COE: Individual vs Institutional bidding

[Philipkee]

Individuals bidding process can have workarounds, such as enhanced digital platforms and pre bid loan arrangements. Imagine if our system had been individual bidding right from the start, authorities would have implemented appropriate procedures. It’s just that we are so used to the institutional bidding process. That’s why we think workarounds are impossible.

The core idea is that vast majority of individuals would not have submitted bids as large as current bids if they do it themselves. Not all rich people will submit crazy bids. However, we had to go with institutional bidding right from the start, and this led to ever increasing bids.

Even if everyone in Singapore were to be rich, I still doubt that individual bidding will lead to higher bids than institutional.

If we don’t have GIRO and credit cards and are forced to pay in cash for all of our bills, I bet you will feel more heart pain and will be more active in finding ways to cut expenses. This is behavioral economics.

The pre loan arrangement is interesting idea but means what? I sign with a bank a loan for $50k and i bid $50k for coe. I get it, I take the loan, I don’t get it, I don’t take the loan? Not sure if the banks will want to do this especially if they know about 50% of the bids will fail unless you pay a surcharge.

Frankly if u can't afford to fork out 50k cold hard cash for COE, u shouldn't be buying a car.

Some will say u elitist don’t understand why people need a car to fetch elderlt

Sad that we have resigned to fate high COE prices when there’s alternative solutions that will lead to lower prices. Stockholm syndrome.

Hard to believe they all never agreed at a COE amount.

Must ban car sellers from indicating the COE amount. Car buyers indicate the amount they want to bid.

The point is, if it’s cash and self bid for COE, only the cash rich will get the car at a lower COE cost

And I don’t think u can ban sellers from bidding cos sellers bid on your behalf. If you are saying can only sell cars without coe and buyer must get coe then go to showroom, its possible but there will probably be a lot of complaints cos of inconvenience. It’s not like right now u can’t do that. It’s just inconvenient and even if I wanna do that, I might lose out cos others don’t do that

 

[Philipkee]

Pay what you bid for, perhaps can help to arrest COE skyrocketing.

Not a bad idea

 

[rizhal]

Not a bad idea

Also, cannot modify bid value. I read car dealers could change bid value before close. Should not allow them.

 

[Philipkee]

Also, cannot modify bid value. I read car dealers could change bid value before close. Should not allow them.

Then only two scenarios

Last minute all rush in cos no point bidding early when u can be outbid

Closed bidding system meaning no one knows what is the current reserve price so they just bid what they can and wait for 1600 on Wednesday to get the result - this was done before and it made the coe amount extremely volatile but I like this idea actually

 

[pwongkk]

The pre loan arrangement is interesting idea but means what? I sign with a bank a loan for $50k and i bid $50k for coe. I get it, I take the loan, I don’t get it, I don’t take the loan? Not sure if the banks will want to do this especially if they know about 50% of the bids will fail unless you pay a surcharge.

Some will say u elitist don’t understand why people need a car to fetch elderlt



The point is, if it’s cash and self bid for COE, only the cash rich will get the car at a lower COE cost

And I don’t think u can ban sellers from bidding cos sellers bid on your behalf. If you are saying can only sell cars without coe and buyer must get coe then go to showroom, its possible but there will probably be a lot of complaints cos of inconvenience. It’s not like right now u can’t do that. It’s just inconvenient and even if I wanna do that, I might lose out cos others don’t do that

Buyers can always apply for bank loan themselves, not difficult.

Of course car sellers can provide the "service" by helping the buyer bid. Buyer can indicate the amount they want to bid.

I don't think buyers will find it a problem or any inconvenience. And also time for these car sellers to transform their business process. Buyers can go online to complete the purchase process, indicate the amount they are bidding and car sellers bid on their behalf.

Can also do a workflow, one of the page can be letting the user choose the banks and insurance companies.

In this way, can do in the comfort of their homes.

 

[V_for_Vanilla]

in before LTA says COE bidding is fare, there is no evidence to suggest a different outcome when comparing the 2 different groups of bidders

Rising COE prices, similar to GST, have a knock on effect translating to higher prices and cost of living increases. There is no political will to reform the broken system or even acknowledge it.

 

[bombshell]

Don't need to think do much. So many people can afford $100k COE, if you can't, your don't deserve to own a car. Simpur.

 

[Philipkee]

Buyers can always apply for bank loan themselves, not difficult.

Of course car sellers can provide the "service" by helping the buyer bid. Buyer can indicate the amount they want to bid.

I don't think buyers will find it a problem or any inconvenience. And also time for these car sellers to transform their business process. Buyers can go online to complete the purchase process, indicate the amount they are bidding and car sellers bid on their behalf.

Can also do a workflow, one of the page can be letting the user choose the banks and insurance companies.

