Air conditioning - Any recommendations please?? - Part 2

[PC]

i'll be doing full reno for a HDB resale. is it possible for the aircon installer to come 3x?
trip 1 - remove existing aircon and piping. reason is because the pipes are in the toilet and i'll be hacking all tiles.
trip 2 - install pipes
trip 3 - install aircon unit

if anyone done it before, can share the extra cost? thanks!

 

[ZacharyA]

i'll be doing full reno for a HDB resale. is it possible for the aircon installer to come 3x?
trip 1 - remove existing aircon and piping. reason is because the pipes are in the toilet and i'll be hacking all tiles.
trip 2 - install pipes
trip 3 - install aircon unit

if anyone done it before, can share the extra cost? thanks!

Can come as many times as you want. Just check with the contractor for the trip costs. Probably $70-80 per trip.

So far I have 3 visits but I am not arranging 1st visit to remove existing pipes even when I am hacking everything off.

1st visit is a site visit to discuss installation locations and trunking routes.
2nd visit to install piping and trunking.
3rd visit to install aircon units.

 

[The_King]

@Jun Jun

here the thread
https://forums.hardwarezone.com.sg/threads/are-gree-air-conditioners-really-that-good.6949249


MHI using LG compressor




top tier haier to use panasonic compressor




this is the chart i am talking about.

i rewatch. the hotter the outside temp is, the less the cooling air the AC will produce.

SM the hotter outside temp is the weaker the cooling performance then he also quote china brand work compressor not as good as SM and it work so hard, will it spoil faster? he say not to worry, there 6 yr warranty

 

[007Mi6]

Can come as many times as you want. Just check with the contractor for the trip costs. Probably $70-80 per trip.

So far I have 3 visits but I am not arranging 1st visit to remove existing pipes even when I am hacking everything off.

1st visit is a site visit to discuss installation locations and trunking routes.
2nd visit to install piping and trunking.
3rd visit to install aircon units.

This is true

 

[mark lim]

by right product itself from 1/2inch to say 3/4inch not much different, just that they want to earn. but if the installer workmanship is good, i pay extra also worth it

shield insulation is really necessary only outdoor that all.


just remember a good installer is more important then pay extra. if good i pay extra $300 also worth it

Actually insulation is mainly to prevent condensation and moderately protect the pipes. Doesn’t matter if no insulation on the outdoor part. If there is condensation then let it drip.

 

[ZacharyA]

Actually insulation is mainly to prevent condensation and moderately protect the pipes. Doesn’t matter if no insulation on the outdoor part. If there is condensation then let it drip.

If you had to choose having a shield on the outer most layer (on a 1/2" insulation) vs having 5/8" / 3/4", which will you choose?

All things equal, price top-up the same.

 

[mark lim]

If you had to choose having a shield on the outer most layer (on a 1/2" insulation) vs having 5/8" / 3/4", which will you choose?

All things equal, price top-up the same.

3/4 insulation. You can always add foil for the external part if you do not wish to see the foam crumble. But like I mentioned the crumbling foam is on the outside and does not affect anything about the Aircon function.

 

[ZacharyA]

3/4 insulation. You can always add foil for the external part if you do not wish to see the foam crumble. But like I mentioned the crumbling foam is on the outside and does not affect anything about the Aircon function.

But wouldn't condensation issues, if any, coupled with the crumbling outer layer result in stains marks on the trunking box over time? As compared to having a shield layer (presumably waterproof) to prevent the water from getting to the plastic trunking box?

Insulation foam, over time, will degrade and crumble easily no?

 

[Jun Jun]

@Jun Jun

here the thread
https://forums.hardwarezone.com.sg/threads/are-gree-air-conditioners-really-that-good.6949249


MHI using LG compressor




top tier haier to use panasonic compressor




this is the chart i am talking about.

i rewatch. the hotter the outside temp is, the less the cooling air the AC will produce.

SM the hotter outside temp is the weaker the cooling performance then he also quote china brand work compressor not as good as SM and it work so hard, will it spoil faster? he say not to worry, there 6 yr warranty

Yes the last video i watched too. Interesting. Surprisingly singapore didnt have this kind of reviewers to come and review our local aircon.

 

[Alphas]

Did the air con installation for system 4 more than 6 years ago for resale HDB.
Inform my installer to add PE foam and wrap it with aluminium tape. The insulation is still as good as new and no sign of disintegrated foam.

