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For discussion - Will most singaporeans be able to achieve FRS?

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Old 10-09-2019, 10:10 AM   #16
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Yup, its a little sick to be honest to know that future generations are gonna have to meet ever increasing FRS.
No, that's not correct. The government doesn't impose an obligation on anybody to hit a particular minimum(*), or to have even one dollar in their Retirement Accounts. The Full Retirement Sum is the default maximum level of Retirement Account funding on your 55th birthday, and that's pretty much all it is.

I wonder when will this ever stop.
Never, or at least not until the Singapore dollar ceases to exist. Inflation is real.

Cannot be it keeps increasing till a million dollars right (though we wont be affected coz we would mostly be six feet under).
At some point in the presumably distant future the Full Retirement Sum will be S$1 million, but that S$1 million won't have anywhere near the real purchasing power it has today. (Well, OK, those future dollars will be able to purchase an iPhone 68 which will be unimaginably incredible -- maybe it'll brush your teeth for you? -- but that's a different point.)

I wish the SA ceiling is much higher.
Me too.

(*) The government only has contribution requirements for citizens and PRs who work in Singapore in the labor market (not for those who work as homemakers, for example). If the compulsory contributions end up supporting a Basic Retirement Sum-sized Retirement Account or larger, then the BRS is the practical minimum. But if less, then that's the minimum.

Last edited by BBCWatcher; 10-09-2019 at 10:19 AM..
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Old 10-09-2019, 10:12 AM   #17
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Yup, its a little sick to be honest to know that future generations are gonna have to meet ever increasing FRS. I wonder when will this ever stop. Cannot be it keeps increasing till a million dollars right (though we wont be affected coz we would mostly be six feet under).
That is why some believe in topping up their children's cpf from young.
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Old 10-09-2019, 11:43 AM   #18
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Are the numbers correct?

Allocation rates for SA is abt 5% abv MA. But numbers show SA is 4 times MA figures?

Yet to do any detailed calculations but the Numbers do look significantly optimistic.


Let's say a 30 year old is earning a salary of $3500 a month with $0 balances across all 3 of his CPF accounts.
In 20 years time his balances will be as follows:
OA: 209033
SA: 183540
MA: 57200

This calculation is based on a flat salary of $3500 over 20 years excluding bonuses and pay increments. What more, he still has another 5 years of compounding interest to reach 55.
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Old 10-09-2019, 11:54 AM   #19
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No, that's not correct. The government doesn't impose an obligation on anybody to hit a particular minimum(*), or to have even one dollar in their Retirement Accounts. The Full Retirement Sum is the default maximum level of Retirement Account funding on your 55th birthday, and that's pretty much all it is.

.
Why do u say the govt doesnt impose an obligation on anybody? I think they do actually, in a different way. What was promised was that CPF was gonna be the working man's pot of cash upon hitting a certain age. And then CPF Life came up where if u do not hit the FRS, u cannot withdraw anything more than 5k?

Now i do not have knowledge about the 20% that one can withdraw once or just before he starts to draw CPF Life payouts (just found out by reading this forum a few days ago) so let's not consider that as part of the payout one can withdraw after the initial 5k.

Let's consider a person who has a combined OA+SA balance of 174k now. He can only withdraw 5k instead of what he was "promised" of 174k (am guessing, dont know what cpf rules there were previously). Now isn't this considered an imposement by the govt for the man to not be able to use his money, aka save?
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Old 10-09-2019, 11:54 AM   #20
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99% correct, used the CPF APP to get the numbers.

The parameters were, salary 3500, sa ma and oa acct start with $0.. 20 years compounding based on the birth year 1989
Are the numbers correct?

Allocation rates for SA is abt 5% abv MA. But numbers show SA is 4 times MA figures?

Yet to do any detailed calculations but the Numbers do look significantly optimistic.

Last edited by THEMIKOS; 10-09-2019 at 11:57 AM..
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Old 10-09-2019, 11:58 AM   #21
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Oops sorry.. based on the person who is born in 1983.. meaning the person is not 30 years old, but 36. Lol.. my bad.

