Help: Dad passed on

[BBCWatcher]

The car has been parked in HDB parking lot for like 2 months, I think season parking expired, can't pay as well since cannot access Singpass (I hope they don't fine me).

I believe you can check whether the season parking has expired (or when it expires) using this e-form. You can search using the Vehicle No. or your father's NRIC. You might even be able to pay for a parking renewal using this same e-form (and without Singpass), but I'm not sure about that.

It's common for season car parking to be under GIRO or credit/debit card monthly payment arrangements. You may discover the season parking payments are up to date.

If you have any trouble then contact HDB (online form), explain the situation, and ask what to do.

 

[jayou8]

Sorry to hear about your loss. Stay strong.

With regards to the car, if you intend to tow to the car workshop and once rectified, send to the car dealer, you can consider not renewing the season parking as the tow truck would just tow it out of the carpark.

 

[g_t2006]

Thanks guys for all the advice.

An update:

We decided to go with a lawyer to get letter of administration ($950 nett, meeting them next week), then using that to transfer ownership of car to my mother, then sell it.

I regret not using his Singpass to logon and do transfer of ownership online when I could do it. A day after his passing, I could still logon but I used that time to check banks, insurance accounts, then second day can't logon already, called Singpass customer service they say ICA will immediately terminate the Singpass account when they receive a death notice.

The car is a 2008 Toyota Wish (model WISH 1.8XE A), i think my Dad renewed the COE in 2018, so the current COE expires on 15 June 2028. No idea if it has outstanding loan though. The car has been parked in HDB parking lot for like 2 months, I think season parking expired, can't pay as well since cannot access Singpass (I hope they don't fine me).

Currently car battery flat, called a car dealer came down to see, can't start with a starter box, advised me to tow to a workshop and check first. I told him give me sometime to consider.

I don't think you have any of a choice except to tow it to a workshop.

I suggest you transfer the vehicle to your name as you are a named driver and you'll be able to drive the vehicle. Also, if you are transferring the vehicle to your mum, you mum will have to go down to LTA for the transfer. For deceased cases, can only go down to LTA for the transfer. No other way to do it.

 

[henrylbh]

I don't see how stupid it is. It is to protect the person who sold/bought the vehicle/flat.

If there is no legal owner to the vehicle/flat, then the person buying will be buying from a dead person? Who will be responsible for future unforeseen issues like there's a dispute on the deceased's side?

It is time consuming and perhaps emotionally draining. I have gone thru this process. But as the legal owner of the vehicle that my late father possessed, I can do anything I want with the vehicle. I can make the final decision whether to keep the vehicle or sell it or give it to someone. What if everyone has a different opinion on what to do with the vehicle/flat?

I said stupid if the rule is the same as hdb.

The administrator is the legal representative of the deceased and he is liable for whatever he does with the estate and he can dispose any asset he deemed fit.

I am not sure whether you understand what you went through with LTA. With LOA, was the car ownership transferred to your name directly as owner or to you as administrator (or trustee). The Administrator can dispose it to any person.

For HDB flat, the flat need to be transmitted to the administrator (as trustee, not owner) and after that he can dispose it to the final beneficiary/ies or the buyer. If I am the sole beneficiary, the administrator has to transfer the flat to me as final owner or to a buyer as the final owner if it is sold. As Administrator and sole beneficiary I can't tell hdb to recognise me as owner without transmission. It has to go through the process of transmission from deceased to administrator then to beneficiary/ies or buyer/s.

 

[henrylbh]

I don't think you have any of a choice except to tow it to a workshop.

I suggest you transfer the vehicle to your name as you are a named driver and you'll be able to drive the vehicle. Also, if you are transferring the vehicle to your mum, you mum will have to go down to LTA for the transfer. For deceased cases, can only go down to LTA for the transfer. No other way to do it.

In handling a dead car in hdb carpark, every month incurs parking fee of $110. Try towing it out if season parking has expired to siam paying outstanding charges. Towing fee is much cheaper than parking fee). You need to consider whether road tax/insurance are still valid. There will be transfer fee to change ownership and the new owner need to buy insurance etc. (I believe it can be sold directly without transfer to the mother or any family member).

Go workshop and charge the battery and if the car comes alive, then don't bother about the car condition or do anything to it. Car agent would not offer you a better price cause his cost of touch up to sell is so much cheaper.

 

[blurpandasg2014]

My condolences to you and your family. You need to apply for letter of administration through a lawyer. Get those big firms like PKWA

 

[henrylbh]

No one want to buy a deceased car.

What the problem with buying a deceased's car compared to a residence? I sold my father's flat after he passed away. I got the highest price at that time and it was sold within MOP. The highest price at that time was $338k for similar size few blocks away. I managed to sell at $353k. The buyer would know the flat is from a deceased person as I sold it as an Administrator.

 

[henrylbh]

Thanks guys for all the advice.

An update:

We decided to go with a lawyer to get letter of administration ($950 nett, meeting them next week), then using that to transfer ownership of car to my mother, then sell it.

I regret not using his Singpass to logon and do transfer of ownership online when I could do it. A day after his passing, I could still logon but I used that time to check banks, insurance accounts, then second day can't logon already, called Singpass customer service they say ICA will immediately terminate the Singpass account when they receive a death notice.

The car is a 2008 Toyota Wish (model WISH 1.8XE A), i think my Dad renewed the COE in 2018, so the current COE expires on 15 June 2028. No idea if it has outstanding loan though. The car has been parked in HDB parking lot for like 2 months, I think season parking expired, can't pay as well since cannot access Singpass (I hope they don't fine me).