In this way, can do in the comfort of their homes.

I like this idea but I think it can only work in a closed bidding system. Otherwise buyers might keep calling sellers to revise bid, call banks to faster allow the increase etc etc especially if their planned bidding amount is slightly lower than the reserve price

A better way would be balloting but there must be ruled like minimum ownership period and such to prevent a black market from forming

 

[Comage]

Not a bad idea

You want my idea, Boss?

Ban PHVs from crossing the border into Malaysia. A PHV should function just like a taxi - a vehicle meant for public consumers to use/hire as a point-to-point transport/vehicle within Singapore. Nothing more.

You will see an instant crash of COE prices, by at least 30% - I'm dead-sure of that.

 

[rizhal]

Don't need to think do much. So many people can afford $100k COE, if you can't, your don't deserve to own a car. Simpur.

Cannot say like this, it is not hurt you now.

Do you want to say this in the future “Those cannot afford $200K COE, you don’t deserve to own a car”. How about $300K later ?

The Minister of Transport must do something.

 

[Philipkee]

You want my idea, Boss?

Ban PHVs from crossing the border into Malaysia. A PHV should function just like a taxi - a vehicle meant for public consumers to use/hire as a point-to-point transport/vehicle within Singapore. Nothing more.

You will see an instant crash of COE prices, by at least 30% - I'm dead-sure of that.

I will admit I like your idea but I am not a phv driver so it’s kinda not fair for me to suggest this

 

[Comage]

I like this idea but I think it can only work in a closed bidding system. Otherwise buyers might keep calling sellers to revise bid, call banks to faster allow the increase etc etc especially if their planned bidding amount is slightly lower than the reserve price

A better way would be balloting but there must be ruled like minimum ownership period and such to prevent a black market from forming

Not to say that you guys don't have good ideas - but the talk of the town in those PHV groups is:

"Every +$10k increment to COE prices = 2 more trips/day, Bro"

"No scared la, just buy!"

 

[Comage]

I will admit I like your idea but I am not a phv driver so it’s kinda not fair for me to suggest this

Neither am I a PHV driver - so what's wrong with that.

We are all not LTA/Govt scholars - so what's then point of this thread then, to discuss this "COE/Government policy"?

*Update*: The opinion that is the most unpopular - is usually the one that hits the nail on the head.

 

[lowveld]

Can we write options on coe?

 

[Comage]

Cannot say like this, it is not hurt you now.

Do you want to say this in the future “Those cannot afford $200K COE, you don’t deserve to own a car”. How about $300K later ?

The Minister of Transport must do something.

Exactly - the root cause for this runaway-COE-prices issue is not that of "who can/cannot afford", nor one of "bidding process is screwed up".

It's what the car owners do with their $150k vehicles - they split it into "installment" payments instead of doing it the legit MAS way of putting down that proper 30-40% downpayment upfront.

The system/process of bidding is not broken - it's the people who game the system/process that are the root cause of the problem.

Buying a Car in Singapore Be Like:

 

[Philipkee]

Neither am I a PHV driver - so what's wrong with that.

We are all not LTA/Govt scholars - so what's then point of this thread then, to discuss this "COE/Government policy"?

Discussing govt policies, imho, are just suggestions. Free for all

Discussing a policy that might actually ruin the livelihood of phv drivers when one has no skin in the game - I think not very good unless there are phv drivers in this thread to give their two cents

 

[dgeralds]

COE mutst be separate for business and people.

ABSD must be paid by cash when buying property. Similarly COE must be paid by cash when buying cars. Sure the price will drop immediately and will stabbilise after few months.

 

[compro_1975]

for it to be fair, u wait long long,.... ah siao now happily counting the money he getting plus performance bonus

 

[Comage]

Discussing govt policies, imho, are just suggestions. Free for all

Discussing a policy that might actually ruin the livelihood of phv drivers when one has no skin in the game - I think not very good unless there are phv drivers in this thread to give their two cents

You want to be a PHV driver - full time, go ahead and take it up as a FT day job.
Banning the PHVs from crossing into Malaysia has minimal impact on legit, FT PHV drivers.

Do we see taxi drivers in the past rant or complain that their vehicles can't drive into JB/MY?

These days, there are very few such FT PHV drivers. Most of them just do the bare minimum to cover their rental/gas, and call it a day, even moonlighting part time after their FT day jobs.

Banning these vehicles from crossing into Malaysia will flush out all these nonsense guys, and retain only the legit PHV guys who drive daily as their real day jobs.

There is no "ruining of livelihoods" here.

 

[JivBunny]

Simple math.

The higher the Car Sales bid for you, the more you need to pay. The more you need to pay, the more you need to loan…..the more you need to loan, the more the bank earn from you. The more the bank earn, the more commission they can pay the car sales.