CPF Easy Info Thread. :)

[dork32]

Y I still think you have to compare the SHB to renting out spare rooms to see which is more attractive overall, but if you've got spare rooms and don't rent them out then the SHB is financially a no brainer, really.

good point raised. it does affects me. i now have less rooms to rent out.

the other thing is this frees up my cash locked in the property. i will have maybe 200k left. i can use this, with my savings to get a small condo for my wife. my wife was made homeless after we decoupled.

 

[henrylbh]

ok loh, i really dont know about this and what is the term they really use. i am also not aware of the schemes.

my mom does not need any rooms. she stays with me in our condo. i totally control the hdb though it is under her name. we are doing room rentals now but it is reaching mop.
mom is retired and surviving on pension. she would meet the watever income requirement because she is the only person registered in the hdb other than the tenants.
i would prefer to a 3room flat so that we can continue with our room rental.

how nice it is for me to be given the opportunity to game the system.

So you downgrading from 4rm to 3rm to get SHB? Then she may be forced into CPFL, if she is under RSS. The 30k will be paid to her in cash.

 

[dork32]

So you downgrading from 4rm to 3rm to get SHB? Then she may be forced into CPFL, if she is under RSS. The 30k will be paid to her in cash.

she not under any scheme. on pension so no need rss or cpf life. must check if she still qualifies.

 

[dork32]

So you downgrading from 4rm to 3rm to get SHB? Then she may be forced into CPFL, if she is under RSS. The 30k will be paid to her in cash.

paid in cash i even happier.

 

[henrylbh]

paid in cash i even happier.

Go read the conditions for SHB. Downgrading from 4rm to 3rm does not automatically qualify for SHB.

 

[BBCWatcher]

The SHB's up to $30,000 in free money is paid in the form of matching funds into a Retirement Account, 50 cents on the dollar as I understand it. In other words, deposit another $60,000 (proceeds from the home sale) into the seller's Retirement Account, and the government pushes $30,000 more into the seller's RA in free money. There are a few other T&Cs (and they look pretty reasonable too), but that's the major part of the money side.

It's quite interesting.

 

[dork32]

Go read the conditions for SHB. Downgrading from 4rm to 3rm does not automatically qualify for SHB.

these are the criteria,

age: mom is 70++
income: not working but got pension. Pension dont count as income. rental 700 per month. no one else in household
existing property: 4 room flat. very old already. MOP about to meet
property you are buying: any 3 room flat in the same area. price would be lower.
time frame for transaction: quickly buy quickly sell.

any more criteria?

 

[candy crush]

This remark suggests to me it probably wouldn't be wise to pay off this 2.6% interest loan because it could leave the extended family too vulnerable to an emergency, forcing a sale of your father's home.

It find it pretty incredible that so many people seem hung up on CPF-related liquidity constraints when they don't stop to think about HDB- and property-related liquidity constraints. You're much better rewarded for accepting CPF-related liquidity constraints than you are for housing-related liquidity constraints (accelerating repayment on mortgages).

....So think about this. If $27K is a mere rounding error in terms of extended family finances -- equivalent to an average Tuesday night of bar hopping -- OK, who cares, do what you want. If it's a "Whoa, that's big!" reaction, then it sure doesn't seem like a good idea for cash flow and emergency reserve reasons.

....Wouldn't anyone like to investigate the Silver Housing Bonus? (Earlier I said "Silver Support Scheme," when I actually meant the SHB. Sorry about that.) The government just announced an even sweeter Silver Housing Bonus deal, boosting the bonus from $20K to $30K. We don't have complete information, but from your descriptions so far this is a textbook Silver Housing Bonus situation. The government is kicking in up to $30,000 of free money deposited into a Retirement Account with the SHB, which coincidentally is equivalent to paying off virtually the whole mortgage!

tbh, 27k is a bit too much for me, too big amount....

 

[candy crush]

Ok, Is she below 55, between 55-65, or above 65?
Any idea about RA, SA balance? If above 65, is she receiving monthly payout from RSS/CPF Life and what is the amount?



Ok, there's still quite some missing information. I've been led to believe that your father is paying the home loan of $359/month from his OA while receiving $395/month into his bank account from CPF Life, and it looks like the second half is wrong.

