Computer Recommendation - Build, Reuse or Continue

[mike911]

I am aware I made past mistakes and regrets when getting a new stuffs. (be it desktop, notebook, tablet, mobile, anything, etc.)
Everytime I feel very bad to the community, because of the "burden" placed on them. Yet everyone contributed out of good will. But I end up... dismaying most of them if not all on my decisions.
I know end of the day, I am the one still to make the decision. (Be it cancelling ultimately)

Still I hope I can seek the community to suggest and recommend parts or decisions that i should consider at least. (being out of topic for a while)

Any comments is appreciated.

Thank you,
Mike


I have the following now
i5 4570 + msi b85i (in use) + msi b85m-g43
KVR ddr3 2x8GB
msi r9 380, ati hd5570 1gb (from friend, unable to determine stability)
fractal design r2 arc mini
Superflower 600w golden green hx psu
Dell u2713hm - 1440p, Sony TV 1080p
swans D1010-IV (not functional)

problem now
intermittent display issues (i.e. no display on bootup, blue screen (VIDEO TDR FAILURE) when using MSI r9 380
attempted to try hd5570, but starting to show similar issues (i.e. reseat but no display, and have to tilt at specific angle to boot properly)
constantly have to reseat gfx to get display back (approx 4-5 times in a month and has been increasing frequently)

concerns
high cpu/gpu fan when playing cities skylines/simulator games
frame rates when playing games
rusted case (fan intake and exhaust)
case size
(mental) wanting to play, but unwilling to play games

use
internet
youtube
videos
causal/simulator/rpg games

hope
1440p - perhaps an ultrawide in future
itx form factor
gaming do not need to be ultra, but hope at least to have smooth enough game play without taxing system

questions
budget?
reuse of parts? or reuse as 2nd system using onboard gpu?
itx - big or small case?
ultra wide monitor, when then get or think only?
dont build, continue using as of now until better decisions can be made?

 

[jedi5diah]

easiest way is just change gpu, but not sure how bad is your case. you have to decide that for yourself.

if you change case high risk that some parts might be dmg.

1.5k sure net you a pretty decent desktop
mid tower is better, lesser headache and "cheaper"

 

[bobozhang137]

First thing ill do is reinstall graphic drivers. If unable to do so. Just reformat using igpu.

Cause if you do not need an upgrade no need to spend the money

 

[Koenig168]

You seem to have connection issues with the PCIe slot. Suggest you switch to the other MB.

The other MB is mATX so you can get a new case like the Q300L at $69 which would also deal with the rusted casing issue - https://www.lazada.sg/products/cooler-master-masterbox-q300l-matx-case-w-magnetic-design-dust-filter-transparent-acrylic-side-panel-air-flow-performance-i267371908-s415604340.html?spm=a2o42.searchlist.list.5.4dcb3400eF8aOf&search=1

Most cost-effective solution to the immediate issues.

 

[mike911]

easiest way is just change gpu, but not sure how bad is your case. you have to decide that for yourself.

if you change case high risk that some parts might be dmg.

1.5k sure net you a pretty decent desktop
mid tower is better, lesser headache and "cheaper"

i can understand where you are coming from, as i built 1 itx machine for my brother previously.
just that I duno why i felt like the case felt very empty, and "pointless" to store large empty pockets of space.

my only worry about spending on GPU is
- if the problem is with the mobo (itx one)
- GPU too big to fit to new itx case

First thing ill do is reinstall graphic drivers. If unable to do so. Just reformat using igpu.

Cause if you do not need an upgrade no need to spend the money

1. Already did
2. Currently on clean drivers on igpu, so far stable
3. Unable to determine if it is the card problem or pci-slot problem
4. Understand the "pointless" of upgrading but rather to address the problem actually

You seem to have connection issues with the PCIe slot. Suggest you switch to the other MB.

