Milo's TA discussion and sharing thread

nauhchop

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Lawyers and accountants have professional code of ethics to abide to.

Once a professional's reputation to tarnished, it will be next to impossible for them to be hired in the same field again.

I don't know about you, but as an accountant, I wouldn't want to take that sort of risks.
That's why you sometimes see the CFO or FM quitting just before trouble starts to brew.

Not every accountant is risk taker and want to risk reputation for little bit of money, but we cannot deny that there are risk takers among the industry.

Professional code of ethics vs conflict of interests.

Even policemen can't escape from conflict of interests. I think i don't need to quote those cases splashed in papers since last year. And of course the recent chc case where ms wee sashays outside the courts. :s13:
 

Milo-Dino

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Not every accountant is risk taker and want to risk reputation for little bit of money, but we cannot deny that there are risk takers among the industry.

Professional code of ethics vs conflict of interests.

Even policemen can't escape from conflict of interests. I think i don't need to quote those cases splashed in papers since last year. And of course the recent chc case where ms wee sashays outside the courts. :s13:
well the hard truth is whether you are willing to trust people.

it's up to the individual whether to believe the reports/accounts or not. It's good to be discerning and maintain a level of skepticism but being overly skeptical, you might as well keep your money in the milo tin :D
 

jgyy1990

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Personally I don't believe mainly in professional ethics. It is ultimately about the money.
 

nauhchop

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well the hard truth is whether you are willing to trust people.

it's up to the individual whether to believe the reports/accounts or not. It's good to be discerning and maintain a level of skepticism but being overly skeptical, you might as well keep your money in the milo tin :D

Well, I have seen many people trusting China companies listed as S-chips in Singapore... and that's for being trusting. :s13:

Trust them at your own perils.:o
 

jgyy1990

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In short follow the trend to earn money. But based on my demo experience I am always too late haiz.
 

wahkao3

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Technical analysis is the study of supply and demand. Period.
Moving averages or MACD or stoch or whatever rainbow squigly lines or green and red polka dots are just tools that the majority use. Don't confuse the two.

I classified MACD and stoch under technical analysis. By the way you put it, I guess that you are saying that TA is an ART, or have art elements in it? (art vs science)

When you put a few of these static tools together and try to make it a system generating signals, you are just marrying static parameters together (I shudder to think of how many input parameters are needed, the more you put in, the less degree of freedom or in otherwords "death by curvefit")
You made a very good point on the weakness of trading system optimization. Indeed curve fitting is the biggest weakness.

I trust this curve fit more than I trust my own manual TA because this curve fit has proven itself over 30 years over 8000 trades and over 50000 random walk combinations during morle carlo simulations. While my manual TA has no basis to be trusted at all!

Perhaps you have been well successful using manual TA over more years, more trades and more combination. If that works for you, you have a good basis to continue with what you are doing. And I humbly seek your teachings.

For me, my manual TA is shiet and have absolutely no credibility. So I have no choice but to disregard my own TA.

And at the same time,I hold bias against people who do TA themselves.
 
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wahkao3

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They are disparate with what price is doing in the "now".

Indeed using an optimize trading system doesnt mean it will be 100% profitable now, or in the future.

Optimized Trading system seek to project the future by assuming that the past will repeat itself.

This is surely not a full proof method.

So the next question is: What is a better and more credible, more accurate method to project into the future? If you can come up with a better method pls let me know I am all ears.
 

wahkao3

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But kudos to you for spending the effort to do some simulation to come to an unfavourable conclusion. You learned something out of this didn't you? Many would just use these tools at face value after reading books or whatever garbage that's out there on the web.

yep, exactly. I hope u guys learn a lot from my own sharing. And I look forward to more critique so that I can improve.
 
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Indeed using an optimize trading system doesnt mean it will be 100% profitable now, or in the future.

Optimized Trading system seek to project the future by assuming that the past will repeat itself.

This is surely not a full proof method.

So the next question is: What is a better and more credible, more accurate method to project into the future? If you can come up with a better method pls let me know I am all ears.

As long as there is an element of skill involved, abilities, it's an art. It's applies to TA.

The abilities between 2 surgeons or 2 carpenters aren't going to be the same.

Price is made up of perceptions of collective individuals each acting on their own personal interest. Humans are involved. Humans are dynamic creatures wouldn't you agree?

Imagine yourself being in a swordfight with another swordsman. You need to anticipate his next move or even a few moves ahead, is he going to cut from the top down, or maybe from the side. Is he going to side step? How would you do it?

By reading him. Looking into his eyes, being aware of his breathing, his steps, his facial expression, his rhythm, the miniscule movements of his elbows and wrist.

Try programming some robot to do that. Impossible, because there is no algorithm. There is no fixed routine. Your opponent changes everytime. A different human being who is dynamic and has his own nuances.

Contrast that with the human being who has been in countless sword fights (and is still alive). For every battle that he survives, he gets better and better. The human brain is a powerful learning tool.

