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Old 17-06-2017, 04:09 PM   #166
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[QUOTE=WussRedXLi;108672039]Not really, many standard systems rely on the water pressure as per design (basic). However there are RO booster pumps which pump up the PSI of the water so that it works "better" in areas which have lower water pressure.
That's why tripleg bro was asking about his 40 PSI thingy earlier.

The Xiaomi unit claims to have a special DOW GE RO membranes that provides enough water flow just on typical water city pressures, so that even a storage tank is unneeded. Check the video in the previous page to look at how fast is the filtered water flowrate at the faucet.

Do You Need a Booster Pump?

Most city water reverse osmosis users have enough city water pressure to run their RO unit nicely and they do not need a booster pump. For example, if your city water pressure is 60 psi or more, there is little to be gained by adding a booster pump. If your pressure is 50 psi or less, however, a pressure boost pump will give your RO unit more zip. You'll have more water, at a higher pressure, in the storage tank, and the tank will fill faster. The increased pressure will also improve the economy of the unit (it will run less reject water to drain) as well as the quality of the water. RO units thrive on pressure.


That's right most countries doesnt have an issue with water pressure, easily hitting 60 psi. Singapore is pretty bad, some houses just have 25 psi. Which is why most RO water filter system which is very popular in other countries does not have an issue with water pressure. When it comes to Singapore, water pressure is an issue.

An electrical booster pump is strong and can increase water pressure up to 30 psi or more. But Singapore under sink doesnt have an electrical point which requires additional money to install one. There is a non electrical water pump called a permeate pump that uses the waster water generated to turn the turbines to create energy and increase water pressure. However, at max it can only increase water pressure by 20 psi. Most RO water filter system needs at least 40 psi to be effective.

It is not that Xiaomi RO can work with low water pressure, it still requires around 40 psi. But it has an internal electrical water booster, which can turn our Singapore water pressure of 25 psi to more than 40 psi easily.
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Old 17-06-2017, 04:22 PM   #167
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Actually i also don't know that small black thingy is a pump or a very small reservoir tank or what........ heh.

RMB 1299 faucet countertop ver
PS. No need to install the Xiaomi app. It's just for filter life reporting. No real use.


Yup there is definitely an electrical booster inside the box, which explains the need for an electrical point. Most singaporeans do not want an electrical point at under sink although it should not be that dangerous. It is a bit weird that he never connects the waste water directly into the drainage pipe. If it goes to a tub, isnt that very troublesome?
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Old 17-06-2017, 04:46 PM   #168
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my blk is pretty old though, the same utensils dont seem to rust at my parent's hse but mine does. Also after bathing, there is a brownish tint on the wall from the water.
Interesting......i tot such things don't happen in SG. If you want me to make a guess, that brown stain is due to Iron III oxide, which is safe to consume.
My parents HDB house is from 1972, no such issue. Might have a bit of difference in the piping use? (somewhat unlikely though). Looks like a fair bit of the passivation layer is coming off.


It's very difficult to know for sure w/o a full chemical water test. Seriously i also don't know what's in there, but i guess the easiest/cheapest to do is to start from basics of filtration. But that's for drinking mainly, and maybe for washing.


Unless if you are consuming markedly visible brown water (which would taste absolutely metallic as well) which leads to iron toxicity, there is no issue.....coz i don't think anyone can stomach that kind of brown water under normal circumstances anyway.

Most pax here would have seen the water after a water tank flush or the town council subcon is fixing your main plumbing at your main riser, or when the main tank runs dry and the town council take remedial steps to correct (happened before in my block, 5 times, definitely some bugger screwed up with the equipment), then you'd really see tokong levels of brown water for quite a few minutes.

In that case, to take out that particulate iron oxide, just run a 1 micron PP sediment filter. It's simple, if you wish to try something, do this first as it's cheap enough (Taobao probably doesn't cost more than 20 dollars). You don't need to do a dual stage with 1 micron PP and then 0.01 micron Ultrafiltration (Taobao also have), not really practical for washing leh.


http://www.pbwatersoftening.com/what...ub-and-toilet/


I googled and also found this, not sure if it could be a more chronic issue but at lower levels for ya.... if the water has been flowing good, no issue.
Even "lead" leaching from brass plumbing is not an issue if the water has been flowing very good. It really depends on a lot of factors, not only in your own unit but also depending on your block.




Another case of water stagnation, in a Boat Quay Residence condo.
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Old 17-06-2017, 04:49 PM   #169
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Also.....I remember that time when i moved into my new BTO block, the water was undrinkable without filtration for a good number of weeks if not months (I for sure didn't know how long an issue it presented, just went to self-fix to get a 0.5 microns solid carbon block faucet filter).