The other MB is mATX so you can get a new case like the Q300L at $69 which would also deal with the rusted casing issue - https://www.lazada.sg/products/cooler-master-masterbox-q300l-matx-case-w-magnetic-design-dust-filter-transparent-acrylic-side-panel-air-flow-performance-i267371908-s415604340.html?spm=a2o42.searchlist.list.5.4dcb3400eF8aOf&search=1

Most cost-effective solution to the immediate issues.

the problem with the matx board is that the msi r9 380's backplate got stuck at the RAM slots.
unless i use the pci-e x4 slot which degrades performance.
plus furthermore as the card is 2.5 height, i doubt it will fit to my current case.

unless i run caseless (risk improper card seating) or your suggestion of getting another case (but rather an atx case)

 

[mike911]

any recommendations between the following rtx 2060?

zotac twin fan rtx 2060 - 529
(in video) zotac twin fan rtx 2060 amp - 558
(in video) msi ventus oc rtx 2060 - 579
msi gaming z rtx 2060 - 629


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I-DXzX8CAUI

my opinion after being influenced by the above
seem like the zotac amp edition is better preference
plus the smaller form factor is easier to workaround should i really change to itx case.

 

[mike911]

Just sharing findings.

Tried a few things to clarify doubts in mind.

1.
(Sorry clon22, i know dismantling it is not a good idea =.=)
Removed R9 380's backplate and installed to my original B85m-G43.
Somehow, after testing it
- case lying flat on floor
- case sitting up straight up

No issues with GPU, even with stress test over 1 day.

Spoiler

2.
@jedi5diah
I tried sanding (with whatever sandpaper i have at home) the rusted surface before, but did not dare to over sand it.

Spoiler

3.
@jedi5diah
2nd area (exhaust) which requires more effort, i havent sand this yet.

Spoiler

4.
@jedi5diah
3rd/4th area (not captured)
side panels, kind of oxidised feel with spots all over.
i am not sure how to treat this... tried to lightly wipe them off with a damp cloth, but did not help.


5.
decided to try back original setup b85i without GPU backplate
somehow on first setup after driver clean up, i got alot of issues
no display boot up
after reseating RAM/GPU
i got the following output
then i loosened the GPU Screws and no issues (stress test + game play) after another day.

Spoiler

6.
guess i will have to further monitor...
these random intermittent issues are very troublesome to isolate and resolve...

 

[narkizy]

I am aware I made past mistakes and regrets when getting a new stuffs. (be it desktop, notebook, tablet, mobile, anything, etc.)
Everytime I feel very bad to the community, because of the "burden" placed on them. Yet everyone contributed out of good will. But I end up... dismaying most of them if not all on my decisions.
I know end of the day, I am the one still to make the decision. (Be it cancelling ultimately)

Still I hope I can seek the community to suggest and recommend parts or decisions that i should consider at least. (being out of topic for a while)

Any comments is appreciated.

Thank you,
Mike


I have the following now
i5 4570 + msi b85i (in use) + msi b85m-g43
KVR ddr3 2x8GB
msi r9 380, ati hd5570 1gb (from friend, unable to determine stability)
fractal design r2 arc mini
Superflower 600w golden green hx psu
Dell u2713hm - 1440p, Sony TV 1080p
swans D1010-IV (not functional)

problem now
intermittent display issues (i.e. no display on bootup, blue screen (VIDEO TDR FAILURE) when using MSI r9 380
attempted to try hd5570, but starting to show similar issues (i.e. reseat but no display, and have to tilt at specific angle to boot properly)
constantly have to reseat gfx to get display back (approx 4-5 times in a month and has been increasing frequently)

concerns
high cpu/gpu fan when playing cities skylines/simulator games
frame rates when playing games
rusted case (fan intake and exhaust)
case size
(mental) wanting to play, but unwilling to play games

use
internet
youtube
videos
causal/simulator/rpg games

hope
1440p - perhaps an ultrawide in future
itx form factor
gaming do not need to be ultra, but hope at least to have smooth enough game play without taxing system

questions
budget?
reuse of parts? or reuse as 2nd system using onboard gpu?
itx - big or small case?
ultra wide monitor, when then get or think only?
dont build, continue using as of now until better decisions can be made?

