China as a retirement base

beanstalk6

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Honestly I had all kind of friends when I was in Zhuhai, never look down upon them. Some of them came in useful.

I had 1 phone number from one of them, anytime if I get into any problem in the city, within 15-20 mins, he would be down.

I also had the chief of the 110 telephone number too, but the other phone number is more useful lol .

Don't have to pay any additional money if they come and help me settle, just treat them to cheap beer and 烧烤。-roadside stall.

I have even someone who is basically working for those syndicate that works in the Macau Casino.
Those rich kids from those Coal Mine owners that gambled away on credit and cant pay on the spot, many a time my friend will bring them over to 1 of those hotel in Zhuhai near the border and check them into a room, they feed him but don't allow him to sleep until their parents pay up.

initially I was weary of them, but as I got to know them better, as long as you let them know where your "lines" are they respect you and would never encourage you to do stuff that is against your wishes.

Regarding the property situation, I think Xi made a big mistake with his , "apartment is used for staying and not for speculation" and till to this date they are trying hard to rectify the error.

An Apartment in any family should be an asset of wealth , whether in China or SG. He was trying to be popular with the masses , trying to project the message that he was going to make it affordable to vast majority of the masses. He didn't understand how much the economy is dependent on this sector.

The economy is always better when the real estate market is hot, what they needed was to have better control on the credit for the developers and also the buyers ( to get rid of thos speculators who basically did not have the necessary cash)v , instead they came with freezing of sales for long period of time etc

In the past, many rich Chinese had invested in multiple properties to collect rent and by his action many wealthy individuals started to shift the money to overseas property . which finally also impacted the RMB, and many other sector of the economy including banking.

To this date, the effect is still being felt, ie borrower who took at loan and bought property at peak, now have to "top up" the value of current property vs their outstanding loan and if they are unable to, the bank "force sell them in the auction market, and thus depressing the market further and cause families to be in a difficult financial situation.

In my opinion that is his big mistake, he should have learned from LKY , that citizen needs to "sunk their roots" in SG, with the high ownership of property thru HDB , means the future of the country is tie in with the citizen.

From last year, they started talking about the "SG property model", ie HDB and private property, after they basically destroyed the private property market with their "controls" , now they indicated they no longer will "control the private properties but they will have something similar to HDB where it is made affordable to the masses but they didn't realized that in SG, HDB is also appreciating like crazy. Maybe it is a face saving method for them ?

Basically even the genuine buyers are waiting, as long as he doesn't remove that phrase, it is going to be slow slow recovery. He needs new money coming in to "trigger" some urgency is these people sitting on the side.

Hopefully, after his plan to open up and encourage tourism ( in the past they always think their domestic tourism is enough) , he would think about having scheme, like allowing foreigners to buy property and with it comes with a 10 years resident visa , that will create new inflow and maybe antic those Chinese buyers on the sideline to move or miss the boat.

Of course it needed to be paid in cash, no loan from the Chinese Banking system to further diversify the property risk

.-Basically Foreign inflows, this will also ensure that they are attracting those high NetWorth that is long term and not speculative in nature.

In fact many places in China are ideal for people who works online.

Don't know much about Hainan island stuff .

Finally I think Zhuhai should be one of the top few cities for retirement, (but not for business), you can get out fast by land, by air or by sea if there any bad "development" . ( of course I don't see any as the Chinese are not interested in politics they are more interested in making money ).

Just adding this additional history/ info about Zhuhai

Although Zhuhai had the same Special Economic Zone as Shenzhen but lack in the development due to her previous leaders that only allowing environmental friendly industries to be operated out of Zhuhai. So lots of those factories was located in Zhongshan and her smaller town and cities beside Zhuhai like Tanzhou.

That is why Zhuhai has better air quality compared to other parts of China. ( many Chinese Politburo members had their vacation here).
I could never get around to trade favours and I avoid getting into a situation of owing a favour. Similarly, I prefer AA, so the party will not feel he/she owes me a favour. I find that keeping a ledger of favours is too tiresome.
You also observed that for a time, there were many rich mine owners. I had many encounters with Shanxi accents which locals pointed out to me.
I feel the property situation cannot be salvaged in this generation. Like other aspects of the economy, there is no self-correcting mechanism to fix supply. You always get extremes and no moderation. In governance too, it is always an extreme response to any issue. In both areas, the root cause has to do with the political system.
My 2 cents' worth.
 

16/8IF

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I could never get around to trade favours and I avoid getting into a situation of owing a favour. Similarly, I prefer AA, so the party will not feel he/she owes me a favour. I find that keeping a ledger of favours is too tiresome.
You also observed that for a time, there were many rich mine owners. I had many encounters with Shanxi accents which locals pointed out to me.
I feel the property situation cannot be salvaged in this generation. Like other aspects of the economy, there is no self-correcting mechanism to fix supply. You always get extremes and no moderation. In governance too, it is always an extreme response to any issue. In both areas, the root cause has to do with the political system.
My 2 cents' worth.
Never need to keep track of any favours, just among good friends you offer your assistance when you can help solve a problem and I never provide any financial loans too neither did they, they have the same views as me, once you start to have money into a relationship it will be destroyed in no time.

