Official Shiny Things thread—Part III

Status
Not open for further replies.

cassowary18

Senior Member
Joined
Jul 17, 2018
Messages
1,794
Reaction score
190
can i ask why no one share about DBS cash upfront account which provide a lower fees from SCB now?

In what context SCB is still consider a better choice? just wondering if anyone had done the comparison against these 2?

Well, if you want to go even lower, Saxo and FSMOne all provide brokerage at $10 min 0.08%. DBS Cash Upfront is $10 min 0.12% for BUY only (SELL is $25 min 0.28%).

The good thing, however, is that DBS Cash Upfront is a CDP account. So you can transfer your shares to another broker like FSMOne to sell.

I personally use FSMOne for my SGX stocks. SCB is kind of a dated piece of advice already.
 

highsulphur

Greater Supremacy Member
Joined
Aug 16, 2011
Messages
76,207
Reaction score
39,130
Well, if you want to go even lower, Saxo and FSMOne all provide brokerage at $10 min 0.08%. DBS Cash Upfront is $10 min 0.12% for BUY only (SELL is $25 min 0.28%).

The good thing, however, is that DBS Cash Upfront is a CDP account. So you can transfer your shares to another broker like FSMOne to sell.

I personally use FSMOne for my SGX stocks. SCB is kind of a dated piece of advice already.

Don't forget once you hit past 100k for sgx stock, fsmone commission is fixed at 10

Posted from PCWX using VOG-L29
 

isaacsayshi

Member
Joined
Oct 13, 2016
Messages
103
Reaction score
2
Just wondering is it alright not to based any of my investment in SGD?

Allthough I'm now in my early thirties, I have no clue where I might want to retire in future. Seems like a better choice to put all my investment in a strong currency like USD, and many S.E.A countries readily exchange their currency for USD.

Do you think is a good idea to base all my investment in USD?
 

highsulphur

Greater Supremacy Member
Joined
Aug 16, 2011
Messages
76,207
Reaction score
39,130
Just wondering is it alright not to based any of my investment in SGD?

Allthough I'm now in my early thirties, I have no clue where I might want to retire in future. Seems like a better choice to put all my investment in a strong currency like USD, and many S.E.A countries readily exchange their currency for USD.

Do you think is a good idea to base all my investment in USD?
As a hedge, why not both? I intend to split my equities into 50:50 sgd and usd. Obviously with my home it will skewed towards sgd but it's home

Posted from PCWX using VOG-L29
 

S1mpleGuy

Master Member
Joined
Jan 11, 2015
Messages
3,633
Reaction score
11
Well, if you want to go even lower, Saxo and FSMOne all provide brokerage at $10 min 0.08%. DBS Cash Upfront is $10 min 0.12% for BUY only (SELL is $25 min 0.28%).

The good thing, however, is that DBS Cash Upfront is a CDP account. So you can transfer your shares to another broker like FSMOne to sell.

I personally use FSMOne for my SGX stocks. SCB is kind of a dated piece of advice already.
i think FSM also can transfer all sgx stocks to cdp free currently which makes it a better choice than dbs cash upfront?
 

cassowary18

Senior Member
Joined
Jul 17, 2018
Messages
1,794
Reaction score
190
i think FSM also can transfer all sgx stocks to cdp free currently which makes it a better choice than dbs cash upfront?

Currently it's free but not forever. But honestly, there's no big risk with holding shares in a custodian account.
 

Magickiller9

Supremacy Member
Joined
Apr 15, 2010
Messages
6,454
Reaction score
0
i just realize there's an updated ST book. LOL.


Just wanted to clarify, in the book ST mention not needing CI rider. Just curious about the reason.
 

cassowary18

Senior Member
Joined
Jul 17, 2018
Messages
1,794
Reaction score
190
i just realize there's an updated ST book. LOL.


Just wanted to clarify, in the book ST mention not needing CI rider. Just curious about the reason.

This is my understanding:

CI rider overlaps a lot with other insurance policies you should be prioritizing. Suppose you get diagnosed with a CI, here are some expenses you might be worried about:

Medical treatment: covered by emergency funds and hospitalization insurance.
Loss of earning potential from treatment: covered by emergency funds and DII.
Loss of earning potential from death (if you have dependents): covered by term life insurance

So CI coverage is less important.
 

sylves

Senior Member
Joined
Jun 13, 2005
Messages
707
Reaction score
14
DBS cash upfront only OK compared to SCB for *local* stocks (and with DBS the stocks go to CDP account which is good, SCB is custody)

But for *overseas* stocks DBS charges SGD2 per month per counter as far as I know. That's why its not recommended for overseas stocks at all.

