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Changing HDB kitchen 13A socket to 15A

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Old 24-08-2017, 05:42 PM   #1
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Changing HDB kitchen 13A socket to 15A

Hey guys.

I'm on the hunt for a semi-commercial oven. My wife and I are quite serious about baking, you see. We're facing a bit of a hiccup with the electrical work, and I hope that someone out there can provide some advice.

We've decided on the Unox range of ovens as it seems to be rather durable and popular with a number of local bakeries. The salesperson told me that the model that we've selected can draw a high current (slightly over 13A), and previous clients have reported having 'melted' plugs/blown fuses when plugged into a 13A circuit. He recommended installing a 15A point to avoid these issues.

Based on the information below, I thought that it would be a simple matter -- simply switch out my desired kitchen 13A socket and replace it with a 15A one. However, I've been receiving some conflicting advice from electricians. One agrees to swapping out a 13A socket and another says a new line needs to be run from the main circuit breaker. Running a new line is likely going to require cutting through some kitchen furniture, and I hope that can be avoided. So, is it safe to simply tap on my existing kitchen power point (P3-22 - see pic below)?

Some information about my home that may be of interest:
- My place is a new BTO flat with 40A at the main circuit breaker.
- The entire kitchen is by default installed with only 13A plugs. Some additional points were installed by my renovation contractor to support my 2-zone (3.7kW) induction cooker, hood and fridge.
- The electrical plans seem to suggest that the kitchen is connected to a 30A MCB.
- From the electrical plans, it looks like the house is wired with 2.5sqmm cables for the kitchen.
- I hope to be able to switch out P3-22 (see pic below) for a 15A plug.

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Old 25-08-2017, 11:50 AM   #2
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Hey guys.

I'm on the hunt for a semi-commercial oven. My wife and I are quite serious about baking, you see. We're facing a bit of a hiccup with the electrical work, and I hope that someone out there can provide some advice.

We've decided on the Unox range of ovens as it seems to be rather durable and popular with a number of local bakeries. The salesperson told me that the model that we've selected can draw a high current (slightly over 13A), and previous clients have reported having 'melted' plugs/blown fuses when plugged into a 13A circuit. He recommended installing a 15A point to avoid these issues.

Based on the information below, I thought that it would be a simple matter -- simply switch out my desired kitchen 13A socket and replace it with a 15A one. However, I've been receiving some conflicting advice from electricians. One agrees to swapping out a 13A socket and another says a new line needs to be run from the main circuit breaker. Running a new line is likely going to require cutting through some kitchen furniture, and I hope that can be avoided. So, is it safe to simply tap on my existing kitchen power point (P3-22 - see pic below)?

Some information about my home that may be of interest:
- My place is a new BTO flat with 40A at the main circuit breaker.
- The entire kitchen is by default installed with only 13A plugs. Some additional points were installed by my renovation contractor to support my 2-zone (3.7kW) induction cooker, hood and fridge.
- The electrical plans seem to suggest that the kitchen is connected to a 30A MCB.
- From the electrical plans, it looks like the house is wired with 2.5sqmm cables for the kitchen.
- I hope to be able to switch out P3-22 (see pic below) for a 15A plug.

Forumers, pls correct me if I'm wrong in the electrical's concept. ..

The diagram shows that P3 have 7 power sockets (P3-20 to 26), that wired to one 30A's MCB, this means accumulative, you cannot loaded with more than 30A from these 7 sockets, else the MCB will be tripped as overloaded.

If you use one of the P3's power sockets for the oven that consumes about 15A, you will only left with 15A for the rest of 6 power sockets. In this case, you just need to ENSURE that the rest appliances that plugged onto the remaining 6 power sockets won't consume more than 15A at the SAMETIME while using the oven, eg: donot use induction cooker while using the oven. Else, at most is that, the MCB tripped due to overloaded, as it is the safety feature of MCB.

BTW, replace the 13A fuse to a 15A one in the 3 pins power plug of the oven, this will solve the melting issue. I did this for my MIL's oven, and the socket will not be overheated after that.

Last edited by cis2910; 25-08-2017 at 01:26 PM..
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Old 25-08-2017, 12:35 PM   #3
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im no electrician.
but if you are unsure, just pay a proper electrician to do the work for peace of mind
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Old 25-08-2017, 01:31 PM   #4
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Hey guys.

I'm on the hunt for a semi-commercial oven. My wife and I are quite serious about baking, you see. We're facing a bit of a hiccup with the electrical work, and I hope that someone out there can provide some advice.

We've decided on the Unox range of ovens as it seems to be rather durable and popular with a number of local bakeries. The salesperson told me that the model that we've selected can draw a high current (slightly over 13A), and previous clients have reported having 'melted' plugs/blown fuses when plugged into a 13A circuit. He recommended installing a 15A point to avoid these issues.