1440p - 1070ti or 2070 or 1080 GTX would suffice. I recommend against getting a 580/1060.

Cpu- 2600x or 2700/x

At this point i'd say just rebuild. Your old cpu is neither here nor there - it cant run good GPUs that's needed for 1440p gaming without bottlenecking.

Anything less powerful than a 1070(ie. 1060 or rx580) is laughably NOT futureproof. As it is the 1060 6gb cant run newer games like Destiny 2 at very high/ultra settings in 1080p, you think 2019 AAA games can be run on high/very high settings at 1080p?

You might as well get a good powerful system thats 5-6 years futureproof(since like you said, you wanna try 1440p). If you're gonna build, dont go so budget. That system u currently have probanly wont last another year ba.

 

[Shahmatt]

If you can wait till 3300G or 3600G APUs coming in Q3 2019 then you may be able to achieve 1440p gaming in an ITX box.

I believe the current mobos should support the 3000 series APUs, so you could possibly build now with currently available APUs (either 2200G or 2400G) and then upgrade later. In the interim you suffer lower quality gaming.

Having gone the ITX route I can say it is a relief to bring the box on to the table top - less dust, easier cleaning. Also APUs/iGPUs mean less components to worry about.

 

[narkizy]

If you can wait till 3300G or 3600G APUs coming in Q3 2019 then you may be able to achieve 1440p gaming in an ITX box.

I believe the current mobos should support the 3000 series APUs, so you could possibly build now with currently available APUs (either 2200G or 2400G) and then upgrade later. In the interim you suffer lower quality gaming.

Having gone the ITX route I can say it is a relief to bring the box on to the table top - less dust, easier cleaning. Also APUs/iGPUs mean less components to worry about.

I dont think an APU will ever achieve 1440p gaming LOL. Unless you mean super light gaming like CS go or DOTA? Saying the next gen APU can handle 1440p in Witcher 3 is pretty wishful thinking. The gap between the current gen APUs and a generic 1060 is so huge alr. You're saying the next gen APU can take on the power of a 1070/1070ti?

Unlikely. AMD would be cannibalising its ENTIRE GPU line by doing so. Even their own rx 580 cant run 1440p unless u do low setting.

 

[Shahmatt]

I dont think an APU will ever achieve 1440p gaming LOL. Unless you mean super light gaming like CS go or DOTA? Saying the next gen APU can handle 1440p in Witcher 3 is pretty wishful thinking. The gap between the current gen APUs and a generic 1060 is so huge alr. You're saying the next gen APU can take on the power of a 1070/1070ti?

Unlikely. AMD would be cannibalising its ENTIRE GPU line by doing so. Even their own 580 cant run 1440p

I meant for the OPs use which is 'causal/simulator/rpg games' @ 1440p should be good enough.

Having said that it could be the 3600G is quite capable with 20 Navi CUs.

My o/c'd 2200G has only 8 Vega CUs and does quite well for casual games at 1080p medium settings.

 

[narkizy]

I meant for the OPs use which is 'causal/simulator/rpg games' @ 1440p should be good enough.

Having said that it could be the 3600G is quite capable with 20 Navi CUs.

My o/c'd 2200G has only 8 Vega CUs and does quite well for casual games at 1080p medium settings.

My bad, I stand corrected then. You're right about APUs in that usecase.

 

[mike911]

1440p - 1070ti or 2070 or 1080 GTX would suffice. I recommend against getting a 580/1060.

Cpu- 2600x or 2700/x

At this point i'd say just rebuild. Your old cpu is neither here nor there - it cant run good GPUs that's needed for 1440p gaming without bottlenecking.

