2.0 & 2.1 speaker discussion thread IV [consolidated]

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benedium

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The foam for subwoofer is to do what ah? Must cover the area of the subwoofer? Or just the "legs"?

Currently I'm only using the default 4 rubber legs thingy that comes w my sub.

Any foam can right? Recently got some feedback from downstairs neighboUr say vibration or some noise.

Maybe you can try cheap towel, carpet or bathmat first. Experiment lor. See how it affects the sound.
 

mypillowtalks

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legs is key area

foam is normally used to absorb sound.


behind the speaker like where the bass port is put foam on the wall is also good.

Oh foam is absorb sound ah.

My subs are front firing behind no port. If got port behind I will rely on the wall for the bass reflection.

My speakers are stacked ontop of the subs, and No ports behind the speakers too.

The legs of the sub already off the ground but area quite big.
 
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udonc1841

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Recommend me a speaker

Hi bros can intro me some powered speakers for my desktop, only requirement is that it need to connect to my turntable (RCA), PS4(optical), and PC (3.5 or RCA via converter).

Budget is $500, looking at it Edifier R2000DB could be a good choice? looking for alternative suggestion as well.
 

produde1999

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Hi bros can intro me some powered speakers for my desktop, only requirement is that it need to connect to my turntable (RCA), PS4(optical), and PC (3.5 or RCA via converter).

Budget is $500, looking at it Edifier R2000DB could be a good choice? looking for alternative suggestion as well.
you're pretty much settled. otherwise swans m200mkiii+

i rmb z reviews has comparison with these 2
 

wwenze

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Did Z Reviews review the two? I do remember M200MkIII vs S2000 Pro

Not sure if it is appropriate for me to respond, since I am reviewing R2000DB. But for $250-300 range, if you need the inputs, then you don't have much choice apart from that.

Problem with R2000DB is that the digital input is much better than the analog inputs, because internally the amplifier chip is a digital-input chip so by going digital you skip the entire DAC portion of the audio chain, while any analog-in is converted into digital first. And R2000DB has only 1 digital input. So unless you're the type that doesn't care about DACs and sound cards, you would be wanting your main audio source to be connected via optical in. But then your PS4 has only optical out...

I suggest getting optical-out from your computer (via motherboard or USB-SPDIF converter), while finding some way to get audio out from your PS4. Can be HDMI audio extractor, can be monitor/TV, can be HDMI capture card...

Or of course you can just turn a blind eye and just connect it however way you like... LSR305 is also having only analog-only inputs feeding an ADC... and so far I haven't seen anybody complaining about it sounding bad.

But enough about R2000DB... if you need more digital inputs, there is M200MKIII+, S2000 Pro, perhaps even M200MKII (WiFi) but I'm not going to recommend the last one out of spite because their choice of tweeter makes the product naming borderlining on bait-and-switch.
 
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shadow84

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Can try getting those multi opt in-1 opt out adaptors. But not sure if sound quality will be affected or not..
 

wwenze

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Can try getting those multi opt in-1 opt out adaptors. But not sure if sound quality will be affected or not..

Have you seen multi HDMI in 1 HDMI out adapters affect video quality? That one has way stricter signalling requirements. :s13:
 

AZE

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Did Z Reviews review the two? I do remember M200MkIII vs S2000 Pro

Not sure if it is appropriate for me to respond, since I am reviewing R2000DB. But for $250-300 range, if you need the inputs, then you don't have much choice apart from that.

Problem with R2000DB is that the digital input is much better than the analog inputs, because internally the amplifier chip is a digital-input chip so by going digital you skip the entire DAC portion of the audio chain, while any analog-in is converted into digital first. And R2000DB has only 1 digital input. So unless you're the type that doesn't care about DACs and sound cards, you would be wanting your main audio source to be connected via optical in. But then your PS4 has only optical out...

I suggest getting optical-out from your computer (via motherboard or USB-SPDIF converter), while finding some way to get audio out from your PS4. Can be HDMI audio extractor, can be monitor/TV, can be HDMI capture card...

Or of course you can just turn a blind eye and just connect it however way you like... LSR305 is also having only analog-only inputs feeding an ADC... and so far I haven't seen anybody complaining about it sounding bad.

But enough about R2000DB... if you need more digital inputs, there is M200MKIII+, S2000 Pro, perhaps even M200MKII (WiFi) but I'm not going to recommend the last one out of spite because their choice of tweeter makes the product naming borderlining on bait-and-switch.

R2000DB uses TAS5508(102db snr output to digital amp) digital processor, PCM9211(101db snr) ADC.

The analog and digital input appeared to be of negligible difference.:o
 

86technie

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Hi bros can intro me some powered speakers for my desktop, only requirement is that it need to connect to my turntable (RCA), PS4(optical), and PC (3.5 or RCA via converter).

Budget is $500, looking at it Edifier R2000DB could be a good choice? looking for alternative suggestion as well.

Aego 3 soundbar/speaker, comes with optical, 1 3.5mm input.
If not Logitech Z625 which have all the connection you need.
However most here do not recommend Logitech, sub par
quality.
 

wwenze

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R2000DB uses TAS5508(102db snr output to digital amp) digital processor, PCM9211(101db snr) ADC.

The analog and digital input appeared to be of negligible difference.:o

TAS5508 is already part of the amp (serial audio input, PWM output). PM9211 is both the ADC and the SPDIF receiver.
 

