Will minimum wage laws work here?

[Kaypohji]

It’s about demand and supply.

A new owner setting up shop. he sees got 100 customers buying so he increases price.

But now with the customers being lesser as foreigners left, only 50 ppl is buying from him.

So he want to attract ppl he will decrease to price of the rice now.

If u look at the industry as the whole, if too many sellers than buyers, some will be driven out of the market to sell other things etc

Let's see say ShopA sells rice for $5.

It has 100 customers per day: 50 SG, 50 foreigners.

It makes $5x100= $500 revenue per day.

Govt sends all 50 foreigners home.

ShopA has 50 SG customers per day.

Will it sell $5x50= $250 revenue per day?
Or lower like $4?

 

[Kaypohji]

Agree with you.

But government has never given us a proper analysis of why they think minimum wage don’t work.

Maybe they think no point explaining to us so much?

Not expert, do enlightened, don't quite get the reason for cost of living rising. Prices are already increasing regardless of minimum wage or not, why then single out minimum wage to blame, when it hasn't is really so.

Spoiler

Some more no one say how much is minimum wage, so what't the worry without the cause first. Its up to the system to decide, and nobody decide anything yet. But think given local pattern, won't be surprised it would be not much different from current or quite low that it doesn't matter.

And think cause minimum wage is the least can pay, but in a competitive economy many people will tend get more than that, won't even see minimum wage is what. So minimum wage or not won't affect them much.

Those that may be affected are those really low level who could be underpaid, which minimum wage may help them get more. But those low level the work they do at that kind of pay think won't impact most people much. What's wrong with giving them a little more then.

Spoiler

Thus from certain perspectives, think its quite funny those high paying some with the work they do may not deserve it but not many would kpkp. But those lower level take little do alot, just give them a little more many kpkb.

 

[fox1]

He can sell at whatever price as long as he can survive with lower demand. The market is very efficience one and will adjust by itself. If demand drop and he can maintain the price new players may join in. If he can not survive he will find some other biz to do.

If market is efficient, why doesn't it adjust itself when there are foreigners?

 

[fox1]

Capitalism is Darwinism.

I watch this stupid Justin Timberlake movie once called in time,where time is currency.....there's this quote in the movie.....for few to be immortal,many must die.

And then there's capitalism in Singapore....u know how it is easier for singaporeans to swallow the capitalism pill,first we convince ourselves and dehumanise them by telling ourselves,these people are from third world countries,it's ok to pay them next to peanuts,after all they come from shyt holes,when they go back they will have mansions and farms waiting for them....
But if it's singaporeans who are being exploited?even then I think sinkies will still take it in stride lol,they will just tell themselves they are exercising,or they are low educated,bus drivers,toilet cleaners,dishwashers are human trash,they deserve it.

I can see you were earnest and sincere in your reply.
Unfortunately, I cannot make sense of it.

 

[mp4005 help]

If market is efficient, why doesn't it adjust itself when there are foreigners?

theories don't really work in real life .. i study economics and i don't see it happening in real life.

 

[Goddofinga]

how about kill off the SME owners with kampong mindset?

Like that companies will use market rate to pay fairly instead of treating youngsters as coolies ( bring the present and treating it the same as their coolie generation).

So that new management all younger people with someguidances from slightly older gen X people.


Or else minimum wages will get many hoo ha and complains from associations which are all made up of baby boomers. sure complain and kpkb to government one and singapore government must listen to these associations one... bo bian.

There u go.

summary TLR:

Government and singapore business owners are all baby boomers and there will be NO minimum wage in singapore ever.

 

[fox1]

It’s about demand and supply.

A new owner setting up shop. he sees got 100 customers buying so he increases price.

But now with the customers being lesser as foreigners left, only 50 ppl is buying from him.

So he want to attract ppl he will decrease to price of the rice now.

If u look at the industry as the whole, if too many sellers than buyers, some will be driven out of the market to sell other things etc

Can ok.
So he decreases price of rice.
Cost of doing business remains the same.

Previously revenue $500, now $250.
Reduce price, even less revenue.

How does decreasing price make up for the shortfall in revenue and ensure viability of business?

 

[Kaypohji]

Reduce prices is to attract more buyers.

If the pool of buyers is fixed, then some sellers will definitely have to be driven out of the market.

And they will have to do smth else. As simple as that.

Can ok.
So he decreases price of rice.
Cost of doing business remains the same.

Previously revenue $500, now $250.
Reduce price, even less revenue.

How does decreasing price make up for the shortfall in revenue and ensure viability of business?

 

[Goddofinga]

Capitalism is Darwinism.

I watch this stupid Justin Timberlake movie once called in time,where time is currency.....there's this quote in the movie.....for few to be immortal,many must die.