Thanks kram62, i agree with you. Henceforth, the advice here is to go with DBS cash upfront for local stocks and IBKR for foreign shares.
 

Magickiller9

Supremacy Member
Joined
Apr 15, 2010
Messages
6,454
Reaction score
0
This is my understanding:

CI rider overlaps a lot with other insurance policies you should be prioritizing. Suppose you get diagnosed with a CI, here are some expenses you might be worried about:

Medical treatment: covered by emergency funds and hospitalization insurance.
Loss of earning potential from treatment: covered by emergency funds and DII.
Loss of earning potential from death (if you have dependents): covered by term life insurance

So CI coverage is less important.

Hmm, essentially only hospitalization is critical right? Do we really need DII ?
 

kram62

Senior Member
Joined
May 14, 2018
Messages
852
Reaction score
36
Thanks kram62, i agree with you. Henceforth, the advice here is to go with DBS cash upfront for local stocks and IBKR for foreign shares.
That's not what I said concerning local shares. I did not say dbs vickers is recommended for local stocks. Just said it's not the worst. But also not the best.
 

13luetooth

Senior Member
Joined
Feb 13, 2007
Messages
1,390
Reaction score
3
Do you guys save a warchest to buy a lump sum when there is a significant dip in the market to lower down your average cost?

I understand that ST don't advocating timing the market, but these dips that happen in 2008, 2011, 2016 and now 2020, could significantly average down ur cost significantly.
 

cassowary18

Senior Member
Joined
Jul 17, 2018
Messages
1,794
Reaction score
190
Hmm, essentially only hospitalization is critical right? Do we really need DII ?
Hospitalization is definitely important, but DII is important too. Let's take a look at a hypothetical scenario. Suppose you get diagnosed with an illness that makes you prone to fainting spells. It's not serious enough to get you hospitalized, but also not critical enough to warrant a CI coverage payout. It's not death or TPD so term life won't pay out either.

But because of that you are unable to work. How will you cover the income loss? Emergency savings can only cover that much. Ultimately you still need the income to support yourself and your dependents. That's where DII will come in.

Do you guys save a warchest to buy a lump sum when there is a significant dip in the market to lower down your average cost?

I understand that ST don't advocating timing the market, but these dips that happen in 2008, 2011, 2016 and now 2020, could significantly average down ur cost significantly.

And that's assuming you can competently time the market. Most people can't. Buying the dips through DCA will be a more effective strategy.
 

kram62

Senior Member
Joined
May 14, 2018
Messages
852
Reaction score
36
Do you guys save a warchest to buy a lump sum when there is a significant dip in the market to lower down your average cost?

I understand that ST don't advocating timing the market, but these dips that happen in 2008, 2011, 2016 and now 2020, could significantly average down ur cost significantly.
If you can lend me the time machine to use these dips, OK then.

Many studies show that trying to keep your money aside to invest in future dips leads to under performance.

Even if you're God and can time perfectly.

https://ofdollarsanddata.com/even-god-couldnt-beat-dollar-cost-averaging/
 

makav31i

Arch-Supremacy Member
Joined
Mar 1, 2008
Messages
12,851
Reaction score
35
Do you guys save a warchest to buy a lump sum when there is a significant dip in the market to lower down your average cost?

I understand that ST don't advocating timing the market, but these dips that happen in 2008, 2011, 2016 and now 2020, could significantly average down ur cost significantly.

I might be a minority here, I DCA each month and still keep a warchest to average down when price drop significantly below my average price for my DCA purchase...Also I set target price to offload a portion of my warchest went a certain price is met...If it never meet the price, just move on lor...
 

makav31i

Arch-Supremacy Member
Joined
Mar 1, 2008
Messages
12,851
Reaction score
35
Thank you to makav31i and cassowary18 for the helpful advice.

I have plans to switch over to ES3 with SCB as i have an account in SCB.
Imagine if you were me. What should you do?
Total cash to invest i have currently is $10k. Should i invest in 1 lump sump in ES3 for every 3 or so and continue to buy in with 1 lump sump? or should i DCA every month, investing $200 - $300 per month?


Any advise helps. Thanks.

For me personally, I would use the $10k and split it over a few nonths to purchase VWRA/VWRD on SCB and DCA the $200 to $300 on ES3 using FSM RSP...
 

makav31i

Arch-Supremacy Member
Joined
Mar 1, 2008
Messages
12,851
Reaction score
35
Thanks kram62, i agree with you. Henceforth, the advice here is to go with DBS cash upfront for local stocks and IBKR for foreign shares.

