Volunteers in the SAF

[arsey1009]

Hi guys

In light of the commissioning of the 'Support NS' study team as well as the establishment of 'Our Singapore Conversation', it has become pretty apparent that the government has acknowledged the rising levels of disgruntlement and dissatisfaction amongst citizens.

There have been letters written in by members of the public to suggest that 1st gen permanent residents / foreigners / women (members of society who have no legal obligation to serve national service) be given the chance to volunteer to serve.

Just interested to know what you guys think - do you think a volunteering scheme in the SAF for those not required to serve national service is a feasible idea and in which areas do you think these people can extend their service to in the SAF? (i.e. females can be nurses / medics, or if willing, a combatant, etc. etc.)

Interested to know what you guys think! Pls, no harangues or hateful comments about foreigners or lampooning of the govt on this thread! (I believe there are many other threads for you out there should you wanna do so.. hahaha.. )

 

[Kiwi8]

Well, they can volunteer, but I think it will not appease the dissatisfaction of the citizens that much since it's voluntary and not compulsory. The citizens' attention will then focus on those who did not volunteer.

 

[koxinga]

I see no link between dealing with dissatisfaction and volunteering either.

Those that are interested 'to serve the community' already got the opportunity to do so by joining PA as community leaders and these are already a minority.

Those who are interested in volunteering to wear a uniform are likely to be even less. For your information, the Police Force's Volunteer Special Constabulary (VSC) already allows PR to join.

Given this two options, you think more people (PR) will wanna wear SAF green and run around in Mandai?

 

[sunzoner]

Hi guys

In light of the commissioning of the 'Support NS' study team as well as the establishment of 'Our Singapore Conversation', it has become pretty apparent that the government has acknowledged the rising levels of disgruntlement and dissatisfaction amongst citizens.

There have been letters written in by members of the public to suggest that 1st gen permanent residents / foreigners / women (members of society who have no legal obligation to serve national service) be given the chance to volunteer to serve.

Just interested to know what you guys think - do you think a volunteering scheme in the SAF for those not required to serve national service is a feasible idea and in which areas do you think these people can extend their service to in the SAF? (i.e. females can be nurses / medics, or if willing, a combatant, etc. etc.)

Interested to know what you guys think! Pls, no harangues or hateful comments about foreigners or lampooning of the govt on this thread! (I believe there are many other threads for you out there should you wanna do so.. hahaha.. )

You are targetting the wrong solution to the problem.

The problem is not that there is no means to volunteer for NS or other means to contribute to Singapore, but rather citizens being disadvantaged by NS in comparison to foreigner.

 

[akloaklo]

Why would someone put themselves in a bad situation?

Unless they have interest in living in a hot/stuffy and dirty jungle with no much freedom.

If I am pr or converted citizen my spare time will be for leisure activities!

 

[arsey1009]

Hi sunzoner,

I was probably a little ambiguous; I did not intend to mean that volunteering would present itself as a panacea to the disgruntlement and dissatisfaction experienced by locals.

It's just that with all the dissatisfaction in Singapore, the government is increasingly inclined to listen to the opinions of Singaporeans - some of which suggest that volunteering would be a good option for those who are under no legal obligation whatsoever to be enlisted for national service.

The crux of my question is - where/what do you think volunteers can serve in/as the SAF and whether a volunteering scheme in the SAF (not police force, yes i do know that there is a constabulary force which comprises of volunteers) is a feasible one. (the policy per se; not perceiving it in conjunction with the entire societal backdrop)

 

[superman]

Most foreigners work in Singapore is because their company post them here or they are employed by a company here, their company will not be happy that their staff is serving NS instead of contributing to their company unless its a Govt Company then different case.

 

[sunzoner]

Hi sunzoner,

I was probably a little ambiguous; I did not intend to mean that volunteering would present itself as a panacea to the disgruntlement and dissatisfaction experienced by locals.

It's just that with all the dissatisfaction in Singapore, the government is increasingly inclined to listen to the opinions of Singaporeans - some of which suggest that volunteering would be a good option for those who are under no legal obligation whatsoever to be enlisted for national service.

The crux of my question is - where/what do you think volunteers can serve in/as the SAF and whether a volunteering scheme in the SAF (not police force, yes i do know that there is a constabulary force which comprises of volunteers) is a feasible one. (the policy per se; not perceiving it in conjunction with the entire societal backdrop)

Then you need to tell us:
why do you want volunteers to serve in the SAF or whatsnot
who are you targetting

Lets have proper context before we give feedback. Else, we are just brainstorming in the dark.