Coz the key collection was done in stages, and we moved in quite early (ie whole floor, i was the only unit there for 3 months as the others underwent reno, also for the other units on other floors).
Some here would have gone through the same.....

Minerals and whatever stuff inside don't say....but the most marked taste/odour was that of cement/concrete.

Wasn't that clear also, if you were to shine a high powered green laser pointer through it, it'd glow very brightly. Definitely many many magnitudes brighter than my current tap water (8 years later) if i'm to do the same quickie test. And yes, for sure i let the water sit and rest for quite a while first for any microscopic bubbles due to water agitation to escape.


That is the main reason why i got my Instapure F8 faucet filter. It was extremely difficult to drink the tap water. And iirc, they also did a couple of system flushes, that's what i heard in the lift from the small talk, but my wife/I weren't present at home so we didn't go through it. So no, it 99% probably wasn't 心里作用 as other neighbours also talked about it esp those with babies or pregnant。


ie my brand new block is worse than my parent's old 1972 block which is 45 years old.

That's probably older than many of the guys here.

So it really depends, these stagnation thingys. *shrugs*
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Old 17-06-2017, 05:11 PM   #170
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Yup there is definitely an electrical booster inside the box, which explains the need for an electrical point. Most singaporeans do not want an electrical point at under sink although it should not be that dangerous. It is a bit weird that he never connects the waste water directly into the drainage pipe. If it goes to a tub, isnt that very troublesome?
Oh...that explains it then. So there is a built in booster pump, hence not needing a tank. I think they said that the RO membrane is also something special, designed for higher flowrate. So that's why the output flowrate actually is pretty decent from the looks of it. (actually better than quite a few faucet type mini filters)


Well too bad the countertop model does not suit you. Coz for me i like countertop models. My sink is the normal stainless steel one, doesn't have those pre-cut holes (granite sinks?) in which you can easily punch through with just a screwdriver + hammer. POP a few times and out it comes within a few seconds.

Countertop models with faucet connection also have 1 big advantage....esp for those 10-inch housings. That means that the pressure is going through the system only when you flip the faucet switch to FILTER and then turn on the tap. So even if there is a leak anywhere, it'd be detected + limited in damage. There are many home floods reported with undersink models due to failed plumbing hardware, even on Amazon with brand name 3M supplied stuff. It's bound to happen with those push-in quick connects that are plastic. Coz for those systems taking water from a T-adapter, the water pressure is always ON.
So do take that into consideration. There is a risk, however small, that it'd damage your expensive kitchen cabs.


PS. Well, can re-use the RO flushed drainage water mah. Like flushing the toilet, watering plants etc. But if forget to clear, then yeah it'd definitely and totally screw up the cabinets (the wood panels would expand, 100% goner)
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Old 17-06-2017, 05:30 PM   #171
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It is not that Xiaomi RO can work with low water pressure, it still requires around 40 psi. But it has an internal electrical water booster, which can turn our Singapore water pressure of 25 psi to more than 40 psi easily.

I see, i think i know what is with the whole picture already.

1. Xiaomi RO system has a booster pump. So that definitely helps.

2. I think there is still possibly a slight modification or special specification with regards to the cartridge. Or maybe not modification, just that they spec it to be a very large cartridge.
And the design of it is quite compact than the competition (just look at the other undersink myraid of 10-inch and T33 housings on top of the mounting rack! )
So that is why they do not need a water reservoir holding tank but can produce a good enough flowrate for filtered water on-demand dispensing.

I'd guesstimate it to be approx 1L per minute flowrate from the XMM demo.

Check 4:00 min in the youtube vid.....they mentioned the "special modified RO membrane" that's where i got the info about "modified RO membrane".

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Old 17-06-2017, 05:36 PM   #172
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Just for reference.....i don't think most would be looking at such a product.

But very few nanofiltration (0.001 microns) stuff out there.

超滤膜 = ultrafiltration
纳滤膜 = nanofiltration


This is by Haier 海尔, a very major appliance manufacturer in China.


This replaces the need for a Tiger/Zojirushi hot water flask, which would cost $100 anyway.


https://world.tmall.com/item/5468026...=3470900174153

Nanofiltration. 0.001 microns (1 nanometer) absolute pore size. Technically is no need to boil.

The various quality/types of nanofiltration membranes in the market have the ability to reduce fluoride ions as well (our flouride levels in our tap water is somewhat below WHO levels already, so shd not be any issue).


Ultrafiltration cannot remove fluoride.


















Eg this is a typical RO unit. Majority of ultrafiltration (0.01 microns) models are also like this

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Old 17-06-2017, 06:48 PM   #173
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Actually Singapore water contains fluoride which is not mainstream known but there are .....
My story is mainly lead.

Coz i know the story myself, unfortunately.

