Hyflux 6% Perpetual Securities

Nainai

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Take a look at the loans to hyflux.
The Perpetual and Perpetual preferences loan amount are much higher compared to every banks.

Yet the banks has a priority to claim over the retailer.


We retailer are fools.
This game is totally unfair


The bank they have their own corporate lawyers. these bank can utilize these resources to play with hyflux , the court all day long. And the banks wont feel any pinch and these lawyers are at their barks and calls. There is no extra charges for over time from the corporate lawyers. They can just use them as if free.



what do the retailer have ?
we have everything to lose.

And guess what? The retail investor stand last in the line but the retail investor loan amount is much higher compared to the banks.

why banks can claim their money back but the retailer are to get hair cuts and to lose it all.

why is this so unfair ?
who created all these unfailr rules ?

Rules are created by human.

who are these unfair people.

can we single them out ?





loanamount.jpg


and may I ask is it THE KOREA DEVELOPMENT BANK, mark in red box , there is a double entry ?

how come there is double entry for this bank of similar amount?



bankentries.jpg

Bank got no shareholder to answer to???

Take loss and move on with life
 

MikeDirnt78

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This dreamingatwork guy is becoming a nuisance.

Can the others just click the report button so that he can disappear from this thread?

He is just going around in circles and refusing to admit his mistakes.
 

peterchan75

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hyflux PNP and Hyflux Preference shares are bonds. Money loan to hyflux.

If it says "This is a junk bond." in the Hyflux 6% Perpetual Securities prospectus would that deter you from investing? Better still, CANNOT get back principle in the event of bankruptcy.

This is the reason why Singapore Savings Bond interest is NOT 6% becuase its principle is gauranteed.
 

peterchan75

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This dreamingatwork guy is becoming a nuisance.

Can the others just click the report button so that he can disappear from this thread?

He is just going around in circles and refusing to admit his mistakes.

What if the retail investor is duped into thinking that it's a safe investment?:s8:
 

dreamwork7878

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GIC and Singtel can buy the rights.
Pump in millions to save Airtell shareholders in India.

Become white knight.

we have no complaint GIC becoming a white knight saving the indian investors
it is okay to save the Indian investor. it is alright to do so.
we are proud to do so.



gic2.jpg


Airtel.jpg

over at our own back yard
this is the treatment to us.
when the Hyflux retail investor funded to build Tuasspring for water.
so Singapore will have more drinking water.
so we will be independent .

But the treatment to us , it is just so unfair.
Sir please take a look and re-review.

it is a world apart.

hyflux.jpg
 
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justwakeup

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GIC and Singtel can buy the rights.
Pump in millions to save Airtell shareholders in India.

Become white knight.

we have no complaint GIC becoming a white knight saving the indian investors
it is okay to save the Indian investor. it is alright to do so.
we are proud to do so.



gic2.jpg


Airtel.jpg

over at our own back yard
this is the treatment to us.
when the Hyflux retail investor funded to build Tuasspring for water.
so Singapore will have more drinking water.
so we will be independent .

But the treatment to us , it is just so unfair.
Sir please take a look and re-review.

it is a world apart.

hyflux.jpg

No body has any obligation to become white knight.

Still, i salute you for your efforts. If only you can save your efforts for other meaningful things...maybe setup a party to push for system reform like what you advocate for?
 

SibehHL

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Duped, is to deceive, hoax, tricked, swindle etc.

Did you just claim that someone swindled someone into buying the retail bonds? Better have something to support your claim and not just tiagong....



What if the retail investor is duped into thinking that it's a safe investment?:s8:
 

dreamwork7878

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Tuasspring is build upon using the first tranche of hyflux retail PNP N2H.

PUB took it away without even paying a single cents back to the
hyflux retailer.

PUB continue to use tuasspring charging bills upon every single house hold , every offices building, every infrastructure, every construction, every shipping, every automobiles, every military base , every business that need water
--- months after months, years upon years and PUB took Tuas spring back for free.


Sir you as Leaders in PUB, you don't have any remorse in doing so ?

how can PUB do this to us?
it is purely bullying the retailer.
You steal from old folks hyflux pnp, you rob the weak retailers.

We used our hard earned money to assist in building Tuas Spring.
you took it for a song.

And on National Day we the groups of affected PNP holders are deeply grieve over the
losses of our hard earned money


when we talk against work place bullying, cyber bullying.

BUT PUB is bullying the retailer in broad daylight.

This is stealing from the groups of retailer .
Why is this allowed ? this should be stopped and values
should be return to the PNP investor.

could we propose you take in PNP N2H.
and pay back our capital over the years.

we can forfeit the 6% what ever dividen.

at least give us back our own capital.
we the PNP investor gave life to Tuas Spring and you just took it away with
a stoke of your pen.



As for the banks.
You can see they can absorb all loss by doing impairment charges.
We have checked and confirmed all banks make impairment charges and
within a few quarters they start making bilions in profits else where.

However, for us the retailer we are badly hit and we cannot perform such feat like what the banks can do.
 
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coolhead

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How much did you roughly put in?

Sent from HMD Global TA-1004 using GAGT
 

wonglw24

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Perpetual bonds should not be even called bonds, very misleading if it is marketed to retailers that way. When claiming on company assets, perpetual bond has the least priority.
 

makav31i

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Perpetual bonds should not be even called bonds, very misleading if it is marketed to retailers that way. When claiming on company assets, perpetual bond has the least priority.