Anyway below is a good Youtube on doing business in Zhuhai and understanding the living standards from a British perspective.( he too was there from 2005- I remembered him, was very active in the night scene ).

TS who started this thread seems to have "disappeared" or lost interest.

Indeed it is the political system, but to be fair, real estate problem is somewhat a world wide problem at different stages of their development.


 

Multiversal

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I used to stay in China about 6 years ago and just returned to SG during the covid pandemic. China has been an interesting country where

(1) is big and lots of places to go
(2) cheap food, housing, standard of living
(3) nice people
(4) good healthcare
(5) most places have no big disaster

Lately just flew back to Chengdu. I think life is good and cpf and sgd can stretch to exchange rate of 1:5. Hehe! Anyone has any thoughts of retiring in China?
How do you stay there for long term
 

beanstalk6

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Never need to keep track of any favours, just among good friends you offer your assistance when you can help solve a problem and I never provide any financial loans too neither did they, they have the same views as me, once you start to have money into a relationship it will be destroyed in no time.

Anyway below is a good Youtube on doing business in Zhuhai and understanding the living standards from a British perspective.( he too was there from 2005- I remembered him, was very active in the night scene ).

TS who started this thread seems to have "disappeared" or lost interest.

Indeed it is the political system, but to be fair, real estate problem is somewhat a world wide problem at different stages of their development.
Different strokes for different folks. I could not resist asking some questions or looking a little deeper than TS. My experiences with these visits have seen ups and downs since my first visit to Guangzhou in 2000 for the Canton Fair. I will be visiting the vast country for the rest of my lifetime, for unavoidable purposes.
 

16/8IF

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Different strokes for different folks. I could not resist asking some questions or looking a little deeper than TS. My experiences with these visits have seen ups and downs since my first visit to Guangzhou in 2000 for the Canton Fair. I will be visiting the vast country for the rest of my lifetime, for unavoidable purposes.
The first time I went to China was in the late 1980s with my Caucasian boss on business.
Those were the days when foreigners had to use FEC. Those were the days when as a foreigner when taking the domestic flight, you need to wait for all the locals to board first before they allow the foreigners !

Definitely China is a vast Country, so different city might give a different perspective and also within the city even with different group of people you can have different experience too.

During the time I was based in China, basically was in semi-retirement, more of a relax and enjoy life.

So my group of friends were also keen anglers(fishing), playing badminton, driving/long highways racing and of course enjoying the nightlife too.
Playing badminton was basically , free as I joined my Gov official friend in their weekly department sports days where they basically provided everything including dinner.

I wasn't really looking at doing business but my Chinese friends brought me along for their business negotiation.

I even participated in the negotiation for a demolition project of an old village in the city,村拆迁改造 to clear it for development of apartment.

The boss of demolition company, a mutual friend paid my friend and me a commission( each RMB20k) for bringing in the deal, but I gave my share of it to my friend.

From here I learned about the importance of 关系 in China right from various Gov department to private enterprises people.

From my personal opinion, although China has lots of negative aspects too, in order to enjoy yourself during your stay, focus more on their positive and "lock-out" all the western media negativities ( but still keep yourself abreast with how others views are.

Anyway best of luck in your journey ! ( think need to drop that unavoidable purposes ? ).
 
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Multiversal

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The first time I went to China was in the late 1980s with my Caucasian boss on business.
Those were the days when foreigners had to use FEC. Those were the days when as a foreigner when taking the domestic flight, you need to wait for all the locals to board first before they allow the foreigners !

Definitely China is a vast Country, so different city might give a different perspective and also within the city even with different group of people you can have different experience too.

During the time I was based in China, basically was in semi-retirement, more of a relax and enjoy life.

So my group of friends were also keen anglers(fishing), playing badminton, driving/long highways racing and of course enjoying the nightlife too.
Playing badminton was basically , free as I joined my Gov official friend in their weekly department sports days where they basically provided everything including dinner.

I wasn't really looking at doing business but my Chinese friends brought me along for their business negotiation.

I even participated in the negotiation for a demolition project of an old village in the city,村拆迁改造 to clear it for development of apartment.

The boss of demolition company, a mutual friend paid my friend and me a commission( each RMB20k) for bringing in the deal, but I gave my share of it to my friend.

From here I learned about the importance of 关系 in China right from various Gov department to private enterprises people.

From my personal opinion, although China has lots of negative aspects too, in order to enjoy yourself during your stay, focus more on their positive and "lock-out" all the western media negativities ( but still keep yourself abreast with how others views are.

