Why the double standards?

SkyShroud · Apr 5, 2022

So I was banned because of....

https://forums.hardwarezone.com.sg/...n-of-ukraine-has-begun.6703251/post-140801221and
https://forums.hardwarezone.com.sg/...n-of-ukraine-has-begun.6703251/post-140801314
Firstly, the first warning is actually
Forum Nuisance (Trolling / Troublemaker / Clone Account / Etc.) but I dare assume whoever mod that gave the warning really doesn't give a single hoot about proper labelling.

To the first warning I also do question the fairness of it as I can very easily search out similar posts that did similar things without getting warned for it.

To the second warning which is "Derail Thread" and I quote the following given by a mod to gave an idea of the line of what derail means

cranthir said:
it s a thread about latest happening in the russia war, why are you discussing sino-japan war and also history about USA and chinese.

I understand you are the not one who start going off track and its georgemcics, do note he has been given a far longer ban than you. Pls dun be baited into derailing the thread.

To that, these following posts are according his logic deemed as derailed topics

Now, before I continue, I have to emphasized I searched that one thread in convenient of that mod's quote, that's only like a third of the thread too. Arguably, the first spoiler of "trolls" can also be considered derailment, yes it is unfairly broad and vague rule.

The point here is there are plenty of posts that are not warned given the similar nature of the contents yet my posts are warned. I am not interested in admins or moderators unwinding my ban because you can't as I already served it. I do expect an explanations of this obvious double standards and as of now I have every reason to believe whoever mod that applied these infractions on me is being bias, unfair and even possibly personal.

cranthir · Apr 7, 2022

@verynerd whom you were replying to was also warned. so I m not sure what the double standard.

did you report the other poster?

we only respond to what people reported, we dun actively vet every posts.

Warning is valid from what i see,

SkyShroud · Apr 7, 2022

cranthir said:
@verynerd whom you were replying to was also warned. so I m not sure what the double standard.

did you report the other poster?

we only respond to what people reported, we dun actively vet every posts.

Warning is valid from what i see,

Punishing both users involve in the arguable, though I am technically not even arguing with him, is not what I am referring to your double standards.

Evidently, you have said that you moderators only punish people on report basis and in that case, I will help you by reporting thousands of posts similar to mine which I am warned for and I sincerely hope that you walk the talk and punish those posts as well. Meanwhile, I will also encourage others to report too!!

Orionz · Apr 7, 2022

SkyShroud said:
Punishing both users involve in the arguable, though I am technically not even arguing with him, is not what I am referring to your double standards.

Evidently, you have said that you moderators only punish people on report basis and in that case, I will help you by reporting thousands of posts similar to mine which I am warned for and I sincerely hope that you walk the talk and punish those posts as well. Meanwhile, I will also encourage others to report too!!

Can we all not report every little thing? It really spoils the forum culture and send the community into a downward spiral. Let's live and let live.

An analogy:

Someone illegally parks on the street, kenna summon. Then he go complain to LTA, why some of his neighbour illegally park also never kenna fine. Why double standard. LTA replies, when one of our officers happen to be there, or if someone reports, then we will surely fine.

Then the person goes on to actively spot and report all illegally parking cars everyday. In response, all his neighbours also begin to do that. Soon after, the entire neighbourhood's mood and culture goes into a downward spiral of you report me, i report you... Everyone uses binoculars to spy on everyone else

Maybe instead of doing that, he could join in solidarity with his neighbours and inform everyone on whatsapp when he see a LTA officer around. Won't that make better place for all?

SkyShroud · Apr 7, 2022

Orionz said:
Can we all not report report every little thing? It really spoils the forum culture and send the community into a downward spiral. Let's live and let live.

An analogy:

Someone illegally parks on the street, kenna summon. Then he go complain to LTA, why some of his neighbour illegally park also never kenna fine. Why double standard. LTA replies, when one of our officers happen to be there, or if someone reports, then we will surely fine.

Then the person goes on to actively spot and report every single illegally parked car. In response, all his neighbours begin to do that as well. Soon after, the entire neighbourhood's mood and culture goes into a downward spiral...

Maybe instead of doing that, he could join in solidarity with his neighbours and inform everyone on whatsapp when he see a LTA officer around. Won't that make better place for all?

No, when people report you, it is because they don't like you and not all of us are in this forums because wanting to be liked, we just want to voice our opinions and apply karma on others.

