Help with HDB networking! Advice needed

magix

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Hi really thankful for your reply.
So I’ve bought my mesh router alrdy which is the google nest which comes with an additional port.

im thinking of using the router which was provided by the ISP as the “wired router WAN” which you have mentioned because I think I just need to pay like $2 more each month to get the router.

so from the living, I will plug my google nest router in.

is it similar to what you have suggested? And from your opinion would that work?

Since you wanted to place the Nest in living room instead of DB.

- Sign up the MR plan with Router Or sign up without Router & buy a basic router off the IT store
- Configure your Google nest as bridge mode
- Install the mesh at living room and xx room.
 

guitarunited

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@magix Hello, thanks for your suggestion. Your proposed set up is quite similar to what I wanted. But a few questions:

1) shouldn’t the basic router in the db be set to bridge mode instead of the google nest router?

2) sorry I’m quite a newbie. But if I set my google nest router into bridge mode, will it still be able to transmit signal (i.e. giving out WiFi signal)? And can it still mesh with the google nest WiFi im planning to put in the master bedroom?
 

magix

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@magix Hello, thanks for your suggestion. Your proposed set up is quite similar to what I wanted. But a few questions:

1) shouldn’t the basic router in the db be set to bridge mode instead of the google nest router?

2) sorry I’m quite a newbie. But if I set my google nest router into bridge mode, will it still be able to transmit signal (i.e. giving out WiFi signal)? And can it still mesh with the google nest WiFi im planning to put in the master bedroom?

1. If you set the db router are bridge mode it will disable the router function. So is as good as remove this ISP router and moved google nest as main router in the DB box. If your ISP router and Google nesh are setup as both in router.


This would create a double NAT network.


BTW google nest is best use as MAIN ROUTER! however as google mesh don't support LAN overhaul the signal to 2nd node maybe slow (depends on house layout and where u installing the 2nd node).

Google don't recommend u to set Google nest as bridge mode as you lost

  • Priority device will be unavailable.
  • DNS can’t be edited.
  • WAN settings can’t be edited.
  • Guest Wi-Fi will be unavailable.
  • Wi-Fi speed results in network check will be unavailable (but download and upload results will still work).
  • Philips Hue pairing and controls will be unavailable on OnHub devices.
Additionally, Bridge mode disables many of Google Wifi and Google Nest Wifi’s security protections. This is because your upstream router (the modem/router combo in the above scenario) is the one performing DNS steering, packet inspection, executable patching, etc.


2. If you plan to setup 2nd unit on MBR. You google nest has to be the main router.

Note: Bridge mode will only work if you’re using a single Nest Wifi router or Google Wifi point. If you’re creating a mesh network with multiple Wifi devices, your Nest Wifi router or primary Wifi point cannot be in Bridge mode.



3. If you plan to stick with google nest. Than ditch your ISP router and place the google nest into the DB box. Otherwise get another mesh system.
 

guitarunited

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@magix thanks for your insights.

I don’t mind placing the google nest router in the db box but the nest router only has 1 Ethernet port and I wouldn’t be able to fully utilize the 5 access points in the house.

I read online about using a network switch, any idea if that would work?

DB box: TP -> ONT -> Google nest router -> network switch -> various access points

Living room: access point to TV

Bedroom 1: access point to PC and place google mesh node.

MBR: access point to TV
 

magix

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@magix thanks for your insights.

I don’t mind placing the google nest router in the db box but the nest router only has 1 Ethernet port and I wouldn’t be able to fully utilize the 5 access points in the house.

I read online about using a network switch, any idea if that would work?

DB box: TP -> ONT -> Google nest router -> network switch -> various access points

Living room: access point to TV

Bedroom 1: access point to PC and place google mesh node.

MBR: access point to TV

I think u referring to LAN point right.

DB box: TP -> ONT -> Google nest router -> network switch -> various LAN points
 

guitarunited

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@magix i received an advice from another hwz user. Will you be able to advise me on the feasibility ?

DBBox: TP -> ONT -> LAN points (living room)
Living room: LAN point -> google nest router -> TV.

so my google nest router will be broadcasting signal from the living room. Does that work?
 

Apex

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@magix i received an advice from another hwz user. Will you be able to advise me on the feasibility ?

DBBox: TP -> ONT -> LAN points (living room)
Living room: LAN point -> google nest router -> TV.

so my google nest router will be broadcasting signal from the living room. Does that work?


