CPF Retirement Sum Scheme

[maple96]

You might not be on CPF LIFE if your RA balance is low (under $60,000) .

U are wrong! read my previous post

 

[maple96]

It really does depend.
My mum recently made a choice too, based on my recommendation she went for CPF Life Escalating plan. Maybe it's less money for me if she passes early, but I want her to have a fulfilling life all the way to the end if she remains healthy.

thank you for supporting CPF Life Pool

 

[BBCWatcher]

U are wrong! read my previous post

No, I am not wrong. “You might not be on CPF LIFE if your RA balance is low (under $60,000)” is a correct statement. “You can choose to be on CPF LIFE with any RA balance as long as you join before age 80” is also a correct statement.

Apply basic standards of English reading comprehension, please.

 

[maple96]

No, I am not wrong. “You might not be on CPF LIFE if your RA balance is low (under $60,000)” is a correct statement. “You can choose to be on CPF LIFE with any RA balance as long as you join before age 80” is also a correct statement.

Apply basic standards of English reading comprehension, please.

The age 80 limit is simply the deadline for choosing CPF LIFE (any CPF LIFE payout plan) if you aren’t already on CPF LIFE. You might not be on CPF LIFE if your RA balance is low (under $60,000) or if you’ve previously opted out because you have a suitable private annuity/pension substitute. And I think the CPF LIFE enrollment deadline is actually slightly earlier for administrative reasons, so don’t cut that one too close.

Current rules, subject to change.

U just need to read the whole para to see exactly what u are hinting (oops misleading) at. Nobody with correct understanding or good writing skills will write it together (embedded in between) with age 80 limit blur blur blur

the rest u got it right this time after I pointed your mistakes several times

 

[BBCWatcher]

U just need to read the whole para to see exactly what u are hinting (oops misleading) at.

What on earth are you talking about? You’re now backing off and suggesting I’m “hinting,” and that bothers you? Hinting what?

 

[foozgarden]

tangent did something like dat before. it is quite good. i too lazy to do it. hey, maybe i too stupid to do it.

. too old and stupid for this too..

for the benefit of others, is this the one?
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/16_iStt8MTouMHg1BMV6rPH3Q8M4e5_eiUEiOnqF5HjE/edit#gid=0

on the other thread, i am telling mummy to choose basic and delay to 70.

notice how the advice is different for different. different people have different needs, perception. this is why cpf life have evolved into such a complex system

i will not go around tell everyone the escalating on ers and drawing at 70 is the best deal for everyone.

haha... i know what you did there..

There must be some misunderstanding. You need to say whether he has met the min sum at 55 to get 1,012 and whether he had top-up above his cohort min sum. Assuming he has met the min sum at 55, he would be getting the original (fixed for each cohort) payout from 65. Even if he decided to start payout at 70, the original payout would apply and the payout would last much longer than 20 years as CPF indicated that each deferred year would extend the payouts by about 2 additional years.

55 years is 15 years ago..
now age 70... cannot rmbr leh..

At the start, how could any CPF Life Plan give more payout than RSS.

The last cohort with min sum of $139k will be getting $1240 from age 65.

The first batch with FRS of $148k will be getting (from age 65) -

SP btw $1033 and 1128
BP btw $948 and 1039
EP $1,100 (average ?)

based on figures quoted, problably did not hit then?
since the cpf letter received @70 states that the RSS payout is 1012

 

[cscs3]

No, I am not wrong. “You might not be on CPF LIFE if your RA balance is low (under $60,000)” is a correct statement. “You can choose to be on CPF LIFE with any RA balance as long as you join before age 80” is also a correct statement.

Apply basic standards of English reading comprehension, please.

This is real copy/paste from CPF letter to one of my relative. His CPF account is less then $60K...…

Dear CPF member,

You will be turning 65 in February 2019. Based on your Retirement Account balance of $20,354.86 as at 31/10/2018, you can receive
$250.00 monthly from February 2019 under the CPF Retirement Sum Scheme. Your payouts will last about 9 years.

You can choose to start your payouts between age 65 and age 70. Starting your payouts later will enable you to enjoy a longer duration of payouts and/or higher payouts.

No action is required if you wish to start your payouts at age 70.

Should you decide to start your payouts before age 70, please complete and send the enclosed form to us. If you have a POSB, DBS, OCBC or UOB account, apply online atwww.cpf.gov.sq.

…...2nd page

1. What other payout options do I have?
If you would like to receive a monthly payout for as long as you live, you can choose to join CPF LIFE. You can do so any time before age 80. To join CPF LIFE, you can choose one of the three plans:
Life Standard plan / Life Basic plan / Life Escalating plan

2. What other options do I have?
If you still have savings in your Ordinary and/or Special Account, you can choose one of the follow options:
Transfer / Do nothing / Withdraw

……

Not sure if there is requirement for $60K

In any case, my suggestion is always make a appointment with CPF to find out more details. Some place, even like my UOB RM can tell me "you cannot get your CPF money by age 65 anymore...." This kind of RM need to be killed and not fit to stay in banking line. He clearly want your money by not telling you the full story.

Guess is the same for some who does not like CPF system. (Then I would suggest he go thru pension system that are running in some of our of country like Taiwan! and USA).

 

[cscs3]

Since your kin is turning 65 (soon), he is by default under RSS. Anytime from age 65 (to just before 70), he need to apply to commence payout. Otherwise, payout will commence automatically at age 70.

He has the option to convert RSS to CPF Life when he decides to commence payout.

In short, he need not decide RSS or CPF Life soon, unless he decides to commence payout soon. But I if I am not wrong, he can still opt for CPF Life, if he has commenced payout under RSS, but not the other way round.

100% right on your comment. See the sample letter I put up on another post.

