HWZ Forums

Login Register FAQ Mark Forums Read

Surge Protector

Like Tree5Likes
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
Old 27-08-2010, 12:49 PM   #61
Master Member
 
SKinny86's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Posts: 2,719
Seriously a UPS makes a lot more sense... but it is not cheap, frankly it is big, heavy and take up space.... Or else I definitely want one.... I have suffered loss of data due to HDD crashing when power trip happens or blackout.....
lol i must stress that this kind of incident of crash due to trip happens most of the time. My previous company had a trip before, and the pc I used did not have any surge protector or ups. Ended up the windows crashed and have to format the whole pc. :\ sibei jialat
SKinny86 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 28-08-2010, 11:09 AM   #62
Arch-Supremacy Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 17,691
I had my router power adaptor burned out twice!

this was caused by the HDB block shutting down electricity (power outage) for maintainence and then they turn it on again.

After the block power was turned on, the power adaptor stopped working.

Does anyonw know a wat to prevent this from happening in future?

I not want to protect from lightning or watever, just protect from a possible surge when the block power is turned on after maintainenece and caused damage to teh power adaptor of my router...
any suggestion or tips for this problem? thanks! this is a real problem i am facing
__________________
cb, why no panda one??
Marill is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 28-08-2010, 11:26 AM   #63
Arch-Supremacy Member
 
coyote's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2000
Posts: 16,384
Cool. You does sounds like you know your stuffs well.

I probably belongs in between those that 'believe what you you are told' & 'question what is reality'. Thing is, I cannot be the expert in all field to excel in understanding 'lighting strike' vs how effective 'surge protector' works.

I agree with you that Surge Protector is much less needed in Singapore when 80% population live in HDB flats with a centralized as well as better surge protection against lightning. Also, telephone lines in Singapore are buried in ground.

I use Belkin in my mum's place in Malaysia. Of course, mainly because choosing to 'conveniently' believing in what they claimed. If you can give me more & better advice, I am all ears.

In Malaysia, most people stays in terrace house, meaning, electrical surge protection is within each house. And it seemed my mum's house circuit breaker will be activated from time to time during lightning strike. So, electrical protection seemed to working.

Next, telephone lines in Malaysia is exposed on telephone poles. That is the best part, it catches lightning & the energy surge all the way to the phone lines in the house & continue to go into the telephone, the modem & 'BAM'! It melted the phone lines & killed the modem & router.

So, I have the Belkin protecting the telephone line & TV antenna now.

Seemed like, my mum didn't see any charred telephone line or dead modem for a long while... should I guess the Belkin Surge protector strip is working? I hope & choose to think so.

Let me know any other better solution than this. Thanks.

Sorry, I am no expert in electricity & didn't read through your whole explanation. That's why I am in between those 'conveniently' choose to believe & those 'hope to know more' category. Thanks.





You can immediately identify those who only repeat what they are told to believe. Who never ask questions. Who do not even know what the product does.

How does a 2 cm part inside that Belkin or APC stop what three miles of sky could not? It does not. How do its hundreds of joules absorb destructive surges that are hundreds of thousands of joules? It does not. Why do its numeric specs not even list protection from each type of surge? It is sold to people who automatically believe what they are told. Never ask why. Never demand numbers. Only believe the first thing they are told. Can also be sold the Brooklyn Bridge.

Surge protection has worked and been well proven even 100 years ago. Would earth direct lightning strikes so that operators never remove headsets and leave the room. And then is a scam that does not even claim surge protection in its numeric specs. Take a $3 power strip. Add some ten cent protector parts. Sell it for $25 or $150. Many will recommend the same protector selling for $150 only because it costs more money.

Your telco's switching computer in every CO is connected to overhead wires all over town. Suffers about 100 surges with each thunderstorm. Money is never wasted on scam protectors such as the Belkin or APC. Instead telcos use vastly cheaper protectors that earth even direct lightning strikes ... and remain functional.

Remember, if Belkin, et al grossly undersizes a protector. then the protector will completely fail - provide zero protection. That failure gets the most naive to recommend it. Effective protectors for every home earth direct lightning strikes – and remain functional.

Serious protection already exists inside every appliance. A surge too small to harm any appliances can destroy a scam protector. That failure promotes sales – especially among consumers who are not thinking. Effective protectors for much less money remain functional.

Your concern is a rare surge that typically occurs once every seven years. That surge can overwhelm protection inside appliances. That surge cannot be stopped, blocked, or absorbed by an adjacent protector. The effective solution was even patented over 100 years ago. Used in every telco CO, munitions dumps, and commercial broadcasting station so that numerous direct lightning strikes cause no damage. That same protector is installed in every house for about $1 per protected appliance. And is sold by far more responsible companies such as General Electric, Siemens, Square D, Polyphaser, ABB, Intermatic, and Leviton - to name but a few responsible companies. An effective Cutler-Hammer solution sells in Lowes and Home Depot for less than $50.