At some point, most likely at age 65, your dad was either put in the Retirement Sum Scheme or the CPF Life scheme. The RA balance of $0 seems to suggests that he was put in CPF Life, which means he is receiving a monthly amount of money straight into his bank account. You should try to find out how much this amount is.

Most probably, the house loan installments are paid from OA, although it is possible your dad may have arranged to pay it with cash instead. You need to check on this.

Again, I will emphasize that if your dad has been depending on OA to service the house loan, then the OA will be completely drained in 8-9 months and he will need to start using cash, and this will eat into his presumed monthly income from CPF Life.

Ok, I will also SCREENSHOT my mum CPF account detail here for FULL FULL details later

 

[candy crush]

Ok, Is she below 55, between 55-65, or above 65?
Any idea about RA, SA balance? If above 65, is she receiving monthly payout from RSS/CPF Life and what is the amount?



Ok, there's still quite some missing information. I've been led to believe that your father is paying the home loan of $359/month from his OA while receiving $395/month into his bank account from CPF Life, and it looks like the second half is wrong.

At some point, most likely at age 65, your dad was either put in the Retirement Sum Scheme or the CPF Life scheme. The RA balance of $0 seems to suggests that he was put in CPF Life, which means he is receiving a monthly amount of money straight into his bank account. You should try to find out how much this amount is.

Most probably, the house loan installments are paid from OA, although it is possible your dad may have arranged to pay it with cash instead. You need to check on this.

Again, I will emphasize that if your dad has been depending on OA to service the house loan, then the OA will be completely drained in 8-9 months and he will need to start using cash, and this will eat into his presumed monthly income from CPF Life.

This is my mum OA, RA, MA

 

[crimsontactics]

This is my mum OA, RA, MA

I think for your case, CPF isn't useful liao.

CPF is used to earn interest when you're younger.

Best to just give your parents cash.

Sent from Samsung SM-N960F using GAGT

 

[henrylbh]

This is my mum OA, RA, MA

The disclosure offers nothing much

Likely that she is getting quarterly SSS.

There is no info on whether she is getting monthly payout (which is not much I guess) from RA or CPF Life.

She is not joint owner of the property?

If she is not, it is also difficult to guess whether she is allowed to withdraw all her OA and SA to help her hubby with the housing instalments, however little it may be, when needed.

 

[candy crush]

The disclosure offers nothing much

Likely that she is getting quarterly SSS.

There is no info on whether she is getting monthly payout (which is not much I guess) from RA or CPF Life.

She is not joint owner of the property?

If she is not, it is also difficult to guess whether she is allowed to withdraw all her OA and SA to help her hubby with the housing instalments, however little it may be, when needed.

she is a joint holder

no payout or anything from her account as I know of

 

[tangent314]

What is your mother's age?
More importantly, what is the monthly payout your dad is receiving from CPF Life?
Confirm that the home loan installments have been paid using OA and not cash?

 

[candy crush]

What is your mother's age?

67
More importantly, what is the monthly payout your dad is receiving from CPF Life?

CPF Life? my father RA is 100% empty, I might to check, most likely nothing

Confirm that the home loan installments have been paid using OA and not cash?
Yes, from OA

replied all above, thanks

 

[dork32]

I think for your case, CPF isn't useful liao.

CPF is used to earn interest when you're younger.

Best to just give your parents cash.

Sent from Samsung SM-N960F using GAGT

i stand on the opposite end.

cpf is useless when you are younger. you can just watch it grow and feel good about it. it cannot be used to for most other things.

cpf sa pays 4% to a 25 year old. it also pays 4% to a 65 year old. is there any difference? the biggest difference is 65 year old can taste the benefit of the 4% immediately. 25 year old cannot.

i rather not give parents cash. i put in into the their cpf such that they have a payout and earn 4%. this will also prevent them from squandering the money.

 

[tangent314]

CPF Life? my father RA is 100% empty, I might to check, most likely nothing

Nothing in RA pretty much confirms he is on CPF Life.
Find out how much he is getting per month.