Anything less powerful than a 1070(ie. 1060 or rx580) is laughably NOT futureproof. As it is the 1060 6gb cant run newer games like Destiny 2 at very high/ultra settings in 1080p, you think 2019 AAA games can be run on high/very high settings at 1080p?

You might as well get a good powerful system thats 5-6 years futureproof(since like you said, you wanna try 1440p). If you're gonna build, dont go so budget. That system u currently have probanly wont last another year ba.

I dont think an APU will ever achieve 1440p gaming LOL. Unless you mean super light gaming like CS go or DOTA? Saying the next gen APU can handle 1440p in Witcher 3 is pretty wishful thinking. The gap between the current gen APUs and a generic 1060 is so huge alr. You're saying the next gen APU can take on the power of a 1070/1070ti?

Unlikely. AMD would be cannibalising its ENTIRE GPU line by doing so. Even their own rx 580 cant run 1440p unless u do low setting.

thanks for commenting.
noted on the thoughts for RX580. Hence i was looking at RTX 2060 for a start.

but who knows, i might end up with APU alone just for simple light gaming.
(looking at my current gaming habits.)

 

[mike911]

If you can wait till 3300G or 3600G APUs coming in Q3 2019 then you may be able to achieve 1440p gaming in an ITX box.

I believe the current mobos should support the 3000 series APUs, so you could possibly build now with currently available APUs (either 2200G or 2400G) and then upgrade later. In the interim you suffer lower quality gaming.

Having gone the ITX route I can say it is a relief to bring the box on to the table top - less dust, easier cleaning. Also APUs/iGPUs mean less components to worry about.

Thanks for commenting.
Yea, that was part of the consideration when thinking about ITX.
Felt like the empty space in my mini R2 felt wasted (I do not use 3rd party after market cooler nor water cooling)
Plus the additional empty spaces also may affect create empty air-pockets, causing poor ventilation in casing.

And yes also the consideration of APU/iGPU was part of the consideration thinking about my gaming habits

I meant for the OPs use which is 'causal/simulator/rpg games' @ 1440p should be good enough.

Having said that it could be the 3600G is quite capable with 20 Navi CUs.

My o/c'd 2200G has only 8 Vega CUs and does quite well for casual games at 1080p medium settings.

causal - might be AAA games... depending on situation i guess (so far been striving on free games. big collection yet, never touched..)
simulation - (main bulk) i.e. ets2, spin tires, cities skylines, banished, etc...
rpg - generic types, i.e. tales of ..., etc.

 

[Spladox]

currently in same situation as you in terms of cpu. not sure if i wanna upgrade, ryzen 1700x price on prime now is really tempting

 

[watzup_ken]

Having gone the ITX route I can say it is a relief to bring the box on to the table top - less dust, easier cleaning. Also APUs/iGPUs mean less components to worry about.

On the contrary, I switched back to a mATX format after trying out ITX for more than a year. It boils down to the casing being used because I feel some of the ITX case are neither big or small, which is a problem when it comes to placement. In my example, I was using a Corsair Obsidian 250D which is too big on the table, and too small on the floor. If you get a small case, airflow is typically a problem since some don't even have any case fan.

 

[Shahmatt]

Thanks for commenting.
Yea, that was part of the consideration when thinking about ITX.
Felt like the empty space in my mini R2 felt wasted (I do not use 3rd party after market cooler nor water cooling)
Plus the additional empty spaces also may affect create empty air-pockets, causing poor ventilation in casing.

And yes also the consideration of APU/iGPU was part of the consideration thinking about my gaming habits

causal - might be AAA games... depending on situation i guess (so far been striving on free games. big collection yet, never touched..)
simulation - (main bulk) i.e. ets2, spin tires, cities skylines, banished, etc...
rpg - generic types, i.e. tales of ..., etc.

According this thread:
https://www.reddit.com/r/Amd/comments/7lgosk/how_is_amd_navi_compared_to_amd_vega/

The Navi CUs could be 40% faster with 50% more thermal efficiency compared to Vega.