In my case, I have seen @verynerd post history where he troll others and not warned, so I totally believe it is fine for me to do the same but I am warned. This moderator tell me that they run by report basis, in that case, I will help the moderators do their job while ensuring that I don't feel my feeling is being hurt from the double standards.

PikaPika33 · Apr 7, 2022

Orionz said:
Can we all not report every little thing? It really spoils the forum culture and send the community into a downward spiral. Let's live and let live.

An analogy:

Someone illegally parks on the street, kenna summon. Then he go complain to LTA, why some of his neighbour illegally park also never kenna fine. Why double standard. LTA replies, when one of our officers happen to be there, or if someone reports, then we will surely fine.

Then the person goes on to actively spot and report all illegally parking cars everyday. In response, all his neighbours also begin to do that. Soon after, the entire neighbourhood's mood and culture goes into a downward spiral of you report me, i report you... Everyone uses binoculars to spy on everyone else

Maybe instead of doing that, he could join in solidarity with his neighbours and inform everyone on whatsapp when he see a LTA officer around. Won't that make better place for all?

cos this is what they are encouraging

Kumar22 · Apr 8, 2022

PikaPika33 said:
cos this is what they are encouraging

Which is neither here nor there. Resolves nothing, leaving a bad taste and ill feeling all the time.

Infracting should never be the first choice of action, it should close to the last.
Each report where possible should be taken in context of what's happening in that thread.
Just because the agent provocateur isn't reported that shouldn't mean he should be allowed to go unpunished or his victim get's punished, which is exactly what he desires.

So in the end, the bigger offender gets scot free, while the target is infarcted. This is what trolling is all about.
And the Mods walked right into it and sided with the troll.

Shion · Apr 9, 2022

Kumar22 said:
Which is neither here nor there. Resolves nothing, leaving a bad taste and ill feeling all the time.

Infracting should never be the first choice of action, it should close to the last.
Each report where possible should be taken in context of what's happening in that thread.
Just because the agent provocateur isn't reported that shouldn't mean he should be allowed to go unpunished or his victim get's punished, which is exactly what he desires.

So in the end, the bigger offender gets scot free, while the target is infarcted. This is what trolling is all about.
And teh Mods walked right into it and sided with the troll.

I think next time, when in doubt, just mass report whatever inappropriate posts you see, since mods only act when it is being reported

SkyShroud · Apr 9, 2022

mrclubbie said:
I think next time, when in doubt, just mass report whatever inappropriate posts you see, since mods only act when it is being reported

I have come to understand that not all trolling will be warned despite trolling itself is breaking the rule. It seems like mods only care about trolling reported by the subject of the trolling. Likewise, not all derail post are considered derail post, which by itself I have no idea where they draw such line, this is in contradiction of what the moderator wrote himself / herself. The lack of consistency in the way they perform mod actions have further prove double standards therefore drawing more doubts from the publics.

Or perhaps they perform report base by "numbers" of reports which is to say they only take actions if "massive" report is made on that subject, an "threshold" reporting mechanism, which also suggest that if the subject is the most hated person in the community, he or she will be subject to be report abuse.

cranthir · Apr 9, 2022

PikaPika33 said:
cos this is what they are encouraging

thats not what we encouraged.
we encourage not replying to trolls and being baited into fights, you can see from recent feedback that we crack down heavily on fight bait threads and posts.

Kumar22 said:
Which is neither here nor there. Resolves nothing, leaving a bad taste and ill feeling all the time.

Infracting should never be the first choice of action, it should close to the last.
Each report where possible should be taken in context of what's happening in that thread.
Just because the agent provocateur isn't reported that shouldn't mean he should be allowed to go unpunished or his victim get's punished, which is exactly what he desires.

So in the end, the bigger offender gets scot free, while the target is infarcted. This is what trolling is all about.
And the Mods walked right into it and sided with the troll.

Dear Kumar, if you actually read the posts, you will see thats not true.

SkyShroud said:
I have come to understand that not all trolling will be warned despite trolling itself is breaking the rule. It seems like mods only care about trolling reported by the subject of the trolling. Likewise, not all derail post are considered derail post, which by itself I have no idea where they draw such line, this is in contradiction of what the moderator wrote himself / herself. The lack of consistency in the way they perform mod actions have further prove double standards therefore drawing more doubts from the publics.

Or perhaps they perform report base by "numbers" of reports which is to say they only take actions if "massive" report is made on that subject, an "threshold" reporting mechanism, which also suggest that if the subject is the most hated person in the community, he or she will be subject to be report abuse.