Based on the information below, I thought that it would be a simple matter -- simply switch out my desired kitchen 13A socket and replace it with a 15A one. However, I've been receiving some conflicting advice from electricians. One agrees to swapping out a 13A socket and another says a new line needs to be run from the main circuit breaker. Running a new line is likely going to require cutting through some kitchen furniture, and I hope that can be avoided. So, is it safe to simply tap on my existing kitchen power point (P3-22 - see pic below)?

Some information about my home that may be of interest:
- My place is a new BTO flat with 40A at the main circuit breaker.
- The entire kitchen is by default installed with only 13A plugs. Some additional points were installed by my renovation contractor to support my 2-zone (3.7kW) induction cooker, hood and fridge.
- The electrical plans seem to suggest that the kitchen is connected to a 30A MCB.
- From the electrical plans, it looks like the house is wired with 2.5sqmm cables for the kitchen.
- I hope to be able to switch out P3-22 (see pic below) for a 15A plug.

First you need to confirm if wires used is capable for 15A or more. If this is ok. It just a matter of changing to new circuit breaker and wall socket.
Under standard practice, if you use up 3.7Kw, you may need a 20A breaker and wiring.
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Old 25-08-2017, 01:48 PM   #5
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2.5mm cables can support up to 15amp power point.
Can just change the plug to 15amp but best not to use the rest of the points connected to the same breaker when your oven is in use.





I'm on the hunt for a semi-commercial oven. My wife and I are quite serious about baking, you see. We're facing a bit of a hiccup with the electrical work, and I hope that someone out there can provide some advice.

We've decided on the Unox range of ovens as it seems to be rather durable and popular with a number of local bakeries. The salesperson told me that the model that we've selected can draw a high current (slightly over 13A), and previous clients have reported having 'melted' plugs/blown fuses when plugged into a 13A circuit. He recommended installing a 15A point to avoid these issues.

Based on the information below, I thought that it would be a simple matter -- simply switch out my desired kitchen 13A socket and replace it with a 15A one. However, I've been receiving some conflicting advice from electricians. One agrees to swapping out a 13A socket and another says a new line needs to be run from the main circuit breaker. Running a new line is likely going to require cutting through some kitchen furniture, and I hope that can be avoided. So, is it safe to simply tap on my existing kitchen power point (P3-22 - see pic below)?

Some information about my home that may be of interest:
- My place is a new BTO flat with 40A at the main circuit breaker.
- The entire kitchen is by default installed with only 13A plugs. Some additional points were installed by my renovation contractor to support my 2-zone (3.7kW) induction cooker, hood and fridge.
- The electrical plans seem to suggest that the kitchen is connected to a 30A MCB.
- From the electrical plans, it looks like the house is wired with 2.5sqmm cables for the kitchen.
- I hope to be able to switch out P3-22 (see pic below) for a 15A plug.

[/QUOTE]
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Old 25-08-2017, 01:51 PM   #6
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u need to check if your equipment draw how many amp, and total amp draw for this circuit.

else your whole house will be burn..
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Old 25-08-2017, 02:30 PM   #7
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u need to check if your equipment draw how many amp, and total amp draw for this circuit.

else your whole house will be burn..

Don't anyhow frighten others, won't whole house burn one lah, else the MCB/ELSB for what propose.

Not to forget the cable is as mentioned: 2.5mm core!

Last edited by cis2910; 25-08-2017 at 02:35 PM..
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Old 25-08-2017, 05:12 PM   #8
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Wow. Thank you to all who have taken their time to respond. I'm surprised at how many replies this page has gotten.

I understand that an electrician could potentially make this a much easier process, but I think it's always good to know more about household matters before simply diving in.

@cis2910, pretty cool thing you did with your MIL's oven there. May I know where you bought these 15A fuses from? I may just be able to save some $$ with that idea!

...
BTW, replace the 13A fuse to a 15A one in the 3 pins power plug of the oven, this will solve the melting issue. I did this for my MIL's oven, and the socket will not be overheated after that.
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Old 25-08-2017, 06:28 PM   #9
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Wow. Thank you to all who have taken their time to respond. I'm surprised at how many replies this page has gotten.

I understand that an electrician could potentially make this a much easier process, but I think it's always good to know more about household matters before simply diving in.

@cis2910, pretty cool thing you did with your MIL's oven there. May I know where you bought these 15A fuses from? I may just be able to save some $$ with that idea!
No worry, how I know this works? I opened up the cable casing and hand feel the 2.5mm cable while using the oven , the cables were not even warm, so this mean the live wire/cable was not overloaded.

I ever noticed my friend uses a china made power extension cord (thinner cables cord) to boil water by a kettle, the cable was so warm, that was really dangerous as the cable might melted and caught fire.