 

[cscs3]

thank you for supporting CPF Life Pool

This show that he understand the system well and make a good plan for his mum base on needs.

Another one many did not think off that I use to do until my mum pass away. Instead of giving my mum pocket money every month. I choose to top up her CPF account every year and let CPF handle her monthly payment.

She got what she need (plus interest earned in CPF) and I get tax rebate from my income tax. I asked my children to do the same for me too. This was a tips given by CPF staff when I visited them to do some enquires.

 

[BBCWatcher]

Not sure if there is requirement for $60K

If you’re born in 1958 or later, if your Retirement Account balance is $60,000 or more, if you are not an ex-citizen or ex-Permanent Resident who has left Singapore and West Malaysia, if you are not age 80 or older (currently redundant to the 1958 or later birth year), and if you have not applied for and qualified for a waiver (based on having an alternative acceptable private life annuity), then you’ll be required to participate in CPF LIFE. That’s where the $60,000 threshold comes from, and that’s its only direct significance.

 

[dork32]

. too old and stupid for this too..

for the benefit of others, is this the one?
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/16_iStt8MTouMHg1BMV6rPH3Q8M4e5_eiUEiOnqF5HjE/edit#gid=0

you have to modify the spread sheet to get it for basic. the bequest must *1.04 to consider the interest.

 

[henrylbh]

Is it not so easy? Till now still nobody provide CPF Life Basic plan calculation (after tangent has posted the spreadsheets for calculating CPF Life Standard and Escalating plans).

The missing ingredient to calculate is the amount of unused annuity premium at each point of time.

 

[tangent314]

I'm skeptical about the numbers from the CPF estimator for basic plan. They are based on 0% deduction for the LIF. If the estimator includes the LIF deduction I would be able to calculate what the deduction is.

Either the CPF estimator is wrong, the FAQ is wrong, or there's another factor in the calculation that I'm unaware of. If the FAQ is wrong, I can't see how the basic plan is sustainable, even taking into account bonus interest.

I've written in to ask CPF about it, let's see if they will answer.

 

[Mecisteus]

you have to modify the spread sheet to get it for basic. the bequest must *1.04 to consider the interest.

Must add the 20% unused premium without interests.

 

[tangent314]

Yes I did try modeling the 'refund of unused premiums' for various percentages between 5 and 25%, but cannot match the estimator numbers. Only 0% matches

 

[Mecisteus]

Yes I did try modeling the 'refund of unused premiums' for various percentages between 5 and 25%, but cannot match the estimator numbers. Only 0% matches

You mean you tried 80% annuity from RA (@>4%) and 20% annuity (@0%).

Did you try to model as a 100% annuity from the RA balance?

 

[maple96]

If you’re born in 1958 or later, if your Retirement Account balance is $60,000 or more, if you are not an ex-citizen or ex-Permanent Resident who has left Singapore and West Malaysia, if you are not age 80 or older (currently redundant to the 1958 or later birth year), and if you have not applied for and qualified for a waiver (based on having an alternative acceptable private life annuity), then you’ll be required to participate in CPF LIFE. That’s where the $60,000 threshold comes from, and that’s its only direct significance.

Such a simple rule or question posted, u cannot give a simple answer, just because u a made a mistake and must answer with all the complicated qualifications

Just read this CPF rule:

You will automatically be included in CPF LIFE to enjoy lifelong payouts if:

- you are a Singapore Citizen or Permanent Resident born in 1958 or after ; and
- have at least $60,000 in your Retirement Account six months before you reach your payout eligibility age (PEA) .

If you are a Singaporean Citizen or Permanent Resident who does not meet the above requirements, you can still apply to join CPF LIFE and start receiving lifelong income, at any time between your payout eligibility age and one month before you turn 80 years old.

In short, those under RSS (this thread is for them) can still join CPF Life anytime before they are 80 without any minimum sum requirement.

 

[Mecisteus]

Yes I did try modeling the 'refund of unused premiums' for various percentages between 5 and 25%, but cannot match the estimator numbers. Only 0% matches

I used my phone to try. No Excel. Just CPF calculator and online calculator.

RA Balance of $300k @Age 65 for Male
$240k -> RA
$60k -> Lifelong Fund (20%)

Monthly payouts for Basic about $1,459. This will last 23 years from age 65 using 5% interest rate.

You take the remaining $60k divide by $1,459 can last you 41 months from 88.

Bequests go to zero at age 92.

To show my estimations are correct:

I calculated my estimated bequests from age 65 to 92, they match with the bequests from CPF Life.

 

[BBCWatcher]

Such a simple rule or question posted, u cannot give a simple answer, just because u a made a mistake and must answer with all the complicated qualifications

If you have a problem with what I wrote, point out the problem. (You don’t; it’s correct.)

Skip the snide remarks, please.

 

[maple96]

I used my phone to try. No Excel. Just CPF calculator and online calculator.

RA Balance of $300k @Age 65 for Male
$240k -> RA
$60k -> Lifelong Fund (20%)

Monthly payouts for Basic about $1,459. This will last 23 years from age 65 using 5% interest rate.

You take the remaining $60k divide by $1,459 can last you 41 months from 88.

Bequests go to zero at age 92.

To show my estimations are correct:

I calculated my estimated bequests from age 65 to 92, they match with the bequests from CPF Life.

CPF calculator cannot be wrong, I have calculated it before years back.

U have to compound the balance in RA (80%) with 4% interest plus compound the extra interest of 900 pa at 4%. The 20% premium earns no interest. U shld be able to estimate the CPF calculated figures.

If u want to know when u will breakeven, compound the 20% premium with 4% interest to calculate.

I think henry also done it years back and shared his works, dork32 also did something if I remembered correctly.

That's why we all talk so much about Basic Plan