Career advise

[lunatic_tokyo]

Hi everyone,

I am not sure if this is an appropriate place to seek your advise but i do hope that someone will be able to share your experience or point of view on my issue.

Please bear with my introduction, I will be going through a mid-career transistion, spend a good 10 years in services with the SAF.
Currently, still waiting for my final year accounting & finance result to be out. There is intention of self taking CMFAS paper before hand if necessary.

I am planning to get into banking sale line and currently looking at the following 2 position from DBS and OCBC. Position as follows:

1) DBS branch Relationship manager
2) OCBC Personal financial Consultant


In case if you are wondering why only DBS or OCBC?
After some research, their way of educating their junior sales personnel seem more suitable to me. No offence to the others working in different banks or sales line.
As I am more keen into a systematic learning approach and possibilities of wider range of products open to a junior sales personnel.
Strong believe in getting my basic core skills/knowledges right from the start.

I am unable to source for details on the career progression of individual career path as in how long does it take to progress through the ranks and what is the estimate starting salary range.

Please advise.
Thank you.

 

[Hyruga]

Dont think its possible for you to become manager directly without relevant sales and banking experience.

 

[vivalarave]

Any sales job is based upon sales volume and how active recruitment plus training.
Commission plus overriding as an upgrade not like saf where it is based on time and upgrades.

 

[mollys]

are you sure you want to sell insurance? insurance is one of the main and most profitable banking products. i suggest u spend more time understanding the different policy plans and how they add value to your customers. it'll be easier on the day of your interview.

 

[PostCountWarrior[+1]]

Hi everyone,

I am not sure if this is an appropriate place to seek your advise but i do hope that someone will be able to share your experience or point of view on my issue.

Please bear with my introduction, I will be going through a mid-career transistion, spend a good 10 years in services with the SAF.
Currently, still waiting for my final year accounting & finance result to be out. There is intention of self taking CMFAS paper before hand if necessary.

I am planning to get into banking sale line and currently looking at the following 2 position from DBS and OCBC. Position as follows:

1) DBS branch Relationship manager
2) OCBC Personal financial Consultant


In case if you are wondering why only DBS or OCBC?
After some research, their way of educating their junior sales personnel seem more suitable to me. No offence to the others working in different banks or sales line.
As I am more keen into a systematic learning approach and possibilities of wider range of products open to a junior sales personnel.
Strong believe in getting my basic core skills/knowledges right from the start.

I am unable to source for details on the career progression of individual career path as in how long does it take to progress through the ranks and what is the estimate starting salary range.

Please advise.
Thank you.

sorry to pour cold water on u but u get into the interview first then we can discuss about career routes.

Its like me asking I am interested in being a trader for Goldman Sachs and JP Morgan only because they have a structured training program, blah blah blah.

Ur education I would assume is from SIM? frankly ur age, education background n past exp works against u. not sure DBS and UOB will even want u. Keep ur options open. If you have not left SAF, pls dun leave yet. The outside world is not that friendly especially to ex SAF regulars.

My hard truths to u.

pcw +1

 

[vivalarave]

actually if you really want to work in the banking line in the sales front end..
heres what you can do, join as a FA and take the subsidized CMFAS certs.

Not all banks do their own underwriting of insurance, most cross sell products.
Unit trust varies from many other fund management.

Once you gain enough exp in sell these basic banking products and have a good base network of clientele/referral then you move over and bring your clients with you.

degree is good but not very important, more importantly is your CMFAS certs and your sales experience and your ready network to produce sales volume.

If you cannot survive being a FA and doing sales, it'll be worst when you get a base salary because you are under pressure to produce and hit quota if not they'll kick you out as fast as they let you in and they're not as forgiving as the SAF or a back end job.

Age wise I don't see it as a problem unless it affects your capacity to learn.

 

[lunatic_tokyo]

are you sure you want to sell insurance? insurance is one of the main and most profitable banking products. i suggest u spend more time understanding the different policy plans and how they add value to your customers. it'll be easier on the day of your interview.

Hi mollys,

Thanks for your advise, will take note of their products before interview.

sorry to pour cold water on u but u get into the interview first then we can discuss about career routes.

Its like me asking I am interested in being a trader for Goldman Sachs and JP Morgan only because they have a structured training program, blah blah blah.

Ur education I would assume is from SIM? frankly ur age, education background n past exp works against u. not sure DBS and UOB will even want u. Keep ur options open. If you have not left SAF, pls dun leave yet. The outside world is not that friendly especially to ex SAF regulars.

My hard truths to u.

pcw +1

Hi PostCountWarrior,

Appreciate your concern with the facts and truths advise.
I will definately be leaving the SAF. As regard to my education, i did not take up my course from SIM.
I understand your concern of past work experience issue are hard to relate to new job environment. My experience involved media, event organising and direct contact with public.

I am currently waiting for interview.
May I ask if you was previously from SAF as well?

actually if you really want to work in the banking line in the sales front end..
heres what you can do, join as a FA and take the subsidized CMFAS certs.

Not all banks do their own underwriting of insurance, most cross sell products.
Unit trust varies from many other fund management.

Once you gain enough exp in sell these basic banking products and have a good base network of clientele/referral then you move over and bring your clients with you.

degree is good but not very important, more importantly is your CMFAS certs and your sales experience and your ready network to produce sales volume.

If you cannot survive being a FA and doing sales, it'll be worst when you get a base salary because you are under pressure to produce and hit quota if not they'll kick you out as fast as they let you in and they're not as forgiving as the SAF or a back end job.

Age wise I don't see it as a problem unless it affects your capacity to learn.