I hope you can understand there are many frivolous reports that we ignore too. The less frivolous reports we get, the easier its for us to pay attention to offensive posts.

If its only one report on offensive post, we will take action. if there are many reports on what we consider a ok post, we will reject those reports too.

we do try to track back a few posts but hope you understand we cannot vet every posts.

Do not spam reports just because you do not like the person. It create a toxic culture in the forum. Dun get triggered by every things to retaliate. There is an ignore button. If you really think its a valid offensive post and report, we will take a look.

Just react how you react in real life, if people stab you, does it make it ok to stab him back?
because the police told you that you should make a report, you start stalking and reporting everything. Is this right?

Please have some sense about this. Thanks

SkyShroud · Apr 9, 2022

cranthir said:
we crack down heavily on fight bait threads and posts.

That is also part of I am finding double standards of. There are lot of trollish posts that are provocative in nature and all the troll post I reported thus far are provocative in their own ways. However, it seems to me that you moderators only care about posts which evidently turn into an actual conflicts. It is quite contradictory to not wanting to create a toxic culture when provocative trollish posts are permitted, then blame the users who got "baited" into it when you moderators permitted such trollish post in the first place by deeming them as frivolous. It also because you permitted such posts in the first place, you gave all the users the impressions that such posts are allowed.

You either draw the line or you don't.

cranthir · Apr 9, 2022

SkyShroud said:
That is also part of I am finding double standards of. There are lot of trollish posts that are provocative in nature and all the troll post I reported thus far are provocative in their own ways. However, it seems to me that you moderators only care about posts which evidently turn into an actual conflicts. It is quite contradictory to not wanting to create a toxic culture when provocative trollish posts are permitted, then blame the users who got "baited" into it when you moderators permitted such trollish post in the first place by deeming them as frivolous. It also because you permitted such posts in the first place, you gave all the users the impressions that such posts are allowed.

You either draw the line or you don't.

These are not allowed.
you can go and see, people are complaining that we dun allow them to call others "wumaos" or "americ**ts". these are not allowed.
you can see here as well

https://forums.hardwarezone.com.sg/threads/how-is-the-thread-derailed.6725751/

SkyShroud · Apr 9, 2022

cranthir said:
These are not allowed.
you can go and see, people are complaining that we dun allow them to call others "wumaos" or "americ**ts". these are not allowed.
you can see here as well

https://forums.hardwarezone.com.sg/threads/how-is-the-thread-derailed.6725751/

You say it isn't allowed but I see many such posts with no warning labels and what's not.

Also, the link you post is about derail post which I come to my next question which already mentioned in my first post, why is talking about covid conspiracy allowed despite the quoted article did not mention covid nor is it related to the topic? Again, refer to the first post if you have no idea what I am referring to.

It is hard to convince people when there are so many contradictories.

And yes, they are reported, I have reported, first time reporting dozens of posts since 2005. I mean I didn't report more than 3 posts since 2005 but since you say your double standards is due to lack of reporting, I report them but I still see tons of double standards which solidify my beliefs further.

cranthir · Apr 10, 2022

I m just clearing your mountains of reports from Thurs. Hope you are happy with the all approved reports. you should be able to see all the green tags.

SkyShroud · Apr 10, 2022

cranthir said:
I m just clearing your mountains of reports from Thurs. Hope you are happy with the all approved reports. you should be able to see all the green tags.

That's is great to hear.

I am totally not against any infraction against me because I know these actions are not allowed in some forums, not just hwz. However, it just that hwz seems to be very grey in many of such things and I do hope that the lines are drawn sharp and clear.

You can close the threads now if you want.

cranthir · Apr 10, 2022

Thanks for your understanding, as you know the forum is fast moving and reports can take time to clear.

Why the double standards?

More options

SkyShroud

Arch-Supremacy Member

cranthir

Moderator

SkyShroud

Arch-Supremacy Member

Orionz

Great Supremacy Member

SkyShroud

Arch-Supremacy Member

PikaPika33

High Honorary Member

Kumar22

Arch-Supremacy Member

Shion

Senior Mentor

SkyShroud

Arch-Supremacy Member

cranthir

Moderator

SkyShroud

Arch-Supremacy Member

cranthir

Moderator

SkyShroud

Arch-Supremacy Member

cranthir

Moderator

SkyShroud

Arch-Supremacy Member

cranthir

Moderator