BTW, the 15A fuse can be purchased at any hardware shop, probably 40~60 cents each.

Last edited by cis2910; 25-08-2017 at 06:32 PM..
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Old 27-08-2017, 03:08 AM   #10
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baker here too, and im having two bosch built in ovens for my new BTO. my electrician told me a built in oven is 15amp, if i turn on both together it might trip. thats all. burning the whole house down is abit too exaggerating.
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Old 28-08-2017, 11:18 AM   #11
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I did a little bit of research, and it seems that it's not really that safe to use the 13A (BS 1363) plugs for high current appliances, even with an upgraded 15A fuse. I believe it's because of the limited electrical contact the socket offers. Hence, I'm going to upgrade to a 15A (BS 546) socket instead.

Here are the sources:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk%3...6#Pin_diameter

"Although pin diameter is related to maximum current capacity, the pins on most plugs have a maximum capacity that is much larger than the nominal rating of the plug. The pins on the 15 Amp plug, for example, could easily carry 30 Amps or more."

http://www.theiet.org/forums/forum/m...threadid=45106

First post in the link above describes overheating problems in a 13A even when the current draw is only ~12A.
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Old 28-08-2017, 11:58 PM   #12
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I did a little bit of research, and it seems that it's not really that safe to use the 13A (BS 1363) plugs for high current appliances, even with an upgraded 15A fuse. I believe it's because of the limited electrical contact the socket offers. Hence, I'm going to upgrade to a 15A (BS 546) socket instead.

Here are the sources:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk%3...6#Pin_diameter

"Although pin diameter is related to maximum current capacity, the pins on most plugs have a maximum capacity that is much larger than the nominal rating of the plug. The pins on the 15 Amp plug, for example, could easily carry 30 Amps or more."

http://www.theiet.org/forums/forum/m...threadid=45106

First post in the link above describes overheating problems in a 13A even when the current draw is only ~12A.
Very simple logic, just compare the size of the 13A's 3pin plug and the 2.5mm copper cable will know which copper is thicker?

Anyway, you should get it properly done by electrician to have peace of mind. Cheers!
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Last edited by cis2910; 29-08-2017 at 12:40 AM..
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Old 29-08-2017, 12:13 PM   #13
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Very simple logic, just compare the size of the 13A's 3pin plug and the 2.5mm copper cable will know which copper is thicker?

Anyway, you should get it properly done by electrician to have peace of mind. Cheers!
Kapoh a bit, have you already changed the socket to 15A ? What is the voltage of oven and its amps? Then multiply and get the watts.

As there are a few persons have suggested that you call for an electrician to see and check, I also say get an electrician to see the wiring and the circuit breaker for this socket used for oven. See how the electrician recommend. Now the flat has max 40A, if you turn on aircon, refrigerator and then this incoming oven, what is the available amperes for use in this oven? So this big picture can be answered by the electrician and his recommendation during operation of oven.

Think safety, work / bake safely.
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Old 29-08-2017, 02:20 PM   #14
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Kapoh a bit, have you already changed the socket to 15A ? What is the voltage of oven and its amps? Then multiply and get the watts.

As there are a few persons have suggested that you call for an electrician to see and check, I also say get an electrician to see the wiring and the circuit breaker for this socket used for oven. See how the electrician recommend. Now the flat has max 40A, if you turn on aircon, refrigerator and then this incoming oven, what is the available amperes for use in this oven? So this big picture can be answered by the electrician and his recommendation during operation of oven.

Think safety, work / bake safely.
Safety always come first! ppl who has little knowledge in electrical, it is advisable to consult a professional electrician.

Just for information, HDB provided a 40A main switch to each household since 1994, so even if the electrician advised to connect to a new dedicated 15A power socket for the oven, it is still connecting to the same 40A main switch. The MCB are only distributing the total of 40A load that limited by the main switch.


More information from HDB...

https://services2.hdb.gov.sg/webapp/...ion=electrical

http://www.hdb.gov.sg/cs/infoweb/res...ectrical-works

Last edited by cis2910; 29-08-2017 at 02:31 PM..
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Old 29-08-2017, 04:10 PM   #15
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@xiangzeng,

The oven is rated for a maximum draw of 3kW, 220 - 240V. That seems to suggest a current that ranges from 12.5A - 13.6A.

----------

Thank you all (cis2910, Kaylin, xiangzeng, cscs3, terumo, member1 and logitech123) for your advice in this thread.

I have since sought the opinion of an electrician and they were originally considering running a new cable from a spare MCB. However, after sending them the electrical diagram (the same one in my first post), they concluded that simply replacing the faceplate to a 15A one would suffice. In fact, the electrician had just completed the job less than an hour ago.

The entire kitchen will eventually be wired to a number of high wattage appliances. Time to be careful about how many things I turn on at the same time.
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