Do take note that if you place the router (Google nest) in living room, you wouldn't be able use LAN point for other rooms. (In your last reply)

DB box: TP -> ONT -> Google nest router -> network switch -> various access points
 

celerius

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if you do place your google nest router in the db box, you'll still need to purchase a switch to also place inside the db box in order to use the lan points in the other rooms.

with the google nest router inside the db box, your other google nest wifi unit may not be able to get good signal since the the provider of the wifi is placed inside a db box.

ideally, you'll purchase a new router and switch or a router that comes with built-in switch, just to feed the rooms with internet access. with a router in the db box, your google nest wifi router can be placed outside the db box and the google nest wifi unit somewhere nearby.
 

guitarunited

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if you do place your google nest router in the db box, you'll still need to purchase a switch to also place inside the db box in order to use the lan points in the other rooms.

with the google nest router inside the db box, your other google nest wifi unit may not be able to get good signal since the the provider of the wifi is placed inside a db box.

ideally, you'll purchase a new router and switch or a router that comes with built-in switch, just to feed the rooms with internet access. with a router in the db box, your google nest wifi router can be placed outside the db box and the google nest wifi unit somewhere nearby.
i think google nest router don’t work well with other brands. And from what magix has pointed out above, google nest router has to be the main router.
I’ve found a solution but it’s more expensive.
I’ll place the google nest router in the db with a switch. In my living I’m plug my first google unit, and in the common bedroom, I’ll plug another google WiFi unit and do a wired backhaul. I’m hoping that would solve my issue
 

celerius

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I’ll place the google nest router in the db with a switch. In my living I’m plug my first google unit, and in the common bedroom, I’ll plug another google WiFi unit and do a wired backhaul. I’m hoping that would solve my issue
what's this first google unit? I thought these google nest wifi (non-router) doesn't have any ethernet ports at all?
 

guitarunited

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what's this first google unit? I thought these google nest wifi (non-router) doesn't have any ethernet ports at all?
Hi so the first google nest unit in the living room would just be wireless mesh, the second google unit (google WiFi unit, older version), would be in the common bedroom plugged into the lan point.
 

class

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hi. with mesh, why would we still need structured networking? curious to know
 

bert64

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hi. with mesh, why would we still need structured networking? curious to know
It will perform better and be more stable.
It's more considerate to your neighbours since it doesn't double your use of the shared wifi spectrum in the area.
 

guitarunited

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yeah but some laptops don't even have rj45
Wireless mesh means that the secondary node is picking up signals wirelessly mainly from the primary node and is then expanding the network range.
so if the secondary node is picking poor signals, then the strength of the network becomes weak.

when the secondary node goes wired, it gets it signal directly from the router through wire. It’s signal strength will be way better and the wireless signal it then transmit will be better too.

hope these clarifies.
 

xiaofan

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yeah but some laptops don't even have rj45

I bought a Ugreen USB 3 Gigabit Ethernet adapter for my old laptop. Normally I do not need to use it but it is useful for speed test.

Indeed wired Ethernet backhaul is better than wireless backhaul. I would even venture to say Powerline backhaul is more stable (but lower speed at 100-250Mbps ) than wireless backhaul, based on m testing of low end dual band TP-Link Deco M4 myself. If you can do structure Ethernet cabling, by all mean go ahead.

However, it may not be necessary to have structure Ethernet depending on your use cases. You may be okay with single router, or mesh with wireless backhaul.

Higher end triband mesh (2 pack or 3 pack) with wireless back haul will be good enough for most of the household. I would even venture to say majority of the household will be good enough with the combination of Asus RT-AX82U main+one or two RT-AX55 nodes (wireless backhaul) if the router is placed properly.

I myself do not have Ethernet ports in the rooms and my Asus RT-AX82U is good enough for my 106sqm old HDB flat (5GHz coverage everywhere and above 200Mbps). Before this I needed to use 4 TP-Link Deco M4 plus 4 power line adapters to cover the full flat with 5GHz and the speed is only 100M-200Mbps for the nodes because of Powerline adapter limitations.
 
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xiaofan

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For people without LAN ports at rooms, here is a video from Nergear Singapore/Malaysia using Orbi RBK753 with a relatively difficult floor plan using wireless backhaul.

 
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xiaofan

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You may have lower budget and do not want to buy triband, then it is also possible to use dual band mesh with wireless backhaul but the performance may be lower.

Here is an example with low end Netgear Orbi RBK23 -- you can see the trick is try not to put the nodes in the rooms but outside to have line of sight.

 

xiaofan

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Sometimes higher end triband (eg: RBK850) may not be good if you use only the two pack and you may need 3-pack.

Netgear has posted an honest example here. First test is with a 3-pack, second test is using 2-pack, third test is just using the main router . Please look at the second test results where the mesh node (satellite node) suffers poor speed.

 
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