No, you still do not have surge protection. Those are only protectors. What Belkin and APC hope you never learn: a protector and protection are two completely different items. 'Whole house' protectors from responsible companies have the always required and dedicated wire to earth. A wire that must be short (ie 'less than 10 meters). Not just to any ground; single point earth ground. The protector connect destructive surges harmlessly to the only thing that does protection – single point eareth ground.

Belkin, APC, and the master of all scams (Monster) will not discuss earth ground. If they did, you would never buy their products. And you would spend less money. Effective protectors earth direct lightning strikes without damage. Even the protector remains functional. But again, technology well proven and repeatedly demonstrated for over 100 years. Not a plug-in scam sold on retail myths.

You should have numerous questions. Especially if you were taken by Belkin, et al retail myths. This old and well proven technology is virtually unknown to an overwhelming majority educated only by retail advertising. Effective protection even from direct lightning strikes uses a protector that costs about $1 per protected appliance.
__________________
WTS: TPLink TL-WN8200ND & TL-WN822N Wireless-N300 High Gain USB Adapters. Self collect from XXX MRT.
coyote is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 28-08-2010, 11:50 PM   #64
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 94
I had my router power adaptor burned out twice!...
After the block power was turned on, the power adaptor stopped working.
Does anyonw know a wat to prevent this from happening in future?
Same thing that protects from lightning also protects your adaptor from that anomaly. A 'whole house' solution also costs less money per protected appliance. If AC anomalies harm an adaptor, then those events also threaten (overstress) everything else.

Any plug-in solution is already inside that adaptor. You have one solution that was routine even 100 years ago. So easy to understand as to be standard that long ago. Earth one 'whole house' protector.

View coyote's post. A perfect example of one who ignores posted facts that say that Belkin was wasted money. Promoted only by sales myths. His only protection is what is already inside every appliance. Do not make that mistake.

Your concern is a rare anomaly that typically occurs once every seven years. Your adaptor was damaged by that anomaly. Lightning is just another example of the same anomaly. A surge overwhelmed protection inside the adaptor. That surge cannot be stopped, blocked, or absorbed by an adjacent protector (ie Belkin). Effective solution was patented over 100 years ago. You need it for everything. And you only need one - for the adaptor and for everything else.

The adaptor was a ‘canary in the coalmine’. Heed the warning before so much more is harmed.

Last edited by westom; 29-08-2010 at 12:11 AM..
westom is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 21-02-2011, 03:21 AM   #65
Supremacy Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 7,797
So the conclusion?
awayaway is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 21-02-2011, 08:35 AM   #66
Supremacy Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2000
Posts: 6,234
During IT show, the cheapest no-frills Belkin 'surge protectors' cost about the same as a normal extension cord. They are a good deal.

The fancier Belkins with 2 LED lights, most shockingly consume 2w of power even if no appliance to plugged in. Low power LEDs are about 0.3w, so I have no idea where the 2w consumption come from. Furthermore (and I have 3 of the fancy Belkins with LED lights and 3 of the no-frills Belkin), if you touch them, they are slightly warmer than room temperature.

Fortunately, the fancier Belkins have a master switch, so I turn them off when not in use.

Anyway, best protection is to have a modern high quality circuit breaker and to spread the circuits across multiple fuse boxes.
limster is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 21-02-2011, 08:51 AM   #67
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 94
During IT show, the cheapest no-frills Belkin 'surge protectors' cost about the same as a normal extension cord. They are a good deal. ...
Anyway, best protection is to have a modern high quality circuit breaker and to spread the circuits across multiple fuse boxes.
Does an extension cord do this unfortunately too frequent occurrence? From Norma on 27 Dec 2008 in "The Power Outage":
> Today, the cable company came to replace a wire. Well the cable man pulled a wire and somehow
> yanked loose their "ground" wire. The granddaughter on the computer yelled and ran because
> sparks and smoke were coming from the power surge strip.

A surge too small to overwhelm protection in appliances can sometimes do that to a grossly undersized protector. That failure gets the naive to recommend it by assuming, "My protector sacrificed itself to save my electronics."

Sometimes protector components do not disconnect from a surge fast enough. Norma's experience and other house fires have resulted. Does an extension cord do that during a surge too small to harm appliances?

Those damning numbers again. How many hundreds of joules will the Belkin absorb (read its specs) when a surge is hundreds of thousands of joules?


Circuit breakers do not protect from a surge. A surge will increase voltage as necessary to blow through an open breaker. How high? That voltage number may be printed on the breaker. Furthermore, a surge is done doing damage in microseconds. A circuit breaker takes milliseconds or seconds to respond. Opens long after the surge has done damage and is gone. Obviously, no circuit breaker does surge protection. Those damning numbers that were, again, not provided.
westom is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 21-02-2011, 01:41 PM   #68
Master Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2000
Posts: 4,910
Effective solution was patented over 100 years ago. You need it for everything. And you only need one - for the adaptor and for everything else.
Can you show us what is this device you speak of? Your posts go on and on about them, but don't reveal the actual device.
chong is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22-02-2011, 02:00 PM   #69
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 94
Can you show us what is this device you speak of? Your posts go on and on about them, but don't reveal the actual device.
It's called a 'whole house' protector. Dumb simple and trivial science. Go to any electrical supply house. Ask for their 'whole house' protector. Then read what only matters. 1) It has a dedicated wire for the always required short connection to single point earth ground. 2) Is rated at least 50,000 amps so that 20,000 amp lightning strikes do not even harm the protector. 3) It mechanically fits.

