Full retirement sum trend

[OngHuatHuat]

I don’t have so much money to put in cpf, maybe at most just 6- 10 k per year, mostly into SA and part into MA.

I need to some detailed calculations from my side.

OK I do rough calculation (did not double check) for yyhwin. If invest 37,740 at beginning of each year from 30yo to 55yo CPF would accumulate to -

OA $723k
MA $330k
SA $406k

based on prevailing rates of 2.5% and 4% without counting additional interest on 1st 60k and no overflow of MA to SA/OA and no government top-ups.

Assuming SA is the actual FRS at 55 and half of MA overflow to OA after meeting BHS, there will be $888k in OA.

Interest alone would be $22,200 a year from 55, if OA is not withdrawn. If 888 is withdrawn over 35 years to 90yo, go calculate how much can withdraw a year. You get even more if you can shield your SA just before 55.

No easy for me to rough guess what CPF Life payout would be based on 406k at 55.

 

[henrylbh]

Seems like a good idea.

Withdraw interest then if funds not needed, can VC back to earn interest.

That’s why I hope they don’t increase too much, coz it will affect the funds in OA and SA which is available for withdrawal after 55.

What thinking you "Withdraw interest then if funds not needed, can VC back to earn interest"

You VC the interest withdrawn so that part of it goes int SA leh.

 

[OngHuatHuat]

After 55 cannot transfer OA to SA anymore right?

What thinking you "Withdraw interest then if funds not needed, can VC back to earn interest"

You VC the interest withdrawn so that part of it goes int SA leh.

 

[henrylbh]

I don’t have so much money to put in cpf, maybe at most just 6- 10 k per year, mostly into SA and part into MA.

I need to some detailed calculations from my side.

But you said you can't just depend on CPF Life payout and you need to plan other sources which means you need money to invest. That how I think you can put into Cpf instead to avoid headache like noble.

 

[OngHuatHuat]

My whole portfolio investment returns beat cpf by quite a big margin, noble loss dragged down my returns, but every year I had another winner to beat that loss throughout that 3 years of noble holdings.
However, cannot assume market to be in hull run all the time.

But you said you can't just depend on CPF Life payout and you need to plan other sources which means you need money to invest. That how I think you can put into Cpf instead to avoid headache like noble.

 

[V_for_Vanilla]

Taking responsibility for your own retirement means looking at all the options and working out that the government's way is the best way.

Nope. Taking responsibility for our own retirement means the govt should not stick its hands in our financial affairs especially the CPF.

 

[BBCWatcher]

After I set aside the retirement sum, I may need some extra cash to venture into another small business or pay down my mortgage loans.

Yes, the bottom line is you're overextended with too high a debt load relative to your income and stage in life, and interest rates are rising. You need to fix that.

If you're genuinely worried about whether ~$800/month (2018 dollars, for example) of income from age 65 will be too much, then you've got a big problem, now.

 

[henrylbh]

My whole portfolio investment returns beat cpf by quite a big margin, noble loss dragged down my returns, but every year I had another winner to beat that loss throughout that 3 years of noble holdings.
However, cannot assume market to be in hull run all the time.

If you confident to beat CPF's rates all the way to 55 and disciplined enough to keep the pie that should be bigger than had it been in CPF, till retirement, then no reason to do what I thought aloud.

 

[BBCWatcher]

If you confident to beat CPF's rates all the way to 55 and disciplined enough to keep the pie that should be bigger than had it been in CPF, till retirement, then no reason to do what I thought aloud.

Except yyhwin isn't confident. If he were confident of doing so well, then he wouldn't be worried that the Basic Retirement Sum might be 10% higher than he expects. Or, equivalently, that about $800/month instead of about $700/month (2018 dollars) from age 65 will be too much income.

There's no logic here that makes sense, except that yyhwin is (as reported elsewhere) overextended, carrying a big debt load, and with interest rates creeping up. Yes, that's a problem, and that's the problem to fix. If you're looking ahead and worried that CPF at BRS level (or BRS level plus 10%) will "crimp your style," you've got a problem! It might be a problem akin to a gambling addiction, and then thank goodness CPF isn't going to let you completely wipe out (if you're working in Singapore and have CPF contributions).