According to link below, Navi GPUs is to be released Q2 this year.
https://www.techquila.co.in/amd-radeon-navi-gpu/

Not so far off. So when they are released we can verify the performance.

Here is a Youtube video of overclocked 11 Vega CUs (2400G) for Witcher 3:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E8cVaZdyVqs

Cooling is not mentioned, but for my 2200G I can o/c quite well using the low profile stock cooler. Most GPU benefit is seen through RAM o/c'ing though, and most times you don't need a fan or third party cooling for this.

Here is ASRock's latest barebones solution which can support AMD APUs.
https://www.tomshardware.com/news/asrock-am4-motherboard-ryzen-amd,38391.html

If the connectivity is adequate then you can use this to build a pretty sweet small PC.

All you need is a 120W adapter. This should be more than sufficient. In my case I have measured using my good quality power meter a maximum of 90W from the socket stress testing my 2200G.

 

[Shahmatt]

Continuing to fantasize, the ASRock A300-STX can be Vesa mounted. So you could possibly get a dual display vesa mount: Mount 1 arm to the display and 1 arm to the box.

 

[Shahmatt]

On the contrary, I switched back to a mATX format after trying out ITX for more than a year. It boils down to the casing being used because I feel some of the ITX case are neither big or small, which is a problem when it comes to placement. In my example, I was using a Corsair Obsidian 250D which is too big on the table, and too small on the floor. If you get a small case, airflow is typically a problem since some don't even have any case fan.

Agreed that need to be careful about airflow.

 

[mike911]

1. problem now is i cant isolate/identify the fault of the hardware
2. neither nor the problem happens frequently
3. to firm up my decision on gaming... or take a good break about "thinking" of gaming, when all i do day to day is youtube... and www only

On the contrary, I switched back to a mATX format after trying out ITX for more than a year. It boils down to the casing being used because I feel some of the ITX case are neither big or small, which is a problem when it comes to placement. In my example, I was using a Corsair Obsidian 250D which is too big on the table, and too small on the floor. If you get a small case, airflow is typically a problem since some don't even have any case fan.

Agreed that need to be careful about airflow.

yea... initially i had my eyes on them. including phantex's and inwin's 9xx or nzxt case with those "awesome" looking glass panels.
but then... spending a luxary on them while hoping to reduce size is very weird.
because it is just only a few cm/litres difference only

According this thread:
https://www.reddit.com/r/Amd/comments/7lgosk/how_is_amd_navi_compared_to_amd_vega/

The Navi CUs could be 40% faster with 50% more thermal efficiency compared to Vega.

According to link below, Navi GPUs is to be released Q2 this year.
https://www.techquila.co.in/amd-radeon-navi-gpu/

Not so far off. So when they are released we can verify the performance.

Here is a Youtube video of overclocked 11 Vega CUs (2400G) for Witcher 3:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E8cVaZdyVqs

Cooling is not mentioned, but for my 2200G I can o/c quite well using the low profile stock cooler. Most GPU benefit is seen through RAM o/c'ing though, and most times you don't need a fan or third party cooling for this.

Here is ASRock's latest barebones solution which can support AMD APUs.
https://www.tomshardware.com/news/asrock-am4-motherboard-ryzen-amd,38391.html

If the connectivity is adequate then you can use this to build a pretty sweet small PC.

All you need is a 120W adapter. This should be more than sufficient. In my case I have measured using my good quality power meter a maximum of 90W from the socket stress testing my 2200G.

hmm... i.e. to say if i run 1080p can still game if i dont ask for too much expectations.

those 120W adapter is a external types i presume?

because my definition of itx is not those ultra small form factors.
but at least sufficient enough to fit in a gpu.
so i was looking at cases like

cm 110a
silverstone sg13
jonsbo c2
There was 1 more case from another thread that i need to go check again
some case from taobao where it is a copy of our local aftershock case that can fit in a gpu

if it is really those itx with no gpus...

inwin chopin