I will never understand why that protector is so difficult when it is not that important. Requires so much discussion due to myths promoted by scam plug-in protectors. Unfotunately so many myths and outright lies were posted. Takes almost forever to unlearn them.

Your questions should have been endless about the important stuff. The *art*. Why ask about a simple dumb box that is less relevant? Posted again is a fact you are not grasping. If you think earthing is simple, then you did not yet read what was posted. If like me, you will not see anything thhis 'so' new until everything is read at least three times. Earthing is where the magic resided. Earthing - not a protector - is the confusing part.

Last edited by westom; 22-02-2011 at 02:03 PM..
westom is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 17-06-2011, 02:06 AM   #70
Arch-Supremacy Member
 
aerosmiths's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 11,102
to me, ignorance on this topic is bliss...

thus far, nothing ever damaged due to surges... or was there? heck, i dun even know what killed some of my appliances lol.
aerosmiths is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 24-11-2011, 07:28 PM   #71
Arch-Supremacy Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 17,692
Smile

It's called a 'whole house' protector. Dumb simple and trivial science. Go to any electrical supply house. Ask for their 'whole house' protector. Then read what only matters. 1) It has a dedicated wire for the always required short connection to single point earth ground. 2) Is rated at least 50,000 amps so that 20,000 amp lightning strikes do not even harm the protector. 3) It mechanically fits.

I will never understand why that protector is so difficult when it is not that important. Requires so much discussion due to myths promoted by scam plug-in protectors. Unfotunately so many myths and outright lies were posted. Takes almost forever to unlearn them.

Your questions should have been endless about the important stuff. The *art*. Why ask about a simple dumb box that is less relevant? Posted again is a fact you are not grasping. If you think earthing is simple, then you did not yet read what was posted. If like me, you will not see anything thhis 'so' new until everything is read at least three times. Earthing is where the magic resided. Earthing - not a protector - is the confusing part.
Thanks, you made me post something here, i never posted for a long time.

Just to say thanks, i was thinking to buy as i'm building a new rig, but then your article is really helpful.

If i really ever get one, it has to be "superstition" and not science.
BladeHamster is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 25-11-2011, 02:20 PM   #72
Master Member
 
fi3ry_icy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 3,437
There is a long assay about lighting surge, i think lighting surge is bit differnet from surge itself.
Power from pub to the hdb(for example)till the home circuit breaker(coming in) which is being taken care of by them, let talk about the surge in the home itself.

Surge is not high current but a rush of current, when an equipment suddenly turn on or shut down it may create a interfernce next to the other when it is already on state on the same line let say a mutli-extension cord.
Just example,
1)when pub service your block for electrical maintanenae and shut down for 2 hours, they also request people to remove the power cord if possible cause when the block power turn on they may afraid of power surge.
2)when factory power failure, the normal procedure is to turn off all the power to prevent surge when power recover.
Though both are unlike to happen, is just a caution against surge current.

I not against using surge protector , i got 1 myself since it just a couple of dollar different but i just don't ready bother about the insurence it claim to cover.A lot of my customer in semiconduct don't really use surge protector extension cord even.
My point is if one fine day your psu catch fire(when no one at home) due to heat is not due to whether you using surge protector or not, it is because the poor low grade psu not able to shut down itself due to overheat.

after i read this post.. i realize the long ass essay reply were totally OFF TOPIC..
fi3ry_icy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 15-01-2012, 06:01 PM   #73
Supremacy Member
 
wweixian's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 9,516
SOrry to dig this topic up, but have a question here.

I just bought a new Altec speakers, but whenever I turn on the socket switch for my extensions cable, the speakers will have a 'POP' sound, even though the power on the speakers is off.

People on other sub-forum recommend me to buy this power strip with surge protector to solve this. Is it true?
__________________
9187 3029 reserved item and went MIA.
wweixian is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 15-01-2012, 07:11 PM   #74
Supremacy Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2000
Posts: 6,234

People on other sub-forum recommend me to buy this power strip with surge protector to solve this. Is it true?
No, not true.

Local Belkin prices have sadly gone up quite a bit since the old PC show days. I can no longer recommend them as "cheap" extension cord alternatives.
limster is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 15-01-2012, 10:49 PM   #75
Senior Member
 
Mycrus's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 1,556
conclusion please...

i've read through all the post, but i'm not good with all this electrical stuff...

i stay in an hdb, so do i need one or not?

btw, i'm using APC power strips for all my expensive IT stuff.

i used to live overseas, in a country where voltage regulators were mandatory (had a PC die on me).
Mycrus is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply
Important Forum Advisory Note
This forum is moderated by volunteer moderators who will react only to members' feedback on posts. Moderators are not employees or representatives of HWZ. Forum members and moderators are responsible for their own posts.

Please refer to our Terms of Service for more information.


Thread Tools

Posting Rules

Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are On