De-dollarization is happening.

[cal127]

well....i'm just stating facts. how does that mean I am supporting Russia just because i stated the fact that SWIFT is weaponized by the US(and the western world by proxy) against more and more countries?

Because you haven't taken those countries and their baggage into consideration. You haven't tackled the reason which will lead to us to better understand why. Without understanding why you wouldn't know or understand whether its right or wrong to kick a country off SWIFT. Weaponising SWIFT can be a force for good. That's the point.

the problem with using SWIFT as a weapon comes when the ostracized economies becomes the majority rather than a tiny minority, at that point, US(and western world by proxy) becomes the ones who get ostracized.

You might be obsessed with the step towards breaking the dollar quasi monopoly on transnational payments that will allow in due course parties to totally by-pass the US. But I don't think you understand what SWIFT does and its importance. What is important is that the US have the duty to monitor the payments and not to allow it to become the recepient of illegal or unjust transfers. Reliability and trust of the system are paramount. SWIFT and CIPS (as its main competitor) should compete on effeciency and reliability but certainly not on harbouring illicit flows of funds. Any abuse, a feature that was clearly suspected as long as the dollar held a de facto monopoly, will now be able to be sanctioned by a loss of reputation. On balance one should wholeheartedley welcome this development if the integrity of the system is to be fully preserved. US or the West does not sanction countries for no good reason or condone actions that will jeopardize their currency status. CIPS accept transactions in RMB. Are countries ready to accept RMB?

actually other than that, it seems like we are in agreement?
building up productive investments using surplus is basically dumping fiat for hard assets that generate productivity is one of the ways to hedge oneself from any monetary shifts. i'm not even sure what you are arguing about at this point.

That's one of the ways we can benefit from trading with US on a deficit but what did we agree on. Just the outcome? You still haven't convince us why your alternative is better.

 

[bakuten]

Because you haven't taken those countries and their baggage into consideration. You haven't tackled the reason which will lead to us to better understand why. Without understanding why you wouldn't know or understand whether its right or wrong to kick a country off SWIFT. Weaponising SWIFT can be a force for good. That's the point.



You might be obsessed with the step towards breaking the dollar quasi monopoly on transnational payments that will allow in due course parties to totally by-pass the US. But I don't think you understand what SWIFT does and its importance. What is important is that the US have the duty to monitor the payments and not to allow it to become the recepient of illegal or unjust transfers. Reliability and trust of the system are paramount. SWIFT and CIPS (as its main competitor) should compete on effeciency and reliability but certainly not on harbouring illicit flows of funds. Any abuse, a feature that was clearly suspected as long as the dollar held a de facto monopoly, will now be able to be sanctioned by a loss of reputation. On balance one should wholeheartedley welcome this development if the integrity of the system is to be fully preserved. US or the West does not sanction countries for no good reason or condone actions that will jeopardize their currency status. CIPS accept transactions in RMB. Are countries ready to accept RMB?




That's one of the ways we can benefit from trading with US on a deficit but what did we agree on. Just the outcome? You still haven't convince us why your alternative is better.

yeah i'm just pointing out what countries are responding to the sanctions....whether they succeed or not or good or not is another thing. doesn't change the fact that these countries are still moving away from USD which is what the topic is about no? dunno why suddenly i become supporter of Russia and Iran n all that adhominems


SG is clearly a big beneficiary of the current system which i have not disagreed, but despite all this, even SG govt have increased our gold holdings by more than 50% over the past few years in order to hedge against this ongoing de-dollarization

 

[cal127]

yeah i'm just pointing out what countries are responding to the sanctions....whether they succeed or not or good or not is another thing. doesn't change the fact that these countries are still moving away from USD which is what the topic is about no? dunno why suddenly i become supporter of Russia and Iran n all that adhominems


SG is clearly a big beneficiary of the current system which i have not disagreed, but despite all this, even SG govt have increased our gold holdings by more than 50% over the past few years in order to hedge against this ongoing de-dollarization

You sure or not. I already explained. This kinda gives the impression we are giving up or moving away from USD. Another false notion. You can google it yourself. The reason I picked those two countries is because they are the most prominant for obvious reasons. In fact I googled for fun the US current reserve percentage. This is what came up on the front page without visiting wiki:

Global currency reserves

v t e	2023	2022
US dollar	58.41%	58.52%
Euro (until 1999—ECU)	19.98%	20.40%
Japanese yen	5.70%	5.51%
Pound sterling	4.84%	4.92%

Some countries are moving away. True. So what? Not as high as it used to be but the USD still remain dominant by any sane measure despite more countries responding. You are advocating de-dollarisation, its not about good or bad (you refused to elaborate) but you're worried enough to make your point across about moving away? Doesn't make a lot of sense. Where's the ad-hominem? Just calling you out for your weird assertions that you failed to substantiate. Still haven't convince us with your alternative.