 

[Inix]

The government is actually missing the point. The situation is more about PRs and new Citizens gaining an unfair advantage during reservist liabilities. The 2 years might be a bitch, but after going through with it, most people just go on with their lives.

The current situation isn't exactly fair to us. Losing up to 40 days of your life yearly to the state by right shouldn't be that big a deal, but it does put us in an extremely unfair advantage, especially when we have work-life to manage.

Complaints were always numerous, especially the rigid manner that SAF handles the deferments, but it was still manageable considering that all citizen guys had to do it anyway, so the playing field wasn't particularly unfair so to speak, and hence, grumbles were just that, grumbles.

But the situation has changed. NS liabilities is now a serious liabilities. Employers suddenly have the wide choice of choosing anyone, especially people who are not subjected to CPF liabilities (thats 14.5%) and another 10% in the form of NS. That's effectively a 25% savings in terms of manpower costs. It's not their (as in the foreigner's fault). Its the government's fault for allowing this to happen.

As foreign labour become exceedingly easy to source, local labour automatically takes a back-seat as people now can hire anyone to do the job. They don't have to be good. They just need to be cheap, and fit the bill. This is a self perpetuating problem. Locals started being passed by for promotion, and NS, like it or not, IS a problem.

There is no easy solution. I see NS, in its purest form (putting aside all the **** we go through) as a means to toughen ourselves up, AND also really to serve our country and do our little part for National Security, so personally I don't like the way that the government has gone about doing this, trying to incentivise NS in the monetary form, but that is the cheapest, fastest, and probably easiest way for them.

To really make citizen happy, they need to go back to the root of the problem. Of how NS can be disruptive to our careers, to our families. And that how we can protect our citizenry against being discriminated against, being displaced when we are doing our National Duty.

 

[koxinga]

The crux of my question is - where/what do you think volunteers can serve in/as the SAF and whether a volunteering scheme in the SAF (not police force, yes i do know that there is a constabulary force which comprises of volunteers) is a feasible one. (the policy per se; not perceiving it in conjunction with the entire societal backdrop)

We not SAF leh, u ask like this, no right no wrong answer. I don't see a point for combat vocation because u need serve and train on a regular basis and you probably need a minimum number of people to make such a programme viable. Abit difficult if you are thinking of something like National Guard.

This leaves non-combat professions and essentially, skill based volunteers (e.g doctor, engineer) where they can contribute in specific areas and these units are able to better absorb their skills.

 

[arsey1009]

yes, there are no right/wrong answers, just interested in all your opinions

Btw that's a very interesting view there; I do largely agree with your response. Combatants do have to undergo prolonged periods of training - it might not be suitable for volunteers since large concessions would have to be made on their part (and hence disruptive to their civilian lives).

Let's say that the aim of this scheme would be to foster rapport and bonds between fellow countrymen (not just men-men but men-women etc.) through a common experience - do you think that the volunteer scheme would be a good one since it allows for those who do not have a chance to serve to actually give it a go (and hence experience what NS is like and empathize with fellow NSFs/NSmen)?

Looking forward to your opinion!

 

[koxinga]

To what end? U wanna talk about PR, 1 gen PR or just anyone?

It would just be a glorified team building exercise.

 

[arsey1009]

yes it might be a glorified team building exercise, but if it is efficacious and bolsters social cohesion then I don't see why not.

and I believe that it would be more common-sensical to target the new generation of PRs

 

[superman]

The recent comment by a female DJ show that alot of people especially those who have not been through NS does not appreciate the sacrifices made by NSF and NSmen. Probably letting female singaporeans do so sort of NS will let them appreciate NS more.

 

[sunzoner]

We not SAF leh, u ask like this, no right no wrong answer. I don't see a point for combat vocation because u need serve and train on a regular basis and you probably need a minimum number of people to make such a programme viable. Abit difficult if you are thinking of something like National Guard.

This leaves non-combat professions and essentially, skill based volunteers (e.g doctor, engineer) where they can contribute in specific areas and these units are able to better absorb their skills.

So that in times of war, they return to their home country and leaves us without these specialist? Great call!

 

[sunzoner]

yes it might be a glorified team building exercise, but if it is efficacious and bolsters social cohesion then I don't see why not.

and I believe that it would be more common-sensical to target the new generation of PRs

So NS is no longer about defense? Or they go on team building while we do guard duty?