 

[JF123456]

You MUST top up your RA to FRS before you drop the shield. If you get the order wrong, your SA will be moved to RA (up to the FRS) immediately after you drop your shield. If you wish, you can take your time to top up from FRS to ERS, up until when you want to begin CPF Life payouts. Not sure why you would want to do that and lose out on the 4% interest though.

Just checking that you have an Integrated Shield Plan in place, and Medishield topped up to BHS. It doesn't affect any of the above. Of course, if you have an expensive rider, you will need more retirement income to pay for that.

Sorry, need to check this again ..
1. Instead of cash topup RA to meet FRS, can my spouse do CPF xfer to my RA ? The limit is ERS, right ?
2. @ 65, I can still withdraw all the bal money fr RA, if I want my CPFLife at BRS , and if I use property to pledge. Is this correct?
I need not hv to touch SA $ for withdrawal, right ?
3, Above 55 to 65 : If i want to withdraw any $ from RA ( assume this RA > FRS), can this be done? Or it has to be come fr SA first ?

Thanks !

 

[tangent314]

1. Instead of cash topup RA to meet FRS, can my spouse do CPF xfer to my RA ? The limit is ERS, right ?
2. @ 65, I can still withdraw all the bal money fr RA, if I want my CPFLife at BRS , and if I use property to pledge. Is this correct?
I need not hv to touch SA $ for withdrawal, right ?
3, Above 55 to 65 : If i want to withdraw any $ from RA ( assume this RA > FRS), can this be done? Or it has to be come fr SA first ?

https://www.cpf.gov.sg/Members/Schemes/schemes/retirement/retirement-sum-topping-up-scheme answers your questions

1. Besides the ERS limit for you, she cannot fall below the BRS amount in her OA account (if below 55)
2. With a property pledge, there are also other exclusions to what you can withdraw above the BRS. Interest earned, government topups and all RSTU top-ups and transfers are all excluded from being withdrawn.
3. You cannot withdraw from your RA before the payout eligible age except for the $5k that you can unconditionally take out anytime above age 55 and starting your CPF Life payouts.

Just before you start your CPF Life payout you can choose to withdraw 20% of your RA (less the $5k that you optionally took out earlier).

Seriously, I think you are over complicating things trying to take money out. I don't recommend opting for BRS when you can afford to max out your SA shielding and top up your RA to ERS to max out your CPF Life monthly payouts.

 

[BBCWatcher]

1. Besides the ERS limit for you, she cannot fall below the BRS amount in her OA account (assuming she's below 55)

You meant SA there, right?

2. With a property pledge, there are also other exclusions to what you can withdraw above the BRS. Interest earned, government topups and all RSTU top-ups and transfers are all excluded from being withdrawn.

One exception: self-to-self OA to SA transfers do not affect future Retirement Account withdrawal limits, except that you'll have more total CPF dollars available because SA earns higher interest.

3. You cannot withdraw from your RA before the payout eligible age except for the $5k that you can unconditionally take out anytime above age 55 and starting your CPF Life payouts.

That's not correct as a general statement.

Just before you start your CPF Life payout you can choose to withdraw 20% of your RA (less the $5k that you optionally took out earlier).

Seriously, I think you are over complicating things trying to take money out. I don't recommend opting for BRS when you can afford to max out your SA shielding and top up your RA to ERS to max out your CPF Life monthly payouts.

Amen, full agreement. I really, really don't understand why so many people are so concerned about how much they can reduce a 4+% interest earning account (their Retirement Account) that then pays them monthly retirement income for life. Has anyone checked market interest rates on savings lately?

I know y'all are not actually withdrawing money from your Retirement Accounts at age 55+, at least not most of you, because....

1. I haven't received even one invitation to any 55th birthday bashes at all, much less any fabulous parties with S$50K+ CPF withdrawal-funded champagne budgets. What's wrong with you people not sending me any of these party invitations?

2. The government releases some basic statistics on age 55+ behaviors, and CPF members are most often keeping their Retirement Accounts intact and even depositing more dollars into them. CPF inflows are pretty big right now, as they should be. (Did I mention those market interest rates?)

I don't get it. It's like 25% of the posts here are about "How do I shoot myself in the head on or shortly after my 55th birthday?" (Financially speaking.) Weird!