99% correct, used the CPF APP to get the numbers.

The parameters were, salary 3500, sa ma and oa acct start with $0.. 20 years compounding based on the birth year 1989
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Old 10-09-2019, 12:03 PM   #22
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This is quite good and i believe u can do it since u seem to be doing better in life than most.

I did a calculation too, top up 176k for a new born baby in the sa. Without any other income, the baby will be 1.5mil rich ..😂😂

That is why some believe in topping up their children's cpf from young.
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Old 10-09-2019, 12:05 PM   #23
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Based on the scenario you gave, dont see why not. That's a pretty late starting age, below median salary with no increments and bonuses counted and yet can still reach a decent amount in cpf
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Old 10-09-2019, 03:47 PM   #24
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This is quite good and i believe u can do it since u seem to be doing better in life than most.

I did a calculation too, top up 176k for a new born baby in the sa. Without any other income, the baby will be 1.5mil rich ..😂😂
i was in army earning 160 per month as a recruit. ntuc come to us and tell us that if i pay 20 per month, i can get 10k in dont know how many years time. at the same time i will be insured.

wah 10k!! i only get 160 a month. damn solid man. i sign up eagerly, although 20 is a large part of salary.

when i really get the 10k, it is like most of you say, not bad loh. add a few hundred more can buy 1 lot of ocbc.

money does depreciate a lot over the years. what seems like a lot money now may seem not that fantastic in the future.
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Old 10-09-2019, 04:13 PM   #25
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Why do u say the govt doesnt impose an obligation on anybody? I think they do actually, in a different way. What was promised was that CPF was gonna be the working man's pot of cash upon hitting a certain age. And then CPF Life came up where if u do not hit the FRS, u cannot withdraw anything more than 5k?

Now i do not have knowledge about the 20% that one can withdraw once or just before he starts to draw CPF Life payouts (just found out by reading this forum a few days ago) so let's not consider that as part of the payout one can withdraw after the initial 5k.

Let's consider a person who has a combined OA+SA balance of 174k now. He can only withdraw 5k instead of what he was "promised" of 174k (am guessing, dont know what cpf rules there were previously). Now isn't this considered an imposement by the govt for the man to not be able to use his money, aka save?
U are sharp! He is always talking rubbish, defining his own rules, trying to be creative or destructive
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Old 10-09-2019, 04:36 PM   #26
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Yup, its a little sick to be honest to know that future generations are gonna have to meet ever increasing FRS. I wonder when will this ever stop. Cannot be it keeps increasing till a million dollars right (though we wont be affected coz we would mostly be six feet under).
for future generation, they should love inflation, especially moderate inflation.

Inflation is their friend and deflation is their enemy.

A moderate inflation is good to economy.
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Old 10-09-2019, 05:27 PM   #27
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Old 10-09-2019, 05:48 PM   #28
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The noisy ones are the ones who desperately need
the money NOW.
CPF Life is 20-40 years later.
That problem can wait.

That Michael Toh in the news now is one used up
all but unhappy though.

I have yet to read a story of anyone who says that CPF is good and he is now a rich man due to the govt's forced savings.

Last edited by Merg91; 10-09-2019 at 06:07 PM..
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Old 10-09-2019, 06:03 PM   #29
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Can you survive with <$1500 a month cpf life in 20-40 years time?

Yup, its a little sick to be honest to know that future generations are gonna have to meet ever increasing FRS. I wonder when will this ever stop.
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Old 10-09-2019, 06:56 PM   #30
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Why do u say the govt doesnt impose an obligation on anybody? I think they do actually, in a different way. What was promised was that CPF was gonna be the working man's pot of cash upon hitting a certain age. And then CPF Life came up where if u do not hit the FRS, u cannot withdraw anything more than 5k?
Nope, the govt never promised a "pot of cash" upon hitting 55. CPF is not a govt-run golden handshake program, but a "pension" scheme to tide you through your retirement. Some will say the payout is too low, but that's perfectly fair - why should someone earning 3k/month get a payout that's similar to someone else earning 6k/month?
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