/r/SG : Are we doing enough to combat misinformation, more specifically those coming from China?

wlalala

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I would like to preface this by saying this is obviously just my opinion, and comments are always welcome. Please feel free to correct my mistakes or lack of understanding lol.

So recently I had a big argument with my mom about the safety of mRNA vaccines, and how they would supposedly cause “blood clots” and “reproductive issues” 10-20 years down the road. Young people will supposedly die en masse because of these “Western vaccines”. If these arguments sound familiar, it is because they are some of the most common bad faith arguments propagated online by countries such as China and Russia in a bid to promote their own vaccines while also trying (and succeeding) in sowing doubt and discord.

Of course, the 12 doctors expressing their opinions on that matter did not help things at all, and only served to cause more confusion around the matter. Now with the expert opinions on her side, she reasoned that the mRNA vaccine is therefore not safe for young kids, and no amount of persuasion will cause her to change her mind. So if you are one of the 12 doctors reading this, I hope you are happy, because I sure am not.

Now you might laugh and say, haha boomers am I right, but the truth is that this is a result of years of psychological warfare by adversarial states around us. In this instance, I will focus mostly on the Chinese medium, but this will still apply even if you are of other races or religions.

First of all, most of these misinformation are spread in Chinese, through platforms such as WeChat and WhatsApp where our government seems to have basically no control over. Case in point, there has yet to be a single POFMA notice listed on the platforms above, while we have had multiple on HWZ, Facebook and Twitter, which seems to limit the efficacy of such measures. I would assume that many of the folks at MCI don’t seem to use the Chinese platforms much, because why would they?

The other problem is that our only broadsheet (yes Wanbao and Shin Min don’t count) Chinese newspaper Zaobao seems to have done an exceptionally poor job of trying to dispel such rumours. Many of such articles are hidden behind paywalls, and are relatively sparse in information as compared to the ones you might find on ST or CNA. Some articles like this and opinion pieces are also not translated, and unsurprisingly this vacuum is being filled with all the trash articles online on the platforms I listed above.

I have found that older people tend to only remember the last few articles they read and base their opinions on those. However, we cannot deny that Chinese standards for the younger generation have obviously fallen off a cliff, and given our small population there was no way in hell we would be able to compete and churn out articles fast enough to keep up the ever-increasing deluge of information. Of course, there are other contributing factors, like the sheer number of PRs handed out a few years ago, but I will leave that for another time.

So now we have a group of people who are anti-vaxx, or at the very least do not trust “western vaccines” because “Sinovac is superior”, where do we go from here? For one, POFMA must start getting enforced more frequently, and on more platforms, specifically those owned by Chinese companies. Good thing Tencent and Bytedance both have offices here, and I suppose a cup of tea/kopi with the executives at Cantonment can’t hurt… (I kid, I kid.)

Zaobao also need to do a better job and stop putting vital articles behind the damn paywall. Save those for celebrity gossip BS, I’m sure there are people who will pay for that. Of course, now that SPH is wholly owned by the government, I expect things to change…

More online media outlets are also needed, as they tend to be much more flexible and attuned to the ground per say. For all the hate thrown towards Mothership(yes you guys may copy my homework), I guess it is preferable to having none and letting foreign countries dictate what we read.

TLDR: China vaccine misinformation too powerful, experts start to contradict one another, nobody knows how WeChat works and Zaobao is useless.

 

Renzokukenz

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I have an educated friend who is about 15 years older than me

he told me back when he was a child, it was obvious that the Chinese (from China) is trying to play guerrilla tactics in Singapore
purposely spreading communist ideals

he said it was very obvious then, that those agents are in Singapore

now in 2021, they got smarter and they blend in and then sought discord and propaganda
and I have certainly met one or two in this forum which I have duly blocked

China VS US
just remember we are our own nation
and that whatever information or side we take must always be beneficial for Singapore and this country which our families and us depend on
 

desmond_yee1

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I have an educated friend who is about 15 years older than me

he told me back when he was a child, it was obvious that the Chinese (from China) is trying to play guerrilla tactics in Singapore
purposely spreading communist ideals

he said it was very obvious then, that those agents are in Singapore

now in 2021, they got smarter and they blend in and then sought discord and propaganda
and I have certainly met one or two in this forum which I have duly blocked

China VS US
just remember we are our own nation
and that whatever information or side we take must always be beneficial for Singapore and this country which our families and us depend on
so do you mean everyone who questions USA mRNA vax are CCP agents?
 

Renzokukenz

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so do you mean everyone who questions USA mRNA vax are CCP agents?
no

question both sides
but if someone try time and time and time and again to distort facts against one particular side

then he/she is an agent from either country

the encounter i had
I and he came to an amicable scientific conclusion
we agreed that we should not look at antibodies rate as a response to vaccine efficacy
so I said, perhaps Sinovac may have other merits but it has yet to be documented

this person said my conclusion is sound, and we stopped our discussion.

ONLY TO, revive the same thread which I made 3 WEEKS LATER, and REPEAT the same tactics, asking the SAME QUESTIONS he asked which we both have concluded, and then twisting words that I said

I ignored it, then 2 WEEKS LATER, he did the same again with the same line of reasoning


Vaccines are made by scientists
their efficacy can be objectively measured, there are data behind them

any claims made, should be substantiated with data
said person who is prolly a real CCP agent first acted normal and cast reasonable doubt on US vaccines (this part is correct), then he will slowly inch his conversation and stance towards why SinoVac is better, with NO DATA, no FACTS, no nothing

if you're a Singaporean and you're reading this
just be mindful that we are our own nation, while we can have biases, always remember not to lose track of reality and end up being brainwashed by either side
 

soaresb

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They should start with their own fake news. Spread misinformation often, and often it's due to their laziness to even read the article of the submission.