 

[mark lim]

But wouldn't condensation issues, if any, coupled with the crumbling outer layer result in stains marks on the trunking box over time? As compared to having a shield layer (presumably waterproof) to prevent the water from getting to the plastic trunking box?

Insulation foam, over time, will degrade and crumble easily no?

I meant the foam crumbling on parts next to the compressor outside the house. As long as inside the house it is all good then it’s fine. Outside crumble is just an eye sore.

 

[ZacharyA]

I meant the foam crumbling on parts next to the compressor outside the house. As long as inside the house it is all good then it’s fine. Outside crumble is just an eye sore.

Got it.

 

[Alphas]

I meant the foam crumbling on parts next to the compressor outside the house. As long as inside the house it is all good then it’s fine. Outside crumble is just an eye sore.

Insulation of the copper pipes is important to reduce the heat gain by the refrigerant from the surrounding atmosphere, the trap air in the insulation foam slows the rate of heat conduction into the copper pipes and maintains the cold temperatures of the refrigerant.

Without the insulation, the temperature of the refrigerant rises as it heats up due to the lack of insulation and the refrigerant becomes less cold as it flows towards the FCUs. This reduces the efficiency of cooling curve and thus requires more electricity to maintain the same level of cooling capacity. The temperature of the FCU would also increase depending on the weather conditions.

 

[mark lim]

Insulation of the copper pipes is important to reduce the heat gain by the refrigerant from the surrounding atmosphere, the trap air in the insulation foam slows the rate of heat conduction into the copper pipes and maintains the cold temperatures of the refrigerant.

Without the insulation, the temperature of the refrigerant rises as it heats up due to the lack of insulation and the refrigerant becomes less cold as it flows towards the FCUs. This reduces the efficiency of cooling curve and thus requires more electricity to maintain the same level of cooling capacity. The temperature of the FCU would also increase depending on the weather conditions.

Go read up on how the aircon operates. Insulation does almost nothing for efficiency. Plus it’s is less than 1m exposed, even less of any effect.
if you have any mechanical engineer friends, get them to explain.

 

[Chevalier]

got my aircon piping installed over the weekend. .the routing was one hell of a doozy but overall im very pleased.

good materials used as promised and they laid neatly. no compression to the insulation, just placed nicely next to each other.

 

[ZacharyA]

got my aircon piping installed over the weekend. .the routing was one hell of a doozy but overall im very pleased.

good materials used as promised and they laid neatly. no compression to the insulation, just placed nicely next to each other.

What is your insulation trunking thickness?

 

[Chevalier]

What is your insulation trunking thickness?

Class 'O'. 1/2''

 

[obichacha]

Insulation of the copper pipes is important to reduce the heat gain by the refrigerant from the surrounding atmosphere, the trap air in the insulation foam slows the rate of heat conduction into the copper pipes and maintains the cold temperatures of the refrigerant.

Without the insulation, the temperature of the refrigerant rises as it heats up due to the lack of insulation and the refrigerant becomes less cold as it flows towards the FCUs. This reduces the efficiency of cooling curve and thus requires more electricity to maintain the same level of cooling capacity. The temperature of the FCU would also increase depending on the weather conditions.

lol this unit , I guess more than 20 years

 

[ZacharyA]

Has anyone topped up for 1/2" insulation to be 5/8' or 3/4"? If so, how much is the material fee to upgrade (per FCU)?

I've been quoted $50 extra to upgrade to K Flex Titan for 9/12k FCU and $70 for 18k but $200-300 more per FCU for insulation thickness upgrade (unsure 5/8" or 3/4"). 5 FCUs will come up to extra $1-1.5k (excluding other upgrades like SWG 22 to SWG21)

Is that standard rates???

 

[007Mi6]

Has anyone topped up for 1/2" insulation to be 5/8' or 3/4"? If so, how much is the material fee to upgrade (per FCU)?

I've been quoted $50 extra to upgrade to K Flex Titan for 9/12k FCU and $70 for 18k but $200-300 more per FCU for insulation thickness upgrade (unsure 5/8" or 3/4"). 5 FCUs will come up to extra $1-1.5k (excluding other upgrades like SWG 22 to SWG21)

Is that standard rates???

I feel that SWG21 is slowly becoming standard.

but 5/8” or 3/4” is definitely non-standard