About the part about how history repeats itself. If price is so dynamic (some people may confuse it with being random) then noone can really make money out of it except through some luck. Your wife, girlfriend or mother can be really emotionally "dynamic" at times but there are some things they still tend to do, albeit a bit different each time.

Science. Better tools? Sure there are.

End of the day, the best tool is understanding. Understanding what's really going on. Just by looking at price it tells a story. The language of price. Pure and untainted. Those indicators, they are designed to give you specific information. You input some time period, some deriavatives of price. They give you that. Will they be sufficient to tell you everything that is going on, no. Can you make money with them? Sure, if you know how to use them. Most people just use them to generate trade signals. If this crosses this, is a green dot, buy. If it crosses below, it's a red dot, sell. Don't work? Then more information is needed. Solution: throw in another few indicators, add more filters.


This are just my own opinions. Sorry for the long ramblings, my post seems to be out of place in this thread. I will refrain from that.
 

Sinkie

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As long as there is an element of skill involved, abilities, it's an art. It's applies to TA.

The abilities between 2 surgeons or 2 carpenters aren't going to be the same.

Price is made up of perceptions of collective individuals each acting on their own personal interest. Humans are involved. Humans are dynamic creatures wouldn't you agree?

Imagine yourself being in a swordfight with another swordsman. You need to anticipate his next move or even a few moves ahead, is he going to cut from the top down, or maybe from the side. Is he going to side step? How would you do it?

By reading him. Looking into his eyes, being aware of his breathing, his steps, his facial expression, his rhythm, the miniscule movements of his elbows and wrist.

Try programming some robot to do that. Impossible, because there is no algorithm. There is no fixed routine. Your opponent changes everytime. A different human being who is dynamic and has his own nuances.

Contrast that with the human being who has been in countless sword fights (and is still alive). For every battle that he survives, he gets better and better. The human brain is a powerful learning tool.

About the part about how history repeats itself. If price is so dynamic (some people may confuse it with being random) then noone can really make money out of it except through some luck. Your wife, girlfriend or mother can be really emotionally "dynamic" at times but there are some things they still tend to do, albeit a bit different each time.

Science. Better tools? Sure there are.

End of the day, the best tool is understanding. Understanding what's really going on. Just by looking at price it tells a story. The language of price. Pure and untainted. Those indicators, they are designed to give you specific information. You input some time period, some deriavatives of price. They give you that. Will they be sufficient to tell you everything that is going on, no. Can you make money with them? Sure, if you know how to use them. Most people just use them to generate trade signals. If this crosses this, is a green dot, buy. If it crosses below, it's a red dot, sell. Don't work? Then more information is needed. Solution: throw in another few indicators, add more filters.


This are just my own opinions. Sorry for the long ramblings, my post seems to be out of place in this thread. I will refrain from that.

good post, i cant agree more..

sinkie like this
 

wahkao3

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As long as there is an element of skill involved, abilities, it's an art. It's applies to TA.

The abilities between 2 surgeons or 2 carpenters aren't going to be the same.

Price is made up of perceptions of collective individuals each acting on their own personal interest. Humans are involved. Humans are dynamic creatures wouldn't you agree?

Imagine yourself being in a swordfight with another swordsman. You need to anticipate his next move or even a few moves ahead, is he going to cut from the top down, or maybe from the side. Is he going to side step? How would you do it?

By reading him. Looking into his eyes, being aware of his breathing, his steps, his facial expression, his rhythm, the miniscule movements of his elbows and wrist.

Try programming some robot to do that. Impossible, because there is no algorithm. There is no fixed routine. Your opponent changes everytime. A different human being who is dynamic and has his own nuances.

Contrast that with the human being who has been in countless sword fights (and is still alive). For every battle that he survives, he gets better and better. The human brain is a powerful learning tool.

About the part about how history repeats itself. If price is so dynamic (some people may confuse it with being random) then noone can really make money out of it except through some luck. Your wife, girlfriend or mother can be really emotionally "dynamic" at times but there are some things they still tend to do, albeit a bit different each time.

Science. Better tools? Sure there are.

End of the day, the best tool is understanding. Understanding what's really going on. Just by looking at price it tells a story. The language of price. Pure and untainted. Those indicators, they are designed to give you specific information. You input some time period, some deriavatives of price. They give you that. Will they be sufficient to tell you everything that is going on, no. Can you make money with them? Sure, if you know how to use them. Most people just use them to generate trade signals. If this crosses this, is a green dot, buy. If it crosses below, it's a red dot, sell. Don't work? Then more information is needed. Solution: throw in another few indicators, add more filters.


This are just my own opinions. Sorry for the long ramblings, my post seems to be out of place in this thread. I will refrain from that.


Human VS computer, humans have strengths, computers also have strengths.

my art ish no good.
so no choice, science VS Art, I must rely on science.
OpGoXcG.png
 

Milo-Dino

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Milo can help me TA Starhub? :D
no need TA la.

wahkao kor kor say TA useless one.

just go with your heart/gut

edit: just sitting above 200ma... watch it lor.. but TA useless one la... what's the use of knowing the average price of the last 200 days? most important is the days ahead.... wahkao korkor huat ah
 
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