Free advice/discussion on buy/sell of Resale flat (Part 6) - Part 2

baileysGirl

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1. View House
2. Agree on price with seller and sign OTP, pay up 1k as first deposit
3. Proceed to request for hdb valuation

4. Valuation out, decide whether to go ahead or not. Assume yes, then go get a bank letter of offer ASAP.
At this stage u can let the bank people recommend you their panel of lawyers, or u can ask them to put your own lawyer on the Letter of offer. (advise is always get lawyer on bank and cpf board panel of lawyer, for ease of mind and no later hiccup)

5. Settle loan + lawyer etc, meet up with seller, pay 2nd deposit and confirm the deal. Buyer sign on page 8 of OTP.

6. Both side decide on a date to submit the deal to hdb.

7. Both side settle their own submission and endorsement to hdb.

8. Hdb acknowledge all documents received and give a completion date.

9. Buyer with bank loan make their prior appt with lawyers to settle their loan + conveyancing. This shld be way before hdb appt step 10.

10. Meet up at hdb to sign documents and exchange keys. (buyer with bank loan can bypass this step and meet at lawyer office as they can send a representative to hdb appt for u)

-vinz
Thanks Vinz, appreciate it.

I just read this! I'm taking a HDB loan. So lawyer is at step 4?! I already paid the 2nd deposit. I thought the conveyancing lawyer would be at step 7.... What do I do now?
 

vinz

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That's for Bank Loan.

HDB Loan just wait for submission and click Hdb legal department as your representative.

Nothing much u need to do now.
Ignore all parts regarding bank lawyers and cpf panel.

Everything regarding HDB loan and conveyancing is process by HDB. You won't be meeting any lawyers.
 

superflygun

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Doing some research on resale too as I'll be DIY-ing. With the help of vinz and this community, it is making things very possible.

First-time buyers so still hopeful of BTO, but we are in our early 30s and need a home for family planning, so kind of stuck in a bad time. Yet we cannot afford COV and prefer not to. Keeping options open ahead of the juicy BTOs later this year.

As long as we honour our budget (within 400-450k and at least 4-room), probably miss out on some units, after a while, the market will open something for us. Especially after clearing the cash-rich peeps first when they go COV, and while HDB's valuation hold firm.

I am exploring neighbourhoods and currently renting a room in Hougang (so quite aware of aviation noise now!).
Is there aviation noise in B.Batok, B.Panjang, J.East?

Seeking your inputs as some places, I've never been in recent years, let alone stay there... (of course I'll explore when it is time to view a unit)

Each group is the same budget range, what will you pick based on neighbourhood livability and value sustainability? Assuming all mid-level, reno acceptable with very similar amenities...

If you live in one of these places, do share your experiences there! I live in Hougang now, can only say a lot of people and limited parks lol, but convenient for our workplace for now so still alright.

4-rooms
1. Mature Group
  • B.Batok near MRT 1980-85
  • Hougang MRT 1980-1985
  • AMK MRT 1975-1980
  • Queenstown MRT 1970-75, has PHG
2. Longer Lease Group
  • B.Panjang (one of the LRTs like Segar) 2010-15
  • Sengkang Fernvale LRT 2010-15
3. Budget Group about 50-80k cheaper than above two groups
  • B.Panjang (one of the LRTs) 1995-1999
  • Teban Garden (no MRT until 2030 or so) 1980-85


quite worried with flats before 1990 also due to lease decay...
Would you go for safe new flats after the 2000s or for convenience and maturity before the 1990s?
 
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Cuterthanyou

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Dear all, firstly, have been reading anonymously and all the info has been v helpful - thank you.

DIY buyer here, some qns:
1. If I'm taking cpf grant under fiance/fiancee scheme, when must I show marriage proof? Is it within 3 months AFTER completion or before/on completion?

2. Looking to view a place asking for 590k, recent transacted price between 520-560k (but higher floor). Unit seems well maintained. Hoping to be able to nego about 530k and pay less than 10k COV. Do you think there's a possibility?
 

todomachi

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Dear all, firstly, have been reading anonymously and all the info has been v helpful - thank you.

DIY buyer here, some qns:
1. If I'm taking cpf grant under fiance/fiancee scheme, when must I show marriage proof? Is it within 3 months AFTER completion or before/on completion?

