believe I am competent to comment since I used to recruit accounting related job for both SME & MNC. This mean that before you get an interview & your resume is shown to the Hiring Manager, I am the one who screen you. Hahaha, if one day all Recruiter in SG have the mindset like me, you can forget about looking for an accounting related job in Sg.

You are competent to comment, but you are not competent in your job :s13:

If one day all recruiter in SG have mindset like you, it means all accounting firms in SG are getting shortchanged. Having less talent pool, having to hire poorer quality private degree accounting graduates (disclaimer: not all private degrees grads are inferior).....etc



Thank you for your kind support in the government's screwed up policy of screwing ACCA.
 

nitokit

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after reading some of ur posts in other threads, I concluded, u have very little knowledge about accounting job scope and the accounting sector. Secondly, u have inferiority complex because you are from EM3/NT/ITE. Lastly, u have very little knowledge in accounting sector and u are lazy to read up, why are u giving comment while acting like a professional(but u don't know anything)? inferiority complex?

Haha, I have to agree. After looking at many of Kyoji's threads, it is very obvious that he has an inferiority complex!

But who can blame him, still haven't gotten over his EM3 background.


(To Kyoji: I've seen many successful people who came from EM3, but none of them are critical of EM3 or streaming. In fact, many of them are grateful for the lesson learnt and treat it as a worthwhile life experience. Perhaps you should try treating it as a valuable life experience too?)
 

HaizHaiz

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Kyoji83:

next acca workshop, do u wan to come for a speech? Over there there will be oxford brookes holders, and even more acca holders, feel free to come and give your views.
 

Nif1990

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Since there are so many knowledgable people, may anyone help me out with my queries? Do rmit accounting degree graduates get a chance to enter big 4? I've been scouting a few threads, some says definitely not, some say they do take in rmit grads, some say see luck. So is can or cannot enter? So let's say its definitely no chance, what type of firm should DL grads aim to enter into and there is a high possibility that you will get employed? From what I heard, if u start in a small companies and change job in the future, your cv won't that fantastic to grab you a higher pay job. Last question, is audit the best career path to start in terms of faster future advancement in jobs? Almost all I see from many thread are "I want go big 4 be auditor", I seldom see people saying that they wanted to take up financial or management accounting or tax jobs, even if there are, still cannot compare with the number of people wanting to become an auditor. Hope you guys don't mind me asking something irrelevant to this thread. Thanks.

I know an accounting graduate who was in one of the big 4, and now move on to MNC, holding better pay and work
 

HaizHaiz

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Since there are so many knowledgable people, may anyone help me out with my queries? Do rmit accounting degree graduates get a chance to enter big 4? I've been scouting a few threads, some says definitely not, some say they do take in rmit grads, some say see luck. So is can or cannot enter? So let's say its definitely no chance, what type of firm should DL grads aim to enter into and there is a high possibility that you will get employed? From what I heard, if u start in a small companies and change job in the future, your cv won't that fantastic to grab you a higher pay job. Last question, is audit the best career path to start in terms of faster future advancement in jobs? Almost all I see from many thread are "I want go big 4 be auditor", I seldom see people saying that they wanted to take up financial or management accounting or tax jobs, even if there are, still cannot compare with the number of people wanting to become an auditor. Hope you guys don't mind me asking something irrelevant to this thread. Thanks.

no one here is knowlegable, most here are either students or recently grads. uol/rmit/acca all stand a chance to join big4, u need to have really good results in order to join as fresh grad. Some would go mid-tier gain exp before(if ever) hopping to big4. Generally and traditionally, accounting grads usually go thr audit route. In some states audit exp is a prerequisite for cpa. The upcoming singapore qp, most ATOs(more will be coming) will be audit firm(big or small) or big MNC(hard to join), so if u wan CA professional designation, u are very likely to go thr audit route.

U can join financial or management accounting after audit, your audit exp is relevant.Although I didn't join audit after acca, I recommend others to do it, it will be the safest route.