And then there's capitalism in Singapore....u know how it is easier for singaporeans to swallow the capitalism pill,first we convince ourselves and dehumanise them by telling ourselves,these people are from third world countries,it's ok to pay them next to peanuts,after all they come from shyt holes,when they go back they will have mansions and farms waiting for them....
But if it's singaporeans who are being exploited?even then I think sinkies will still take it in stride lol,they will just tell themselves they are exercising,or they are low educated,bus drivers,toilet cleaners,dishwashers are human trash,they deserve it.

you're right. Singaporeans are too proud to do all these jobs. SME baby boomer owner will tell you how hard they worked when they were young.. but the hardest is the generation before the baby boomers ( WW2 Era) . That is the hardest era and baby boomers are just making use of old money and holding power.

TL : DR , If your parents are taxi drivers or in other monthly wages job, and if they dont own any businesses, u as the next gen, are nothing in singapore, unless u get scholarship straight As, CCA captain, taken 3 voluntary internship and score a job in government sector.

 

[frenchbriefs]

I can see you were earnest and sincere in your reply.
Unfortunately, I cannot make sense of it.

What do u not understand so I can better clarify.

I guess my main point is capitalism can only work if it exploits others below u,and those that are living at the bottom or near the bottom 30,40 percent live in relative hell.

 

[mp4005 help]

you're right. Singaporeans are too proud to do all these jobs. SME baby boomer owner will tell you how hard they worked when they were young.. but the hardest is the generation before the baby boomers ( WW2 Era) . That is the hardest era and baby boomers are just making use of old money and holding power.

TL : DR , If your parents are taxi drivers or in other monthly wages job, and if they dont own any businesses, u as the next gen, are nothing in singapore, unless u get scholarship straight As, CCA captain, taken 3 voluntary internship and score a job in government sector.

asian countries is all about face value and boasting to their family members and friends.

it is just an asian culture problem ..

 

[fox1]

theories don't really work in real life .. i study economics and i don't see it happening in real life.

There's no magic pill like minimum wage.
Minimum wage will likely increase cost of running business or increase unemployment rate or increase price or a mix.
Market will adjust, most likely killing the small players.

 

[Entry Level PC]

Nobody wants to be service staff, technicians and many similar jobs.

Do u think the country should implement minimum wages ?

The argument against this is that cost of living will go up... but u can refuse to buy.

Let’s say they increase the price of goods X then the market can buy lesser of it or not buy. Supply and demand will dictate how much they can charge ultimately.

But if you keep insisting buying when they increase price, who else can you blame ?

And let’s see now, despite the cost of wages of these ppl are low, we all see that cost of living and other goods and services are all increasing prices too regardless !

IQ0
Min Wage then your maid 2-3k a month?

 

[cal127]

Agree with you.

But government has never given us a proper analysis of why they think minimum wage don’t work.

Maybe they think no point explaining to us so much?

You can object to the govt's position or opposition to doing anything but letting the markets proceed on their merry ways. The markets are made as the result of decisions by people and being flawed, the markets can reflect that resulting in dysfunctional outcomes. After all, we work so that we can make enough money to take care of ourselves and our families. If the market is subverted (i.e., crony capitalism) then you have to take corrective states before something overblown as silly as socialism begins to sound good to a lot of the electorate... or maybe its what they wanted. As someone said in the past - the only problem with capitalism is capitalists.

 

[Chromesthlesia]

Very common question...

Keynesian economics has explored that option before. Minimum wages actually causes more unemployment than more benefits.

E.g. USA wanted Macdonalds to impose a minimum wage of $12 usd? for their F&B. Their response was to cut cashier jobs and produce self-help touch screen kiosks. Yes, the very same self-help costs.

 

[Chromesthlesia]

There's no magic pill like minimum wage.
Minimum wage will likely increase cost of running business or increase unemployment rate or increase price or a mix.
Market will adjust, most likely killing the small players.

Yes keynesian economics...

If you study the A level textbooks, Paul Krugman* and other keynesian economics have explored that before.

Minimum wages removes the job for the human and causes unemployment.

 

[Kaypohji]

Then don’t hire maid. Then u will reply families will die without maid right ?

U can employ part time cleaners which is common now and that don’t cost 2-3k a month. U don’t need 24 hours standby service in your house right ?

I bet u r those who go army need maid to carry your bag or next time your son will be

IQ0
Min Wage then your maid 2-3k a month?

 

[Kaypohji]

I thought we are already going for self help kiosks ?

Because we don’t have enough labor !

Very common question...

Keynesian economics has explored that option before. Minimum wages actually causes more unemployment than more benefits.

E.g. USA wanted Macdonalds to impose a minimum wage of $12 usd? for their F&B. Their response was to cut cashier jobs and produce self-help touch screen kiosks. Yes, the very same self-help costs.

 

[livingcharsiew]

why we cannot be like japan?
locals work construction worker

 

[fox1]

Reduce prices is to attract more buyers.

If the pool of buyers is fixed, then some sellers will definitely have to be driven out of the market.

And they will have to do smth else. As simple as that.

Ok reduce price to attract more customers.

So let's say 100 more SG customers: total 150 SG customers.

Reduce price to $4.

So $4x150 = $600 revenue

Revenue increase 20%.
Workload increase 50% due to more customers.

Need to hire worker at minimum wage.
Is the business sustainable or better to close down?