2. Looking to view a place asking for 590k, recent transacted price between 520-560k (but higher floor). Unit seems well maintained. Hoping to be able to nego about 530k and pay less than 10k COV. Do you think there's a possibility?
To answer your question:-

1. yes. You got to submit marriage cert within 3 months from completion date.

2. Anything is possible, just that how low does the seller want to let go of it. With the relaxation of viewing ruling next week, there is a possibility of increased demand for viewing, so seller definitely looking forward to have more viewings in hope of more offers or higher offer. So also when you mentioned about less than 10K COV, you must be prepared that it might be more based on the past transacted price. assuming past transacted price is 520K and their valuation is $480K, so that buyer actually paid $40K COV.
 

todomachi

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Doing some research on resale too as I'll be DIY-ing. With the help of vinz and this community, it is making things very possible.

First-time buyers so still hopeful of BTO, but we are in our early 30s and need a home for family planning, so kind of stuck in a bad time. Yet we cannot afford COV and prefer not to. Keeping options open ahead of the juicy BTOs later this year.

As long as we honour our budget (within 400-450k and at least 4-room), probably miss out on some units, after a while, the market will open something for us. Especially after clearing the cash-rich peeps first when they go COV, and while HDB's valuation hold firm.

I am exploring neighbourhoods and currently renting a room in Hougang (so quite aware of aviation noise now!).
Is there aviation noise in B.Batok, B.Panjang, J.East?

Seeking your inputs as some places, I've never been in recent years, let alone stay there... (of course I'll explore when it is time to view a unit)

Each group is the same budget range, what will you pick based on neighbourhood livability and value sustainability? Assuming all mid-level, reno acceptable with very similar amenities...

If you live in one of these places, do share your experiences there! I live in Hougang now, can only say a lot of people and limited parks lol, but convenient for our workplace for now so still alright.

4-rooms
1. Mature Group
  • B.Batok near MRT 1980-85
  • Hougang MRT 1980-1985
  • AMK MRT 1975-1980
  • Queenstown MRT 1970-75, has PHG
2. Longer Lease Group
  • B.Panjang (one of the LRTs like Segar) 2010-15
  • Sengkang Fernvale LRT 2010-15
3. Budget Group about 50-80k cheaper than above two groups
  • B.Panjang (one of the LRTs) 1995-1999
  • Teban Garden (no MRT until 2030 or so) 1980-85


quite worried with flats before 1990 also due to lease decay...
Would you go for safe new flats after the 2000s or for convenience and maturity before the 1990s?
I myself have been staying in Bukit Panjang for the past 35 years. there isn't any aviation noise in this area. I am currently still hunting for my next resale flat. I would still prefer to go for the older flat in view of the bigger size and intend to stay long term. The concern about lease decay would be more concerning if you intend to sell after it MOP. Older flat might not be the best for you.
 

Cuterthanyou

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To answer your question:-

1. yes. You got to submit marriage cert within 3 months from completion date.

2. Anything is possible, just that how low does the seller want to let go of it. With the relaxation of viewing ruling next week, there is a possibility of increased demand for viewing, so seller definitely looking forward to have more viewings in hope of more offers or higher offer. So also when you mentioned about less than 10K COV, you must be prepared that it might be more based on the past transacted price. assuming past transacted price is 520K and their valuation is $480K, so that buyer actually paid $40K COV.
That's what I'm worried of too 😓 just hoping that the past transacted prices don't differ too much from valuation. Thank you so much for the quick response!
 

acewind

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need some advice or opinion, 35 yr old, single. looking to purchase a resale HDB, mainly for rental income. i intend to buy a private property after MOP, keeping the HDB flat. No marriage intention.

1. Should i buy a 3-4room flat that has less than 60 years lease left (built before 1975) in CCR/OCR area? eg, selegie, toa payoh, whampoa, queenstown. rental yield is around 5-8%. I understand if i buy these flat i may not be able to offload to another buyer years down the road. Hoping it get SERS or VERS

2. Buy a newer flat 4-5room, that is built after 1990. Larger loan quantum, which may affect my LTV if i want to purchase private property 5 years later. The advantage is that i may be able to offload the flat easier years down. which district is good?