Currently car battery flat, called a car dealer came down to see, can't start with a starter box, advised me to tow to a workshop and check first. I told him give me sometime to consider.

You got Populus to act?

The time taken to get the LOA should be less than 3 months (some 1 month is possible) if there is no delay - like all necessary doc are given in one appointment and any appointments to meet lawyer are attended to promptly. Also make ensure that all assets (that require LOA) are given to the lawyer as discovery of assets after LOA is issued will incur additional cost.

 

[henrylbh]

My condolences to you and your family. You need to apply for letter of administration through a lawyer. Get those big firms like PKWA

His case is a simple and non-contentious one. Go for the cheapest.

 

[blurpandasg2014]

I engaged a small law firm for my relative grant of probate. Really lousy service and it has been dragging for mths.

 

[Coffeelix]

Ya in short, they are just out to earn $ via the "system". Cant blame them too, study so long but doing mostly administrative stuffs that can be handled by secretary/admin staff.
back then when i researched abt Probate and LoA, its actually possible to DIY if one wishes to if its a simple case, just alot technical terms to fill in the forms

Everything is done online.

Indeed Can diy

 

[Coffeelix]

I engaged a small law firm for my relative grant of probate. Really lousy service and it has been dragging for mths.

Fully agreed.

 

[Goodintentions]

Your father CPF will be auto-handled by CPF and distribute according to the people nominated. You don't have to worry about this. Same goes for DPS.

Getting a LOA / grant of probate is absolutely necessary, you cannot ownself transfer assets or sell assets without it legally! The next step is of course transfer all bills, property taxes to whoever is gonna be responsible for it. The more you DIY, the less lawyer fees.

As for the car, after getting the grant of probate, make sure you have paid for the road tax fully first, you cannot sell if its not fully paid. I am surprised no one mentioned this. Also if you don't intend to take over, let the dealer handle the sale, the dealer is more interested in the left over COE value of the car, with the way COE has appreciated just this year to hit record highs, I think the value of the car has actually appreciated just on COE alone.

 

[henrylbh]

I engaged a small law firm for my relative grant of probate. Really lousy service and it has been dragging for mths.

Just your luck. I went to discuss with the cheapest lawyer I could find in web search.

The office is no bigger than my bedroom

Not only that, the small area is shared with another solo lawyer and both have no assistant. Can you imagine the place with partitions and a cramped place for reception with no receptionist Believe or not, he also has his exercise equipment in office

The next visit I brought him all the requisite doc and he photocopied those doc himself and I set besides him and he started online application and forward me the application. From that day onwards, he would sent email of what he has submitted and we would communicate through emails on further actions and appointments. Within 6 weeks I got my LOA even with time taken to obtain my mum's death certificate from ICA.

I am impressed and the cheapest cost in 2018 was $1200 net of other charges and not 1c more for disbursements etc including fee for commissioner of oaths. He also offered packet drinks for clients

My next lawyer for probate is a large alliance of lawyers for $990. We communicate through group chats and I had to put him and his assistant in place for work done and miscommunications. End up I paid more than $990 because of this and that rubbish including his failure to give proper quote when I first presented the will and the situation. Personally, I expected to pay more but not the way we communicated subsequently.

 

[henrylbh]

My condolences to you and your family. You need to apply for letter of administration through a lawyer. Get those big firms like PKWA

You used the PKWA before? After half hour of discussion, I decided not to engage them and went for a cheaper one

 

[MoDiE]

My dad passed on 2 years ago, didn't leave any will or do any cpf nomination.

Public trustee under Ministry of Law disbursed his CPF balance to the family, but will take a small % from the amount. Disbursement is according to law, 50% to spouse and other 50% amongst children equally.

His bank accounts lucky we have access to and transferred out all the funds. However his CPF-IS account still has some cash balance which we have no idea how to access now since his CPF account is already closed.

 

[henrylbh]

My dad passed on 2 years ago, didn't leave any will or do any cpf nomination.

Public trustee under Ministry of Law disbursed his CPF balance to the family, but will take a small % from the amount. Disbursement is according to law, 50% to spouse and other 50% amongst children equally.

His bank accounts lucky we have access to and transferred out all the funds. However his CPF-IS account still has some cash balance which we have no idea how to access now since his CPF account is already closed.

However much there is in his CPF-IS should not be a concern. After a month or two at most, the balance with the agent bank will be automatically transferred back to the member's CPF. You concern should be whether he had any shares in CPF-IS and it can of meaningful value, unlike my dad who had shares not worth for me to take over or do anything though I have the Letter of Administration.

 

[Eternit]

You got Populus to act?

The time taken to get the LOA should be less than 3 months (some 1 month is possible) if there is no delay - like all necessary doc are given in one appointment and any appointments to meet lawyer are attended to promptly. Also make ensure that all assets (that require LOA) are given to the lawyer as discovery of assets after LOA is issued will incur additional cost.

Yes Populus Law, cheapest I can find, meeting them tomorrow. Hope everything will go smoothly.

 

[blurpandasg2014]

You used the PKWA before? After half hour of discussion, I decided not to engage them and went for a cheaper one

They really so jialat ah. At least from the calls to enquire abt writing a Will, they were professional in their dealings

 

[henrylbh]

They really so jialat ah. At least from the calls to enquire abt writing a Will, they were professional in their dealings

Not lousy but expensive with add on fee for certain tasks. Their advertised price is for very simple cases. If will is thumb printed instead signed, no details of bank accounts, more than 3 banks, etc will incur extra charges that are not cheap. Estimated fee came to more than 2k instead of advertised fee of 1200 net. If I engaged them without questioning, I will end up with extra charges beyond what I willing to pay.