When my new BTO came 8 years ago, when the pumbler came to do the sink and pipes, i asked him whether the stuff is legit ok or not, coz i wanted stainless steel ones. Now as we know, stainless steel is good stuff, expensive yes but it's good. I know the water pipes outside my house in the riser and tanks and all i cannot control, but that is different coz that's the MAIN water pipe/route and mostly has running water ie constantly flushed due to usage by other families. And of coz I trust that all are controlled by PUB code of practice/best practices whatever.

He mentioned all brass fittings which he is using no need PUB approval one. Automaically is SAFE as it's not lead fitting.
And we cannot use lead solder/lead pipes here, which is of course common sense. Sounds well and believable, right?


The good thing is that i was using the Instapure F8 which is NSF 53 certified for lead since we moved in, before my 2 kids came. The story i just shared is that we wanted to remove that concrete/cement taste and smell in our tap water which persisted for the first few months.

As regards to lead : My wife and I no issue, all grown up already, can't do anything.
But like i posted before, kids are different coz of their neurodevelopment (no debates needed, it affects can affect that as well as IQ, it's all laid out bare without any doubt at all by the WHO and all the health orgs).


You can read this. Supposedly lead-free brass faucets/fittings used in the University of North Carolina.
https://www.sciencenews.org/blog/sci...s-are-anything

And of coz my recent post in this thread, data collected with locally Singapore sourced "lead-free" local authority approved brass faucets. Levels around the same ballpark for stagnation periods of 1 day, 3 days, 7 days.
http://forums.hardwarezone.com.sg/10...8-post104.html


Another good read by a SP lecturer in environmental science regarding water testing here. He has got several other good posts. But do note, the latest 2016 report includes most of those stuff that he has written.

https://waterqualityinsingapore.blog...port-2011.html


Still, it must be said that with < 12hr water stagnation periods in the home esp for the kitchen faucet where we usually fill our water, the risk is quite low.....unless you have gone on a tour, ie stagnation period = days.

However, due to kids, i think i'd feel better with a NSF-53 certified with lead reduction filter. Anyway, it's really cheap. The cheapest device i listed is just 13 bucks and free ship. An extra value meal at Mcdonald's could cost more than the replacement filter cartridge which is good for 3 months 100 gallons. And actually the NSF 53 certified list is much longer than just lead, it includes many other disinfection by products and also other heavy metals etc. This water filter device/cartridge cost is somemore shared among 4 of us, wife + 2 kids.


It's really a no-brainer to get one, Unfortunately folks still say repeatedly it's waste money getting such a thing because PUB water is good ( note : i never said it was bad)....but goes out chomping on junk/fast food etc daily in which 1 meal costs more than 1 cartridge.
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Old 17-06-2017, 07:26 PM   #174
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WussRedXLi,

The Haier one for its price it is not bad. If you look at similar Singapore models easily at least 1000 as this comes with hot and cold water dispenser. I dont know if this is true, but below is what I found out about nanofiltration which is becoming more well known.

Nanofiltration is sometimes used to recycle wastewater, as it offers higher flux rates and uses less energy than a reverse osmosis system.The design and operation of nanofiltration is very similar to that of reverse osmosis, with some differences. The major difference is that the nano membrane is not as "tight" as the reverse osmosis membrane. It operates at a lower feedwater pressure and it does not remove monovalent (i.e., those with a single charge or valence of one) ions from the water as effectively as the RO membrane.
While a RO membrane will typically remove 98-99% of monovalent ions, such as chlorides or sodium, a nanofiltration membrane typically removes 50% to 90%, depending on the material and manufacture of the membrane. Because of its ability to effectively remove di and trivalent ions, nanofiltration is frequently used to remove hardness from water while leaving the total dissolved solids content much less affected than would RO. For this reason it has been called the "softening membrane". Nanofiltration is often used to filter water with low amounts of total dissolved solids, to remove organic matter and soften water.
Because it is a "looser membrane", nanofiltration membranes are less likely to foul or scale and require less pretreatment than RO. Sometimes it is even used as pretreatment to RO. Nanofiltration can be employed in a variety of water and wastewater treatment industries for the cost-effective removal of ions and organic substances.
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Old 17-06-2017, 10:38 PM   #175
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Bruh, thanks for sharing info regarding water filters. Always enjoyed reading your posts.

Could you kindly recommend the lead water filter again? There's a lot of info.
.....

You mentioned there's something that's certified for a low cost? I can't bring the air purifier and water filter back from China as it's a shared purchase with my colleagues and besides the water filter takes up a fair bit of space which my flat does not have.

Thanks again.

Don't mind, i post here for sharing of info....

Details are on post 108, page 8.