Any inputs?

P/S: understand MOP regulation on rental, the ABSD levy
 

toxxic

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Asking for fren.

Both owner are employed but one has been on no pay leave past three months but starting work this month. So HLE indicating lower amount (300) that is not enough to cover flat price (550).

They are intending to buy first then sell so sale proceeds may be returned later. Also intending to reapply HLE just before completion (since process takes about 10wks+ once have the salary documents.

Qn is considering the HLE amt + cpf doesn't fully cover the cost of the flat, if seller grant OTP, can they file the OTP in system and will it go through or will HDB auto reject cos HLE amt is low?
 

vinz

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HDB will just assume whatever outstanding amount to be paid in cash. The system will let it go through.

And applying HLE at completion time is too late, they want the buyer's financial plan information very soon after they start to submit into the system.

Sale proceed of first flat (usually 50% of it) will also be use to pay for the next flat if taking HDB loan ( U mentioned HLE).
Refunded CPF can also be use for the next flat.

Not sure why they want/need to do it until so tight. Doesn't seems like a good way to buy first, sell later, if they can't even have a proper HLE now.

Shouldn't they sell first, get extension from their buyer.
With the sales proceed and CPF refund, maybe don't' even need such a big loan.

I assume first unit still have HDB loan, then this 2nd unit will be charged market rate HDB loan (around 3.7% ++) until they settle the first flat, do they even know this?

-vinz
 

vinz

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need some advice or opinion, 35 yr old, single. looking to purchase a resale HDB, mainly for rental income. i intend to buy a private property after MOP, keeping the HDB flat. No marriage intention.
HDB for rental income? room rental for first 5yrs only, which u mention you know. and ABSD for next flat, which I have to assume your sole income must be quite high to afford both alone.
1. Should i buy a 3-4room flat that has less than 60 years lease left (built before 1975) in CCR/OCR area? eg, selegie, toa payoh, whampoa, queenstown. rental yield is around 5-8%. I understand if i buy these flat i may not be able to offload to another buyer years down the road. Hoping it get SERS or VERS
SERS is like striking toto, how many percent of people actually gets it? And what if it's 20 to 40yrs down the road, can u afford the wait ? And if u own a pte property when they announce for SERS, u won't be eligible for the replacement unit.
2. Buy a newer flat 4-5room, that is built after 1990. Larger loan quantum, which may affect my LTV if i want to purchase private property 5 years later. The advantage is that i may be able to offload the flat easier years down. which district is good?
It is pretty hard to find the best of a few worlds which u want :
1. HDB at good location , easy rent out for yields. OR
2. Old HDB to get SERS. OR
3. Newer HDB flat, easier to offload for profit
Any inputs?
P/S: understand MOP regulation on rental, the ABSD levy
HDB is seriously for the Singaporean to have a roof over our head. Most Singaporean couple have their first HDB just to have a roof over their head, and of course some luckily manage to ride the property wave and get it sold for a good price with profit and upgrade to pte property then.

I wouldn't had butt in if you are saying u are a singles and buying a 4room 5room for own stay, and potentially renting out the bedrooms for extra income.

If you have the financial means now (and I assume stronger means in the future), why don't just go the pte property way and get something now , with potential good capital gains 5yrs down the road and repeat, or buy a few more pte property with your gains 5yrs later? why get tied up with HDB rules for next 5 years. Most capital gains for private property should easily top the 5-8% rental yield of HDB. Of course not saying all pte property sure make money.

-vinz
 

Cuterthanyou

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Hi gurus, I'm a first timer who doesn't wish to wait for BTO hence exploring resale options but in a dilemma also since prices are sky high now.

Anw, I noticed that many sellers are selling their hdbs because they are receiving keys to their BTOs soon. Does it mean I can still apply for BTO after I've purchased my resale? Doesn't that make me a 2nd timer since I've used my grants for resale?

Or is there another way to buy resale + apply for bto at the same time? Appreciate your enlightenment.
 

todomachi

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Hi gurus, I'm a first timer who doesn't wish to wait for BTO hence exploring resale options but in a dilemma also since prices are sky high now.

Anw, I noticed that many sellers are selling their hdbs because they are receiving keys to their BTOs soon. Does it mean I can still apply for BTO after I've purchased my resale? Doesn't that make me a 2nd timer since I've used my grants for resale?