Sinkies are really not worth speaking up for. The 12 doctors said the long term effects of mRNA vaccines are unknown and this is a fact.
11 retracted already. Hammer came down hard, I guess these Redditors must be pleased?
 

Renzokukenz

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so do you mean everyone who questions USA mRNA vax are CCP agents?
I questioned mRNA vaccines all the time
but I am lucky because I have friends who are researchers whom I can ask directly and not rely on random strangers on the internet who does not know anything or how to contextualized information they came across online

the long-term effects of mRNA vaccine are safe in theory
you are right that there are NO CLINICAL (aka real experiments) on its safety in the long term, but this is simply because by virtue of the fact that mRNA vaccines are relatively new in the world.

so let me say this, you are right, because there lacks clinical data, reasonable doubt can be cast on mRNA's vaccine long term side effects

but consider this
if 100 years ago, people back then waited for CLINICAL (AKA REAL LIFE EXPERIMENTS) for deactivated virus particles vaccine, most of the population would have died of smallpox

it's a matter of urgency and erring on the side of the greater good for both you and I, than to make decisions in ABSOLUTE terms


consider this fact
mRNA is made in your body all the time, it is how some cells in your body "instruct" other cells to do certain things

also consider this fact:
RNA is extremely fragile, after injection, they don't last long in the body because they are like freshly cut apples, they will fade away fast. this is why mRNA vaccines need to be refrigerated at such low temperatures (-18 Celcius) I think

you can choose to not be vaccinated, that is your right
you can also choose to be vaccinated by sinoVac over Pfizer

but after considering all facts
the objective truth is that the logical conclusion would be to take the HSA Approved mRNA vaccines

what you want to do is your choice
but don't be a fact-denier

you can prefer drinking Coca Cola to eating apples,
you can avoid all apples your entire life
but you shouldn't deny the fact that apples are healthier and better than you than Coke

you can choose to drink coke until the day you die, it is your right
but if you let your preference for coke let you tell others that "Apples are bad for you", then you have crossed the line
thank you
 
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workingclass

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LOL. Because he did a poor job of convincing his mum, we have to have more censorship and thought police?

Not say I want to say but YP are really clueless regarding of which gen they are.
 

happygenius

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Chinese disinformation and propaganda campaigns are a problem for the world
China use billions of their cheap slave labor to spread lies and disinformation even prisoners
It’s not enough to use their cheap labour and pay them wumao RMB. They use free labour - prisoners
All the wumaos we see commenting in this forum could be prisoners posting from a Chinese prison
 

PatrickTheStarFish

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no

question both sides
but if someone try time and time and time and again to distort facts against one particular side

then he/she is an agent from either country

the encounter i had
I and he came to an amicable scientific conclusion
we agreed that we should not look at antibodies rate as a response to vaccine efficacy
so I said, perhaps Sinovac may have other merits but it has yet to be documented

this person said my conclusion is sound, and we stopped our discussion.

ONLY TO, revive the same thread which I made 3 WEEKS LATER, and REPEAT the same tactics, asking the SAME QUESTIONS he asked which we both have concluded, and then twisting words that I said

I ignored it, then 2 WEEKS LATER, he did the same again with the same line of reasoning


Vaccines are made by scientists
their efficacy can be objectively measured, there are data behind them

any claims made, should be substantiated with data
said person who is prolly a real CCP agent first acted normal and cast reasonable doubt on US vaccines (this part is correct), then he will slowly inch his conversation and stance towards why SinoVac is better, with NO DATA, no FACTS, no nothing

if you're a Singaporean and you're reading this
just be mindful that we are our own nation, while we can have biases, always remember not to lose track of reality and end up being brainwashed by either side
We all know who

a Man who cannot Think

🤣
 

ghuathuatm

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Chinese disinformation and propaganda campaigns are a problem for the world
China use billions of their cheap slave labor to spread lies and disinformation even prisoners
It’s not enough to use their cheap labour and pay them wumao RMB. They use free labour - prisoners
All the wumaos we see commenting in this forum could be prisoners posting from a Chinese prison
Poor thing, sure will be punished deep deep by the supervisors for exposing such info
 

Insatiable_creat

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As much as I dislike those propaganda, the author actually wanted POFMA on these platforms?!

It would be a disastrous to have PAP pushing their stupid pofma laws on these platforms.
 

happygenius

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We all know who

a Man who cannot Think

🤣
That guy is clearly a Chinese agent of influence and now they are stirring race relations in SG.

Another interesting thing of note is that a sizable number of the wumaos advancing CCP’s interests abroad are also anti-PAP, pretending to be pro-democracy.

This is an interesting and funny development, which I actually think makes a wonderfully newsy human interest article in a liberal western media. In Singapore, they pretend to take the anti PAP stand, and pretend to be pro-democracy, and against the high-handed ways of the ruling government, yet at the same time they agitate for the CCP, which is a far more vile, brutal and ruthless dictatorship than the PAP is. If we coolly examine the PAP, the worst sin we can think of for the PAP is at the most, greed. China makes the PAP look like Mother Theresa when compared side-by-side.

There’s immense hypocrisy in this, and also extremely illogical.

A highly probable hypothesis that many watchers have is that their anti PAP/ruling government position is taken to keep the governments in the countries in Southeast Asia busy, so the government would be distracted and would neglect defense issues, and let down their guard on the threat from CCP.

Hongkies and Taiwanese are consistent in their pro democracy activities (pro democracy Hongkies and the DPP voters in Taiwan stand for pro democracy and anti China). Their values towards democracy in their own countries and their values against China are consistent.

High chance these agitators in SG internet space who pretend to be anti PAP are actually paid shills of China, their work is meant to keep the governments ruling the various Asian countries busy so they don’t have the resources to put in national defense.
 
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