Summary :

The cheapest are the faucet based ones. All the devices are NSF 53 certified for lead reduction (amongst other stuff)

100 gallons = 378 litres
Search on Amazon.com (read the reviews)
-Culligan FM-15 (uses 200 gal 756L cartridge)
-Dupont faucet filters (various models, 100 gal or 200 gal cartridge)
-Pur advanced faucet filters (100 gal)
-Brita faucet filter (100 gal)
-Aquasana AQ-4000 countertop filter (450 gal)
All the above contain very high quality highly spec solid carbon block filters that take care of many of the contaminants. Size of the product does not determine whether or not the filter is better. The only issue with the above is that the xxx number of gallons filtered is lower than the bigger filters (eg the 10-inch canister filters).

- 3M Filtrete Under Sink Water Filtration System (3US-MAX-S01). 1500 gals 5670 litres. Probably better for those big families and also intends to use filtered water (no chlorine/chloramines) for washing their veg etc.



Yes, whenever possible, can use stainless steel fittings, stainless steel faucets if you can. Apparently even the lead-free brass stuff sourced locally approved ones possibly have pretty significant spikes above the WHO limit (10 ug/L). Is that high/risky or not, i don't know but i'm not sitting around to find out for my kids even though for myself i don't really care.
You should too for your pregnant wife and baby when he/she's borned.



If use those xxx and yyy china sourced stuff without certification, like so many people buying from Taobao nowadays, normal yellow brass, don't say liao. (not saying all MIC TB stuff are bad)


BTW, TB stuff really got super good and super bad stuff. Just recently in the aircon cleaning thread, one guy gotten a bad 12V power adapter (powering the water diaphragm pressure pump for aircon washing), the power adapter blew, tripped the MCB and ELCB, and also blew his microwave oven with sparks and flames.
Some other folks gotten 12V 5A power adapters to power their 100W pumps. The sellers/TB factories sometimes really anyhow one.
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Old 18-06-2017, 09:43 AM   #176
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Read on Amazon reviews that it's better to change the compression O ring of the 10-inch housing occasionally, maybe once every year. To prevent leaks.


Or you can search for others.
Take part of the title and seach.
10寸20寸防水圈 密封圈 O型圈 过滤瓶 滤桶橡胶圈 净水器配件垫圈

https://item.taobao.com/item.htm?spm...d=526144688402

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Old 18-06-2017, 11:20 AM   #177
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Food Expo water filter

Saw this product in the coming food expo.

www_watchwater.com.sg/

Usual price: 933
Event price: 793

Although, they say it is better than all similar filtration system out there, I dont see anything that is significantly more effective. This again proves that water filter in Singapore is extremely overpriced.
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Old 18-06-2017, 03:44 PM   #178
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Saw this product in the coming food expo.

www_watchwater.com.sg/

Usual price: 933
Event price: 793

Although, they say it is better than all similar filtration system out there, I dont see anything that is significantly more effective. This again proves that water filter in Singapore is extremely overpriced.

Nothing is new regarding online vs local retail lah, esp for products of such genre.....can't compare like that. MLM esp those on "holistic medicine" takes the cake.

It's for those folks who just have the disposable income to spend (be it their are rich or they are just normal 打功仔) and never bother to do homework.


That's why you see pax in this thread or other similar threads on water filters, air purifiers are kum gong snake oil at first glance.
To be fair, my wife was one such pax, until the 2013 short term super-spike PSI 401 haze and 2015 prolonged high-level haze hit. My parents esp my father has allergic rhinitis and is especially affected by headaches, then he knew the important of the FFP-1, N95, HEPA air filters that i have slowly built-up. I'm also an allergic rhinitis and headache sufferer with haze, my wife is worse will get migrane with air pollution and one of the worst episode affected was when she was in China Beijing, in which it triggered a bad one and needed A&E care.


The recurrent costs lagi better for some of these products. I always take note of such things and source suitable workable replacements at the cheapest price.


Last time no Taobao fwd no Amazon FSSG worse.


Same thing with vacuum cleaners (Dolphin comes to mind)....good stuff (Philips) on Taobao with H12 exhuast filters for cheap.
Maybe even electric toothbrush, water flossers....many would say no use don't bother without even thinking (yes there's an electric toothbrush / oral health thread here). Anyway, an eg, Oral B Pro 600, 8800 oscillations + 20k pulsations, only SGD 25 shipping included when tagging onto an existing order.
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Old 19-06-2017, 05:11 PM   #179
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selling espring ?
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Old 19-06-2017, 05:21 PM   #180
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Chloramine in tap water is inactivated by the mammalian digestive process.
It however is lethal for our fishy friends - and also for dialysis patients if the chemical directly enters the bloodstream.
Aging the water in a clean pail for 5 days will remove chlorine and chloramine. The aged water is good enough for fish and shrimps. No need for expensive setup.

I know because i keep fish and shrimps. All the water in both tanks come for the above mentioned aging process.

Also, Vitamine C can remove chloramine from tap water immediately.

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