 

[OngHuatHuat]

Cpf return for me is consistently 4 % + 600, last 3 years not difficult to beat since I invested most of my funds in year 2016, which is the rebound year for both Sg and hk markets.

This year not so confident anymore.

I have another option, that is to put in Dbs multiplier and boc smart saver, I have means to hit highest tier 3.55 % interest for dbs multiplier, but boc smart saver ranges from 2.75 % to 3.55 % depending on whether I have insurance to pay for that month. Dbs multiplier: 50000 and boc smart saver: 60000.

Regarding the rest of the funds, currently I am thinking of repaying my malaysia property loan, the interest is 4.66 %. Since I am earning sgd and sgd has been falling against ringgit recently, this part of interest is killing me, so I need to get rid of it first.

If you confident to beat CPF's rates all the way to 55 and disciplined enough to keep the pie that should be bigger than had it been in CPF, till retirement, then no reason to do what I thought aloud.

 

[OngHuatHuat]

I like to speculate and do risky trades, got once leverage up to 10 x using borrowed funds and margin. Perhaps I should cut down on these activities before I am over exposed.

Except yyhwin isn't confident. If he were confident of doing so well, then he wouldn't be worried that the Basic Retirement Sum might be 10% higher than he expects. Or, equivalently, that about $800/month instead of about $700/month (2018 dollars) from age 65 will be too much income.

There's no logic here that makes sense, except that yyhwin is (as reported elsewhere) overextended, carrying a big debt load, and with interest rates creeping up. Yes, that's a problem, and that's the problem to fix. If you're looking ahead and worried that CPF at BRS level (or BRS level plus 10%) will "crimp your style," you've got a problem! It might be a problem akin to a gambling addiction, and then thank goodness CPF isn't going to let you completely wipe out (if you're working in Singapore and have CPF contributions).

 

[BBCWatcher]

I like to speculate and do risky trades, got once leverage up to 10 x using borrowed funds and margin. Perhaps I should cut down on these activities before I am over exposed.

Allow me to correct that second sentence for you:

I should cut down on these activities since I am over exposed.

 

[cscs3]

PRC propaganda pieces to have only one child and rely on the government for retirement

The 2nd 2 articles are to delay retirement and rely on own savings rather than government pensions.

Clearly the newspaper "news" is very old. Today china has relex on one child policy.

China is basically still on something very similar on pension system. This is fine as long as country continent growth. If you happen to born and work in Taiwan. You may notice from 01/JUL this year, pension is cut back by 30% or More due to government predict they will run out of reserved in x number of years. Many old folks may run into fanicial problem due to this change.

 

[OngHuatHuat]

Actually I have closed most positions since last month, so now I start to pay down my ringgit loan first.

Allow me to correct that second sentence for you:

 

[tangent314]

So no need for you to worry about an increase in BRS anymore right?

 

[OngHuatHuat]

So no need for you to worry about an increase in BRS anymore right?

Still need, coz I prefer not to put so much money in annuity, but I want to enjoy the 4% +600 interest

 

[kbat7923]

If we are learning not to rely on our government for our retirement, should the government also learn not to rely on taxes?

It's a fair trade. Right? Hmmm

 

[henrylbh]

I like to speculate and do risky trades, got once leverage up to 10 x using borrowed funds and margin. Perhaps I should cut down on these activities before I am over exposed.

You are over exposed on real estates. So what activities are you trying to cut down?

 

[BBCWatcher]

Still need, coz I prefer not to put so much money in annuity....

The Basic Retirement Sum (BRS) is "so much money"? It's $85,500 (2018 figure), pre-tax. That's a mere pittance given your tremendous wealth and income, surely.

....Of all the things to worry about, it's MOST odd to worry about whether ~S$800/month from age 65 for life will be too much. No, it really, really ain't.

 

[henrylbh]

If we are learning not to rely on our government for our retirement, should the government also learn not to rely on taxes?

It's a fair trade. Right? Hmmm

You know what you talking? The rich will be happiest and the gap with the havenots will widen.