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Hyflux 6% Perpetual Securities

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Old 17-05-2019, 12:56 AM   #3436
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Good opportunity for the PnP to demand 100% recovery plus all accumulated interest from Utico during the Townhall..

Even if they can manage to convince PUB not to take over Tuaspring, Maybank already appoint their Managers and Receivers at Tuaspring Power Plant...So they still need to convince Maybank if they somehow manage to convince PUB from taking over Tuaspring Desalination Plant...

The 7 banks who are the unsecured creditors are still fighting in Court to get JM on Hyflux...
PUB is the difficult one. Maybank can settle as long as willing to pay. Just like how they waited for SMI.
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Old 17-05-2019, 01:17 AM   #3437
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This is moving on?



This is very week negotiation.
I would open the nego with 10x capital compensation, and 20x accumulated interest compensation and emotional distress fee of 20x total.

In return I just want them to lower to 1x capital.

Happy for everybody.
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Old 17-05-2019, 05:57 AM   #3438
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This is very week negotiation.
I would open the nego with 10x capital compensation, and 20x accumulated interest compensation and emotional distress fee of 20x total.

In return I just want them to lower to 1x capital.

Happy for everybody.
Wah I also star in avengers .

Exciting ...haha.

Already said moving on doesn't mean not doing anything. Moving on means not affected by it,not sad, not depressed, life is still good.

Get it.

To the one who posted and help me market my blog , your moving on means?

Last edited by sgdividends; 17-05-2019 at 06:01 AM..
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Old 17-05-2019, 07:03 AM   #3439
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Wah I also star in avengers .

Exciting ...haha.

Already said moving on doesn't mean not doing anything. Moving on means not affected by it,not sad, not depressed, life is still good.

Get it.

To the one who posted and help me market my blog , your moving on means?
Moving on means looking for the next investment opportunity outside of Hyflux as my whole life cannot revolve around Hyflux...

If you are no longer affected by it, you wouldn't care about getting anything from Hyflux...The fact that you set up a legal group chat, still expecting 100% capital plus accumulated interest is the very definition of not moving on as you are still being hold back by Hyflux or that all your decisions revolve around Hyflux...

If you are affected by any news with regards to Hyflux be it an "exciting" or you have any other emotions be it anger or happiness, it just proof that you have not moved on...
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Old 17-05-2019, 07:56 AM   #3440
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Moving on means looking for the next investment opportunity outside of Hyflux as my whole life cannot revolve around Hyflux...

If you are no longer affected by it, you wouldn't care about getting anything from Hyflux...The fact that you set up a legal group chat, still expecting 100% capital plus accumulated interest is the very definition of not moving on as you are still being hold back by Hyflux or that all your decisions revolve around Hyflux...

If you are affected by any news with regards to Hyflux be it an "exciting" or you have any other emotions be it anger or happiness, it just proof that you have not moved on...
Ok so I know your moving on means what.

U didn't invest yet write so much means what ?

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Old 17-05-2019, 08:12 AM   #3441
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Sgdividenda and Alex Alex fellow in the Telegram group are delusional.

Hyflux got $1.8bn in liabilities and thatís excluding the $900m in notes/perps.

Even if TS could be sold at the original fictitious book value, there is nothing left for the notes/perps after paying off the senior creditors.

Expecting 100% return on capital? SMH
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Old 17-05-2019, 08:16 AM   #3442
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Ok so I know your moving on means what.

U didn't invest yet write so much means what ?
I write for the entertainment that you and the other investors provide...If you already move on, I got nothing else to screenshot and upload over here...The fact that you spam the group chat daily with the google docs link to get people to join on your crusade speaks volume of your "moving on"...

Let's be honest here, if your investment in Hyflux is only one percent of what you had invested, would you write off the losses or still go on a daily tirade to seek legal actions to get back 100% capital plus all accumulated interest? Do you go to this much length to recover back 100% plus all accumulated interest on your investment losses? What if your exposure to Hyflux constitutes less than 1% of your investment portfolio?

You are the creator and the admin of the Telegram chat...If I had quoted any other people who posted on there, you might use the excuse that the ridiculous posting are made by trolls to derail the chat...I now try to only post the posts made by the Admins in the group chat so that you or anyone in the Telegram chat could not use the "trolls" in the group chat as an excuse for any of the post quoted here...Frankly, you and the other Admins do provide a lot of entertainment value...

Do keep up posting on the Telegram chat to provide entertainment value for us... Sometimes when I feel bored and needed a good laugh, I just pop by to read the comments there and I am not disappointed...

From the bottom of my heart, I thank you for the entertainment...

Maybe you should try being consistent on how you try to paint yourself here and the Telegram chat and see for yourself whether any of your investing peers here supported any of your views here...
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Old 17-05-2019, 08:30 AM   #3443
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Sgdividenda and Alex Alex fellow in the Telegram group are delusional.

Hyflux got $1.8bn in liabilities and thatís excluding the $900m in notes/perps.

Even if TS could be sold at the original fictitious book value, there is nothing left for the notes/perps after paying off the senior creditors.