Or is there another way to buy resale + apply for bto at the same time? Appreciate your enlightenment.
Yes. you can apply for BTO again after you have purchased your resale. But do note that you can only apply for BTO after you have fulfilled the 5 yrs MOP for the resale unit.

Also do take note that resale levy will also be applicable for the 2nd timer BTO if you have taken CPF housing Grant to purchase your resale flat.

You are not allowed to buy resale and apply BTO at the same time.
 

vinz

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Hi gurus, I'm a first timer who doesn't wish to wait for BTO hence exploring resale options but in a dilemma also since prices are sky high now.
BTO all late completion, most from ballot to getting keys is now 4 to 5yrs.
People who can't wait are turning to resale flat. Rising demands will in turn rise up the prices.
I noticed that many sellers are selling their hdbs because they are receiving keys to their BTOs soon. Does it mean I can still apply for BTO after I've purchased my resale?
Yes u can, but only after you finish your 5years MOP .

Most of those sellers u mentioned had stayed in their flat for 5yrs, then apply for BTO, then wait for their BTO completion (4 to 5yrs), thus their total length of stay at current flat is 9 to 10yrs (and not 5years as what you thought)
Doesn't that make me a 2nd timer since I've used my grants for resale?
Yes, if you had used grant it makes you a 2nd timer for BTO or EC application.
Or is there another way to buy resale + apply for bto at the same time? Appreciate your enlightenment.
Above is the only way. So please make your choice wisely as you going to spend a good 5 to 20 years of your life there.
 

zenify.me

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Seems that there are lots of DIY buyers in this thread, are there circumstances where engaging an agent for buying makes more sense?
 

kelvinkezz

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Seems that there are lots of DIY buyers in this thread, are there circumstances where engaging an agent for buying makes more sense?
Since we do not incur commisison charges as buyers, i dont see a reason why we should not engage an agent for our purchases. Additional advantages of engaging an agent:
- helps to advise and navigate the timeline (especially if you have an ongoing sales)
- documentation
- financial assessment
- assess suitability of units
- negotiation
- helps with 'managing' your axiety and excitement especially after you have exercised your OTP and easgerly anticpate the completion and handover of your purchased unit
 
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ctstalin

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Since we do not incur commisison charges as buyers, i dont see a reason why we should not engage an agent for our purchases. Additional advantages of engaging an agent:
- helps to advise and navigate the timeline (especially if you have an ongoing sales)
- documentation
- financial assessment
- assess suitability of units
- negotiation
- helps with 'managing' your axiety and excitement especially after you have exercised your OTP and easgerly anticpate the completion and handover of your purchased unit
Huh, you will incur commissions if you engage an agent for the services above. Where got work for free one?

You will not incur commissions from the seller's agent
 

kelvinkezz

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Huh, you will incur commissions if you engage an agent for the services above. Where got work for free one?

You will not incur commissions from the seller's agent
No leh. i didnt pay any commission for my recent purchase and i enjoyed the stated 'services'. I guess the buyer agent earns from co-broking with the seller agent.

Also to share (on a similar topic), i sold my HDB recently at $700K++ and paid only $1,999 to my seller agent.
 

SG SUPERMAN

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No leh. i didnt pay any commission for my recent purchase and i enjoyed the stated 'services'. I guess the buyer agent earns from co-broking with the seller agent.

Also to share (on a similar topic), i sold my HDB recently at $700K++ and paid only $1,999 to my seller agent.
Sorry just curious, so you as a buyer engage an agent to help you look for property? Then when he brought you to property viewing and you found something you like, so example if you offer 1million for the house, you only pay 1million and no agent fee right?

Then for seller if agreed 2% commission to his agent, he will only get 980K and 20k goes to his agent? so the buyer agent will have to negotiate with the seller agent to share the 20k commission?

Is it a must for seller agent to share the 20k commission with the buyer agent? Since the 2% was agreed by seller to his agent only. I was wondering if us buyer will lose out from engaging a buyer agent due to the agent will need to earn and negotiate to share the commission with the seller agent. If there is a buyer with no agent, the seller agent could earn the full 20K commission won't it be better for him?
 
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