They clearly stated this...

"Investors should note that the Securities are perpetual in nature and, unlike plain vanilla bonds, do not have a fixed redemption date. Investors will only receive all or part of their investment amount if the Securities are (i) redeemed at the option of the Issuer in accordance with the Terms and Conditions, in which case investors should receive the principal amount, together with distribution accrued (if any) or (ii) sold in the open market at the prevailing market price, in which case the investor may incur losses if the proceeds from the sale is less than the original investment. In addition, investors should also note that, as with typical perpetual capital securities, payment of distributions under the Securities may also be deferred for an indefinite period and investors have no recourse to the Issuer if such deferral is made in accordance with the Terms and Conditions."

People choose not to read the OIS and invest their hard earned money...Legally they are not even misled...If they feel that they have a case, they would have already taken legal actions against whoever they think they have a strong case against...
 

Merg91

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Approved by MAS & SGX.
DBS said so too & not found guilty.

The fault is us.

Perpetual bonds should not be even called bonds, very misleading if it is marketed to retailers that way. When claiming on company assets, perpetual bond has the least priority.
 

BBCWatcher

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Approved by MAS & SGX.
DBS said so too & not found guilty.
The MAS doesn't approve securities offered for sale. It can offer its disapproval, maybe, but that’s it.

The SGX only handled the aftermarket trading of these securities. The initial placement isn’t through the SGX. The SGX has only very basic, cursory rules about what it’ll accept for listing, such as periodic financial reports (that the SGX does not routinely audit or even necessarily read).

DBS sold these securities, but investors had to click through or press through stern warnings about risks and acknowledge that they read the offering information. Heck, there’s a stern warning when buying SSBs, which is hilarious.

They clearly stated this...
They did indeed, but let’s assume a Hyflux investor foolishly didn’t read anything except “6%!!!!” What on earth did they imagine to be a 6% coupon note in a ~1.5% yielding government bond interest environment? Risk free? Low risk? All you had to do was look at the promised yield! There was/is absolutely no special analytical skill required here. That number told you all you needed to know about how extremely risky these notes were. They were offered at about quadruple the yield of government bonds!

Yes, OK, the regulatory environment in Singapore is too lax, and for no good reason. In many jurisdictions DBS and Hyflux would not have been legally permitted to sell these notes to retail investors. Perpetuals are illegal in many jurisdictions, and low minimum unrated bonds/notes (i.e. retail denominations) are also often illegal. The same should be true in Singapore, in my view. If anything this nonsense is holding back the development of reasonable bond funds for retail investors. (MBH is OK, but it could be better.) And Hyflux investors have my sympathies. But, good grief, 6%!
 
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dreamwork7878

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Maybank is making huge profits from other business sector
to the tune of billions.

Yet it stress hyflux and wanting to liquidate it.


And when unplesant things happens these banks are
on the front line and they can collect their money back
when they are making to the tune of billions.

They used their internal resources their corporate lawyers to
create stress on business unit. with no additional charges.
Overtime, from corporate lawyers etc all as if free.



while the retailer who made loan to hyflux we
stood right behind the lines and to get hair cuts
and lose it all.

why is our system so unfair ?


Banks money is money.
Retail money is not money ?

retail money . It is also in Singapore dollar SGD loan to hyflux.

we ask you why ? why such unfair rules ?

senior not senior ? why
rules and clause are created by human.

you did this to us.


The whole list of banks who made loans to hyflux they are making to the tune of billions in profits. If the banks are to take it individually and write it off or do a impairment charges and amortize it over a few quarter. Such loss is going to be peanuts to the banks. yet they chose to create stress to hyflux and affect the retailer who has the highest amount of loans to hyflux.
So many old folks are affected .

The banks have other business, credit cards, home loan, digital banking, investment, wealth banking, insurance, syndicate loans etc...
they have a full spectrum of business to cover back their losses.
But did they made loss, they are making billions in profits.


Now For a very small amount of money to get back our money , these bank chose to fight with the retailer.


who is more greedy , we ask you ?

But for the retailer, we are wipe out


maybank1.jpg


maybank2.jpg
 
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coolhead

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Maybank is making huge profits from other business sector
to the tune of billions.

Yet it stress hyflux and wanting to liquidate it.


And when unplesant things happens these banks are
on the front line and they can collect their money back
when they are making to the tune of billions.

They used their internal resources their corporate lawyers to
create stress on business unit. with no additional charges.
Overtime, from corporate lawyers etc all as if free.



while the retailer who made loan to hyflux they
stood right behind the lines and to get hair cuts
and lose it all.

why is our system so unfair ?


Banks money is money.
Retail money is not money ?

retail money . It is also in Singapore dollar SGD.

we ask you why ? why such unfair rules ?

senior not senior ? why
rules and clause are created by human.

you did this to us.





maybank1.jpg


maybank2.jpg
Bro, you got make profits also right?

Sent from HMD Global TA-1004 using GAGT
 

weng0202

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Bro, you got make profits also right?

Sent from HMD Global TA-1004 using GAGT

Lost capital, end up lost more than gain. Actually if he can find out so much about the banks profit, maybe he should have just invested in those banks. Haha
 

Merg91

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Maybank makes $$$$$ in other investments is irrelevant.

Banks are not Santa Claus.
Banks are your friends ONLY if you have $$.
 
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