Expecting 100% return on capital? SMH
Initially they were unhappy with PUB taking over at $0...When Maybank wanted to take over the Power Plant, they were quite happy to give the Power Plant to Maybank so that Hyflux could write off the $500+m in loans to Maybank for taking the Power Plant...Now they are back to being angry at PUB for not delaying taking over the desalination plant...They flip-flop on their stance so much that I wonder if they really know what they want other than 100% capital recovery plus accumulated interest...
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Old 17-05-2019, 08:30 AM   #3444
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For what it’s worth, I’ve held shares in three companies that went bankrupt, and the shares became (and are) worthless — a total wipeout.(*) In one of those cases the shares were a gift, and I received a few dividends, so I came out ahead. In the other two cases I received a few dividends but came out very much behind. In all three cases the positions were extremely small relative to total household wealth. I never should have bought the two companies’ shares because individual company investing is generally quite dumb.

You learn, and you move on, that’s all.

(*) As a U.S. person I got to take capital losses, which offset capital gains tax. There’s an annual limit to capital losses, but I was able to take the full losses for the non-gift shares since they were such small positions. I guess that’s something. Hyflux investors who are U.S. persons or who live in practically any country with a capital gains tax would very much appreciate a definitive resolution, notably liquidation, because they would then be able to take the capital losses. A “zombie” company is not helpful to them, because (ordinarily) the capital loss tax rule requires an actual, realized loss. The sooner reality is properly documented for the tax authorities, the better. Institutional shareholders often have greater tax-related flexibility to do partial write-offs for tax purposes, but individual investors ordinarily don’t. Maybe these investors can sell their bonds/notes on the secondary market in order to realize their losses, but shareholders cannot since trading has been halted. This is the worst of all possible worlds, really. They’re sitting on huge but unrealized losses, no way to close out their positions to realize the losses, and no prospect of ever getting any other result except a big loss. Does anybody have any sympathy for their plight?

Last edited by BBCWatcher; 17-05-2019 at 09:09 AM..
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Old 17-05-2019, 10:35 AM   #3445
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For what itís worth, Iíve held shares in three companies that went bankrupt, and the shares became (and are) worthless ó a total wipeout.(*) In one of those cases the shares were a gift, and I received a few dividends, so I came out ahead. In the other two cases I received a few dividends but came out very much behind. In all three cases the positions were extremely small relative to total household wealth. I never should have bought the two companiesí shares because individual company investing is generally quite dumb.

You learn, and you move on, thatís all.

(*) As a U.S. person I got to take capital losses, which offset capital gains tax. Thereís an annual limit to capital losses, but I was able to take the full losses for the non-gift shares since they were such small positions. I guess thatís something. Hyflux investors who are U.S. persons or who live in practically any country with a capital gains tax would very much appreciate a definitive resolution, notably liquidation, because they would then be able to take the capital losses. A ďzombieĒ company is not helpful to them, because (ordinarily) the capital loss tax rule requires an actual, realized loss. The sooner reality is properly documented for the tax authorities, the better. Institutional shareholders often have greater tax-related flexibility to do partial write-offs for tax purposes, but individual investors ordinarily donít. Maybe these investors can sell their bonds/notes on the secondary market in order to realize their losses, but shareholders cannot since trading has been halted. This is the worst of all possible worlds, really. Theyíre sitting on huge but unrealized losses, no way to close out their positions to realize the losses, and no prospect of ever getting any other result except a big loss. Does anybody have any sympathy for their plight?
Like I said previously, I felt sympathetic with their losses in the first place...But when they start blaming so many people for their own investment decision including demanding a bailout as everyone have a "moral obligation" to help them recover 100% plus all accumulated interest, it just means that they cannot accept their losses and move on with their life...Those who had already moved on deserve all the sympathy for their losses and I feel them...Those who insist on 100% recovery plus all accumulated interest, I treat them as an entertainment source for the occasional laughter...I am not laughing at their losses but at the absurd posting that they post in the chat group...If you join the group and you see how people got banned for posting something that do not agree with their views, maybe you would know why people keep posting their chat here to share the real views of those vested...
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Old 17-05-2019, 12:31 PM   #3446
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being a PnP investor myself, getting 100% + 6% back is delusional based on state of balance sheet and seniority of claims. It will be fortunate to get anything in region of 50-80% if utico is willing bail us out.

I also not in favour of litigation and that should only be pursued as last option, getting pnp to stay on books of current hyflux with no SPV offers a much better risk reward, pretty straightforward to me.

have no idea why TG pushing litigation if there are investors like utico.

Yes i exited the TG as well, i am not easily influenced.
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Old 17-05-2019, 01:43 PM   #3447
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My read is Utico, for whatever reasons, is not the knight-to-be
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Old 17-05-2019, 02:05 PM   #3448
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very obviously OL is not in utico's plan.
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Old 17-05-2019, 05:29 PM   #3449
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very obviously OL is not in utico's plan.
If I am utico, I would just wait for Hyflux's liquidation and then attempt to buy their stuff during the sale.

Hyflux as an entity doesn't seem to have much value at all
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Old 17-05-2019, 05:49 PM   #3450
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Saturday have to change the logo ?

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