if u get an ev car now, you may face this troublesome issue

amekago

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SIngapore same problem...
I give you a hint la.... EV is not going to take off in SG.
Singapore already going past EV to a hydrogen future liao..
Just think about it. Hydrogen fueling stations take up as much space as a regular petrol station.
Singapore got no space for EV charging stations.
nah...hydrogen doesnt make sense...too inefficient....might as well stick with ICE, not compelling enough to compete

EV will slowly rise in tandem with the charging infrastructure

slowly but surely
 

JAson1980

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Build ebery parking lot w a charging station then can employ many FT or ask sinkie to maintain. Create plenty of jobs.
possible but not enough power to power all. energy shortage in SIngapore. cannot build more power plants and to power all EV in every lot, need substations everywhere. No space. However all can be solved if we go nuclear which i doubt is possible.
 

amekago

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possible but not enough power to power all. energy shortage in SIngapore. cannot build more power plants and to power all EV in every lot, need substations everywhere. No space. However all can be solved if we go nuclear which i doubt is possible.
this again....ppl just blindly assume not enough power which is just pure nonsense

can easily calculate one mah

on average each car travels 20,000 km per year
on average each EV consumes 0.2 kWh per km

even if ALL CARS are EVs:

assume 600k cars in Sg
total is 20,000 X 0.2 X 600,000 = 2,400,000,000 extra kWh per year = 2.4 TWh

Sg used 50.8 Twh in 2020. So, the increase is 2.4/50.8 = 4.7%

which is surprisingly low

our power plant capacity is at only 70% (pinkie said before iirc), i think we can handle a 5% increase easily
 

Charactor

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SIngapore same problem...
I give you a hint la.... EV is not going to take off in SG.
Singapore already going past EV to a hydrogen future liao..
Just think about it. Hydrogen fueling stations take up as much space as a regular petrol station.
Singapore got no space for EV charging stations.
Yes, you hit the nail.. for 100% ev, you need to have almost 100% charging points in the carpark lots…
 

JAson1980

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nah...hydrogen doesnt make sense...too inefficient....might as well stick with ICE, not compelling enough to compete

EV will slowly rise in tandem with the charging infrastructure

slowly but surely
Yes slowly for sure. currently the first batch of EV charging stations. 60K charging stations by 2030.
But most will be AC charging which takes hours as current infra is not able to support DC charging.
 

tatsit

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possible but not enough power to power all. energy shortage in SIngapore. cannot build more power plants and to power all EV in every lot, need substations everywhere. No space. However all can be solved if we go nuclear which i doubt is possible.
so do you think hydrogen is the key to the challenges you mentioned? production of hydrogen requires electrical energy, to cater for road usage, that huge production demands huge energy. and dont forget this, every process is a loss in efficiency. from raw material -> electricity -> hydrogen -> transportation to station -> vehicle vs raw material -> electricity -> vehicle.

at the end of the day, nuclear is still the answer.
 

die

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generation and transportation of hydrogen involves energy, and in sg's case, not green.

for electricity, at least generation is not is not green, but transportation is over infrastructure and not via ICE vehicles
actually all the same ...
all is kicking the can down the slope ..
all is not green
ev vs ice ... the only green is that ev no emission of gases when driving ...
but like others mention before
all the damage already happen at the mining stages ba...
 
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JAson1980

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this again....ppl just blindly assume not enough power which is just pure nonsense

can easily calculate one mah

on average each car travels 20,000 km per year
on average each EV consumes 0.2 kWh per km

assume 20k cars in Sg
total is 20,000 X 0.2 X 20,000 = 80,000,000 extra kWh per year = 0.08 TWh

Sg used 50.8 Twh in 2020. So, the increase is 0.08/50.8 = 0.15%

do you think this has any impact on the electricity prices???


even if ALL CARS are EVs:

assume 600k cars in Sg
total is 20,000 X 0.2 X 600,000 = 2,400,000,000 extra kWh per year = 2.4 TWh

Sg used 50.8 Twh in 2020. So, the increase is 2.4/50.8 = 4.7%

which is surprisingly low

our power plant capacity is at only 70% (pinkie said before iirc), i think we can handle a 5% increase easily
Yes paper calculation is like this. Do you think the power allocation is skewed towards EV? Even the high profit datacenters are restricted to 60MW for new builds. We are facing energy shortage.
 