Tax accountant is a really specialist area. Usually in sme or regional mnc, tax is done by an accountant who do financial accounting as well. Do not mix them up with tax accountant. Tax accountant only do tax, very very complicated tax. Big4 several tax dept such as GST, personal tax, corporate tax and more(i dun rmb) Each person usually specialised in one of the above area. Generally speaking, tax accountant are very highly valued because they do value-adding activities. Their expertise could help corporate save millions in tax. They must constantly outsmart IRAS or other overseas government tax authority to gain a tax advantage. Their demand outside accounting firm small(only really big mnc will hire tax accountant) but their supply is very small too. I only recommend ppl to do tax if they are employed by big accounting firm. SMEs and regional MNCs need more versatile(tax, ap/ar/gl/fa, forecast, budgeting, variance analysis) accountants. They don't hire tax accountant. They might use service from accounting firm. Tax accountant are hired by BIG BIG mnc and they only look at big4 for recruitment.
 

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Hi all this new rule confuse me. please bear with me since I'm really blur and confuse now.

I graduate with UOL Banking and Finance degree and immediate apply for ACCA in Kaplan and I also opt in for ICPAS plus route. If everything is fine I should I finished this december. Would I be affected by this changes? and what I should I do?
 

Kyoji83

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To Kyoji:

Being a hiring manager, and being a COMPETENT hiring manager, is different.

I do not want to insult you, but from what you have written so far, I can conclude that you are far from being a competent hiring manager. It is the misfortune of your company to have put you in charge of such a position, and the misfortune of ACCA jobseekers to meet you.


Haha, look like those worker to top management level that I have recruit & hire are incompetent people to my organization(s). Surprising my boss(s) still give me very good performance appraisal & my organization(s) still survival. By the way, I do recruit ACCA graduates & seem like as what you have say, I am incompetent which is the reason why I hire incompetent people. I wonder any incompetent ACCA graduate here are the one I have recruit & hire?


You have little knowledge of ACCA and the accounting field, and yet, you act knowledgeable. You have a very narrow and prejudice view of ACCA.


My job does not require me to know about accounting field & if there is a needs, I will be doing your job now. As for ACCA, if there is a needs mean I will be your Trainer. My job only needs to know basic of accounting job scope & the market salary rate for accounting related job.


Since you have always been very critical of streaming and EM3, I thought you would look at people with less mainstream (i.e degree) certification with less prejudice. But, I was wrong!!!!


Job is Job & this is where office politics come in. Any one can shoot stupid thing to you & ask for justification. As what I have quote, those who have CPA Sg can hold more responsibility in a company. Some CFO may have dual appointment to be a Secretary of the company. If you do not even meet the requirement to be Secretary of the company such as CPA Sg, how am I going to offer you this CFO position?


(BTW, are you sure private degree holders have learnt economics and many other 'useful' modules that ACCA graduates do not have any knowledge of? And, with regard to accounting knowledge, ACCA graduates are presumably far superior)

I agree that ACCA graduate are better in accounting compare to some accounting graduate. However today market may require you to do something out of your expertise. If you are aiming at accounting related position, then ACCA is enough for you. But there are company who rotate management position for designation or hold dual appointment which you do not suit the organization culture.
 

Kyoji83

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Hahaha, very true.

Still rmb what happened to the China NUS student who scolded Singaporean 'dogs' on his blog. If that person touch on more sensitive topic like national service? suck thumb? I think he will be packing his bag getting ready to fly back China.
 

Kyoji83

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You are competent to comment, but you are not competent in your job :s13:

If one day all recruiter in SG have mindset like you, it means all accounting firms in SG are getting shortchanged. Having less talent pool, having to hire poorer quality private degree accounting graduates (disclaimer: not all private degrees grads are inferior).....etc

Haha, look like those worker to top management level that I have recruit & hire are incompetent people to my organization(s). Surprising my boss(s) still give me very good performance appraisal & my organization(s) still survival. By the way, I do recruit ACCA graduates & seem like as what you have say, I am incompetent which is the reason why I hire incompetent people. I wonder any incompetent ACCA graduate here are the one I have recruit & hire?

Thank you for your kind support in the government's screwed up policy of screwing ACCA.

To tell you the true, I do not like the way of government doing thing. I do not like to play with people rich bowl but one word from government, a lot of employees are affected when it is not their fault. Government are the law & we cannot do anything which is the reason why the only way is to vote current ruling party out.
 
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