Hi Vivalarave,

Yes i want to be in the sales line of banking industry.
Please correct me if i am wrong, as you mention about FA, i think from the desription mention in their web page, the above mention 2 position seem to match your advise.

Am I right to mention that FA do not have any base salary? Income is purely base on sales commission?

I am wondering if it will be a sound advise to take up CMFAS even before joining the company, as I wonder if this will be a worthwhile head start.

Will experience in self investment help in anyway for preparation?

Feel free to comment and provide any advise.

Thank you.

 

[vivalarave]

CMFAS book through agency is cheaper plus they'll sponsor it if you join them.

Having investment knowledge makes you credible to your prospects and allow you connect to them but that's that.

But if you rely on book smarts to get you sales, you'll be in for a very big suprize
There are people in the banking sales line who have no clue about investment with only a diploma or o level but they only know how to sell their products and they can earn alot of money.

You are in the sales line not going to be a propriety trader or fund manager, you're most definately not going to be an investment banker.
You are not going to look at charts and you are not going to be an analyst, they can easily get the best and brightest from the big 4 Unis to do that.

So why should they pick you? Hard truth aside..coming back to the compensation

In an insurance agency, they have part comm/part basic or pure basic.
In a bank, it is basic and comm.

The difference is the quotas you have to hit and sales volume you have to produce to get your bonuses or perks that they throw out.
Of course with a basic, it means you have a duty to hit targets if not they'll just kick you out and find another person.

A headstart is not how much paper/cert you can collect but how many leads you can exploit to make your sales volume.

a sales job is a sales job, don't think like you're doing a C level management, your job is to generate new leads, sell and gain revenue.

Maybe as you get more senior in the bank and bring in more sales and with the company long enough, that you'll have to recruit and train your team or they allow you to sell more complex products which scales to the high network clientele with an increment in your basic. (not exactly sure but I'm guessing)

Your experience in PR,Event organization etc are handled by the bank's marcomm or outsourced, which renders it moot in this instance.
If I was you i'd recommend you reading into sales technique and learning how to sell while actively networking and rekindle old ties for your future in the sales job.

If you have not done prior sales before in a banking or insurance background or do not come from a high networth family (elite), chances are slim unless you have a friends inside to pull some strings.
I might be wrong but I suggest you don't pin your hopes too high, and follow my previous advice to be a FA in a insurance agency first - I'm also planning this route.

 

[Triste]

I beg to differ, i've been in this line for 5 years and I think you'll stand a good chance of learning and rising through the ranks in a foreign bank.

 

[traveller6]

I beg to differ, i've been in this line for 5 years and I think you'll stand a good chance of learning and rising through the ranks in a foreign bank.

Hi Triste, mind sharing more? Is it difficult to hit the targets if you work really hard? I have few offers to consider but I cannot make up my mind.

1) RM in foreign bank
2) Recruitment consultant
3) Auditor in Big 4

I am keen on fast-progression and prepared to work long hours. Any kind advice will be greatly appreciated. Thanks!

 

[lousylah]

Hi Triste, mind sharing more? Is it difficult to hit the targets if you work really hard? I have few offers to consider but I cannot make up my mind.

1) RM in foreign bank
2) Recruitment consultant
3) Auditor in Big 4

I am keen on fast-progression and prepared to work long hours. Any kind advice will be greatly appreciated. Thanks!

define "fast-progression"? if you just want money, go to sales (i.e. option 1) and working long hours means nothing unless you bill clients by man hour (consultancy, legal, etc).

and by "RM in foreign bank" you mean personal banker in citi, anz, maybank or cimb (malaysian also foreign right?) , its not much different from the insurance salesmen talking to strangers in the mall. just that you have a basic and less freedom (banking hours, branch/desk-bound, etc) afterall your most profitable biz is bancassurance. the real RMs are in PB (Private Banking), WM, AM and Corp Bank.

recruitment does make good money as well and if you do it well with a reputable firm, you have a chance of becoming an in-house recruiter with a MNC for more stability. but unlikely you make more money than a successful Personal Banker.

auditors have quite a set starting pay and progression. you will live comfortably but not get rich. and the crazy hours during peak periods.

i have 2 personal friends (<30) with no degree (1 pte dip, 1 poly dip) making handsome sums of money (6 digits) as insurance agent and personal banker respectively. they have the same personality trait - thick-skinned. i also know others (acquaintances) with degree (1 pte, 1 local u) who have been personal bankers for a number of years. i do not know how much they make but the fact they are still in the same line means they are doing fine.

as one poster said, sales is just sales. education and age doesn't matter. forget lofty aspirations of climbing the ladder, only the numbers matter.

 

[ufoate]

Hi Triste, mind sharing more? Is it difficult to hit the targets if you work really hard? I have few offers to consider but I cannot make up my mind.

1) RM in foreign bank
2) Recruitment consultant
3) Auditor in Big 4

I am keen on fast-progression and prepared to work long hours. Any kind advice will be greatly appreciated. Thanks!

I have similar offers

Big 4 auditor and RM in a Local bank.

I'm also in a dilemma and I can't make up my mind! Can someone enlighten me? Thanks!

 

[sAVaGEmP5]

I beg to differ, i've been in this line for 5 years and I think you'll stand a good chance of learning and rising through the ranks in a foreign bank.

Survivorship bias. Just like hedge Funds. eg. Those who are still surviving in this line are likely to succeed. Those unsuccessful, has left, quit for greener pastures. What works for u may not work for others.

 

[GoodServices]

Got looks & figure plus a bonus tongue skill, who doesn't want to strike a deal with you. It's the same in every field in the sales line