AZE

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TAS5508 is already part of the amp (serial audio input, PWM output). PM9211 is both the ADC and the SPDIF receiver.

TAS5508 is a PWM processor, it outputs PWM to H bridge/differential output power stage.
The PWM output is limited to 102dB SNR which is slightly higher than the ADC output to TAS5508.
 

zul99z

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Hi I have a m200mkiii + for sale. Brand new, unopened and in box. Selling for $450.
 

wwenze

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TAS5508 is a PWM processor, it outputs PWM to H bridge/differential output power stage.
The PWM output is limited to 102dB SNR which is slightly higher than the ADC output to TAS5508.

....................................................................

Xxgx3Mv.png


The typical class-D amplifier includes the PWM modulator as part of the amplifier. Because the typical amplifier needs to accept typical audio formats. It just happens that in this particular system the two chips are separated. Another example is Tripath's TK2050 which is TC2000 + TP2050. A functional amp needs to include both chips.

I mean, if you look at the schematic of a class-AB transistor amp, you don't say that only the 4 final push-pull output transistors are the power amp, while calling the entire front section in front of it a pre-processor. How to connect the feedback for example?

Similar things exist for linear amps too: for example LME49810 which is more precisely an Audio Power Amplifier Driver but for the most part is just an amp chip with the last output transistor(s) outside the chip.

Or how about IRS2092 for another well-known class-D amp? That thing is also just the driver, and the MOSFETs are whatever people want to use with it.

If you're saying that the quality of the input doesn't matter because the bottleneck is somewhere else in the chain, usually the amplifier or the speaker, then yes that school of thought exists.

However that school of thought also invalidates spending $2,000 on the DAC and amplifier and says onboard sound is good enough, and I'm not going to bring any discussion in that direction in an audio forum.
 
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AZE

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....................................................................

Xxgx3Mv.png


The typical class-D amplifier includes the PWM modulator as part of the amplifier. Because the typical amplifier needs to accept typical audio formats. It just happens that in this particular system the two chips are separated. Another example is Tripath's TK2050 which is TC2000 + TP2050. A functional amp needs to include both chips.

I mean, if you look at the schematic of a class-AB transistor amp, you don't say that only the 4 final push-pull output transistors are the power amp, while calling the entire front section in front of it a pre-processor. How to connect the feedback for example?

Similar things exist for linear amps too: for example LME49810 which is more precisely an Audio Power Amplifier Driver but for the most part is just an amp chip with the last output transistor(s) outside the chip.

Or how about IRS2092 for another well-known class-D amp? That thing is also just the driver, and the MOSFETs are whatever people want to use with it.

If you're saying that the quality of the input doesn't matter because the bottleneck is somewhere else in the chain, usually the amplifier or the speaker, then yes that school of thought exists.

However that school of thought also invalidates spending $2,000 on the DAC and amplifier and says onboard sound is good enough, and I'm not going to bring any discussion in that direction in an audio forum.

http://www.ti.com/lit/ds/symlink/tas5508c.pdf
https://www.ti.com/lit/ds/symlink/tas5121i.pdf

I am using the term TI used themselves, PWM processor and power stage.
You could lodge a complain to TI about their documentation if you insist otherwise.:o

The audio chain is as good as the weakest link. For the most parts, the weakest link is the room itself. What I said was that when you insist that the digital input is much better than the analog input which is not true because specs wise they are rather similar. Digital is better in that implementation but not by much.

As for spending tons on DAC and amps, while, like I said earlier, weakest link dominates. The only good thing about using higher end components along the chain is to prevent gradual accumulation of errors, which for the most cases, mostly dependent on the weakest part of the system.

There is nothing wrong about discussing anything here since this is not Headfi forum where audio science is not allowed to be discussed except in a specific sub forum due the massive presence of vendor sponsorships.:o
 

wwenze

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What I said was that when you insist that the digital input is much better than the analog input which is not true because specs wise they are rather similar.

End result is similar you mean.

Doesn't change the fact that it avoids a digital -> analog -> digital conversion which is better than having the best DAC available on the planet, and that it only has to eat one 102dB from the PCM -> PWM conversion instead of eating one 101dB + a 102dB from the analog -> PCM -> PWM conversion.

P.S. Common mode noise.
 
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abccat

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End result is similar you mean.

Doesn't change the fact that it avoids a digital -> analog -> digital conversion which is better than having the best DAC available on the planet, and that it only has to eat one 102dB from the PCM -> PWM conversion instead of eating one 101dB + a 102dB from the analog -> PCM -> PWM conversion.

P.S. Common mode noise.

Do you use sound card or onboard realtek sound.
 

lance88

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currently using t40 II speakers as well(2 oclock), has anyone use xm7? wondering if i should change from t40 to xm7..
 

wwenze

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XM7 now forever @ $149 is not too bad a deal...

https://sg.creative.com/sale/#

But what are you going to use to drive it?

Before you think China TPA3116 amps, note that XM7 is designed for use with X7 - In fact in X7 control panel, XM7 is a selectable option under speaker model. Which makes me wonder - how actually is XM7 supposed to sound like, and how much different would it be with a standard amp?

x7-screen-2.jpg


Hence this sums up what I feel about XM7's situation


https://www.youtube.com/watch?gl=SG&hl=en-GB&v=3LVcvkLCUtU&t=9m55s
 
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