Anyway best of luck in your journey ! ( think need to drop that unavoidable purposes ? ).
Back then, Singaporeans could already travel to most if not all countries without any restrictions. Only a few countries required a VISA which was a bit of paperwork, that's all. On the other hand, the Chinese could not leave China as easily as they can today or even in the past twenty years. Being last to board a plane was just that: last to board, that's all. The person who boarded it first only had the small advantage of being seated earlier than you. The time when the plane took off was the equalizer because everybody reached the destination at the same time anyway.

My first trip to China was around the same time, but it was to Shanghai. China opened up after 1978 but infrastructure was not quite ready. Pudong was not developed yet, so Shanghai was all about Puxi ie on the western side of the Huangpu River. It was a fascinating place, and I got to understand why Shanghai was such a popular city with the outside world way before Mao drew the Red Curtain.

Like you, I went there with my angmo boss. I suppose he found my English easier to understand than the Singlish he heard back in those days, and therefor I was a good choice to bring along. It helped that my Mandarin was far better than his, albeit far worse than the Chinese's. But in the land of the blind, the one eye Jack was King, so I was King among the Chinese, and with my angmo boss, depending on which language I happened to be speaking. It wasn't a vacation to see the Bund, or to catch a domestic flight to see Summer Palace but a business trip, and therefore, I had to quickly learn the term 损益表 and quite a mouthful of business jargon in Mandarin.

Eew...cannot help thinking of ponpokku with whom I had some friendly and pleasant exchanges whenever we met at threads about China..
 

Multiversal

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Different strokes for different folks. I could not resist asking some questions or looking a little deeper than TS. My experiences with these visits have seen ups and downs since my first visit to Guangzhou in 2000 for the Canton Fair. I will be visiting the vast country for the rest of my lifetime, for unavoidable purposes.
To borrow your phrase Different Strokes for Different folks, it is well known that most Singaporeans lost money when investing in China.

Instead of using a different stroke when dealing with the Chinese, we dealt with them as if they were Singaporeans. We talked, we negotiated, and then we signed a contract. If any side is unhappy with the performance, what do we do? Go to court lorh. If the amount is small, then it's the Small Claims Tribunal. Singaporeans' style.

We had no idea about what guanxi was. Our illiterate forefathers understood it but they were not the ones going (back) to China to do business when China opened up. It was the English educated Singaporeans who went there armed with a concept of Singapore law that was based on English law. Wrong strokes.

cc: 16/81F
 

hfngshnll

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Lastly would I consider retirement in this city- yes but unfortunately my wife is not keen and there is no long

may i ask what are the reasons your wife is not keen ? you seemed to be very positive about your long station over there.
 

beanstalk6

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@16/8IF Came across this account of Zhuhai and how the property prices have dived after holding out longer than other cities
 

16/8IF

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@16/8IF Came across this account of Zhuhai and how the property prices have dived after holding out longer than other cities

Yes, I saw this Youtube. I think it will take be too long to write to explain to you Zhuhai property market.


There is no doubt the market is not the same as before and indeed prices have come down by alot, but this presenter really doesn't understand the demographic of Zhuhai and the last part where he mentioned about High tech area where he think is a good area because it is just at the entrance of Zhongshen bridge/highway ( ie the bridge that connect Zhongshan to Shenzhen anyone who is in Zhuhai long enough will know that area is what those local Zhuhai people will say.. even the "bird don't even want to go there to poo ".


Lastly just to give you an idea, from 2004 the average price was RMB 3,000 plus per sq meter when up to a high if I am not wrong RMB 40,000-50,000 in around 2019/2020 ( cant be sure exactly) , now I think if I am not wrong around 15,000-20,000 area of course you have those at 8,000 which are basically in the outskirt or the locals called "bird dont even want to go there to poo " .


Where many speculators are caught at high prices are usually area like Hengqin , Doumen and Tangjia area , these are really not the city or urban area.


I read that now the government initiative is to revitalized the city center, meaning rebuild new apartments in the city center by taking over older apartments so a completely opposite from the past where they shifted them to the outskirt like Doumen and Tangjia area .
 

16/8IF

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@16/8IF Came across this account of Zhuhai and how the property prices have dived after holding out longer than other cities

here is one Youtube i watched some months ago

You can see the Shenzhen /Zhongshan bridge or link that was in your previous video.

You will also see Hengqin area in this video , also a not well populated area of Zhuhai .

 
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J_Vansen_S

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Its 2026, anyone else still considering China as a semi retirement base?

Having obtaining 6mths tourist visa, can literally rent a nice place stay(cheap at 2-3tier cities) for 3-6mths.
Considering Yunnan area due to milder weather
Go home during summer & repeat. My FIRE-ish plan
 

matrix05

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If stay near a big mall or shopping belt shd be cheap & livable. Get an ebike (no need license) for inter city. Different but overall don think it is cheaper, better than Msia.
 

beanstalk6

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I find that it is better to locate oneself in a city where there are minimally:
1) a top-rated hospital
2) Sam's Club or other sources of safe food products
3) a local airport that connects to HK, Shenzhen or Macau
4) a train station, preferably with HSR.
 

d3n

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after reading 4 pages, i think i retire in Thailand is the best.
 
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