JAson1980

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so do you think hydrogen is the key to the challenges you mentioned? production of hydrogen requires electrical energy, to cater for road usage, that huge production demands huge energy. and dont forget this, every process is a loss in efficiency. from raw material -> electricity -> hydrogen -> transportation to station -> vehicle vs raw material -> electricity -> vehicle.

at the end of the day, nuclear is still the answer.
NOt i say one leh. a guest MIW said it. And i did mention that nuclear is the answer. Besides, if we go nuclear, it is basically a deterrent against all possible hostile neighbours. :s13:
 

infernolord

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Hydro is too costly to build and maintain.. it wont replace EV for now.
SG always take studies from US, Germany to implement policy.
And US have long thought of hydro but it is not economic of scale and not even green at all.. (Google it)
To break h20 to hydro requires more combustion energy
 

die

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Yes, you hit the nail.. for 100% ev, you need to have almost 100% charging points in the carpark lots…
the solution is not to have a 100% charging point
but to enforce additional 10x 20x the charging cost if the car still remain plug in after fully charge
then govt will laugh the bank ...
 

tatsit

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actually all the same ...
all is kicking the can down the slope ..
all is not green
ev vs ice ... the only green is that ev no emission of gases when driving ...
but like others mention before
all the damage already happen at the mining staging ba...
now it is a matter of which more green.

current technology, fuel cell still uses li-ion batteries

hydrogen ICE is still in infancy stage, more research needed

another thing i can foresee not green about hydrogen vehicle is the manufacturing of the tanks. those high pressured tanks are protected by thick layer of FRP... plastic - an environmental issue
 

enimen

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Refill time for petrol cars : < 5min
Charge time for EV in public areas : ~30min to 1hr (fast charge)

Ev charging time in public is neither here nor there. Not fast enough to charge and go, too slow to wait for it to finish.

U can go watch a movie, or have a meal. But u worry about incurring overcharging idle charges and not practicing "good" EV etiquette (ie., Charge finish and leave lot for others to charge)

And its a hassle to move vehicle out to other lots, especially in a crowded mall and u gotta do this every time u charge.

End up some owners just stay in car while family go shopping. Your role become like a chaeffeur
 

moonlighter_sg

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It is very inconvenient to charge EV. I will not spend 30min or more waiting in a petrol kiosk to charge EV. It does not make sense. We buy car for convenience.

I hope one day all the lots in HDB are charging points.
 

amekago

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Yes paper calculation is like this. Do you think the power allocation is skewed towards EV? Even the high profit datacenters are restricted to 60MW for new builds. We are facing energy shortage.
power draw limit, maybe

energy shortage, no way

come on, Sg is building mega towns like Tengah....u tell me energy shortage?

let me throw back a question....on hot nights, many if not most Singaporeans on aircon at night....doesn't this cause a power outage? no and it never will

charging an EV on level 1 or 2 is like powering a HDB with aircon, if not less
 

beano

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It is very inconvenient to charge EV. I will not spend 30min or more waiting in a petrol kiosk to charge EV. It does not make sense.
10mins charge should be enough to get you wherever you need to go, then charge at the next place again, there's no reason to charge full.
 

JAson1980

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power draw limit, maybe

energy shortage, no way

come on, Sg is building mega towns like Tengah....u tell me energy shortage?

let me throw back a question....on hot nights, many if not most Singaporeans on aircon at night....doesn't this cause a power outage? no and it never will

charging an EV on level 1 or 2 is like powering a HDB with aircon, if not less
Perhaps you are right. might not have shortage now but we are probably reaching a cap. charging 1 or 2 EVs now at every carpark don't make an impact. but if we go full EV, we might face a power shortage especially if DC charging is implemented islandwide.
 

mikezuper

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once EV infra is up, many petrol stations space will be freed up

so EV will be the future but will take time until charger is enough for everyone

if only each car has roof top of solar panel, it might alleviate the charge time a bit? Or not?
 
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