For SGX,

DBS Cash Upfront is 0.12% or minimum $10

SCB Normal Client is 0.2% or minimum $10

SCB Priority Banking Client is 0.18% with no minimum

FSM is 0.08% or minimum $10

Saxo is 0.08% or minimum $10

I don't know how the advice suddenly become DBS Cash Upfront for SGX especially with FSM waiving the $10.70 transfer fee to CDP which makes it equivalent to DBS Cash Upfront but the lowest fee of 0.08% vs 0.12%...Other than flowerpalms who keep recommending SCB for buying ES3/MBH for both below and above the magical number of $1k, I don't think anyone here recommend buying SGX listed shares using SCB other than you having Priority Banking with SCB...
 

Magickiller9

Supremacy Member
Joined
Apr 15, 2010
Messages
6,454
Reaction score
0

Shiny Things

Supremacy Member
Joined
Dec 13, 2009
Messages
9,580
Reaction score
803
Hi Shiny,
I’m considering investing in LQD etf, especially after the backstop provided by Fed. With 3% pa dividend yield it looks attractive and also the options market provides an opportunity for deploying covered call strategy to improve the returns. What can potentially go wrong for this etf and should be considered before investing ? Currently, invested in ABF which I’m selling on rally.

Nope nope nope nope nope, I’m gonna stop you riiiiiiiiiiight there.

Here’s what can go wrong:
1) Currency risk. LQD is denominated in USD, and because it owns bonds, it effectively gives you exposure to the USDSGD FX rate. If SGD recovers from its current weak levels, you could lose that 3% in a week;
2) You’re too slow. The corporate bond market priced in that Fed backstop already; professional bond and ETF traders are much faster than you;
3) Selling covered calls is going to blow you up in two ways:
3a) If we get a crisis and yields collapse, you’ll get your shares called away and you’ll lose that phat dividend;
3b) If we get a crisis and defaults increase, you’ll be stuck with LQD that you don’t want;
4) On top of everything, I think LQD is considered a US asset for the purposes of estate tax. If you buy LQD and then get hit by a bus the next day—30-40% of your holdings is going to the US taxman.

Do not do this.

Can I ask, what is the basis of this statement? And whether it is right to assume that what works in US will work also well in Singapore?
Yep. The default assumption should be that relationships like that one (“corporate bonds deliver better returns than govvies even after defaults”) hold unless there’s some reason for them not to hold. It’d be a bit nihilistic to say “oh, this relationship holds in US markets, but I’m going to assume it doesn’t work in Singapore”; it’s safe to say “OK, this relationship holds in US markets, it probably works in Singapore unless there’s some structural reason why it doesn’t”.

(A good example of one that doesn’t hold is “bond yields go up as maturities increase”, which doesn’t always work in the UK: there’s so much demand for long-dated GBP bonds from UK pension funds that some extremely-long-dated GBP bonds trade at a lower yield than shorter-dated bonds.)

Sounds like hindsight bias to me, just stating my views. The reason why I dlslike Singapore market (yes STI, the bond etfs) so much is that the underlying securities these indexes are based on is so freaking small, its not decent diversification. And it is going to get worse, as our fewer companies choose to list here.

MBH doesn’t just include “bonds issued by Singaporean companies”, it includes “bonds issued in SGD by any corporate issuer”. So you get the big three banks, LTA, and HDB, because they’re big SGD issuers; but you also get other companies with active cross-currency issuance programs: ANZ Bank, my old shop Commerzbank, Exim Bank of Korea, China Huarong, LBBW, Manulife, Westpac...

And companies are going to keep issuing in SGD as long as there are giant Singaporean mutual fund companies lining up to buy bonds.

Just wondering is it alright not to based any of my investment in SGD?

Allthough I'm now in my early thirties, I have no clue where I might want to retire in future. Seems like a better choice to put all my investment in a strong currency like USD, and many S.E.A countries readily exchange their currency for USD.

Do you think is a good idea to base all my investment in USD?

I wouldn’t recommend this for most people, but if you’re genuinely contemplating pulling the ripcord from the little red dot, then yes—in that circumstance, and only in that circumstance, it’d make sense to have just global stocks + global bonds, and no allocation to Singapore stocks/bonds.

Do you guys save a warchest to buy a lump sum when there is a significant dip in the market to lower down your average cost?

I understand that ST don't advocating timing the market, but these dips that happen in 2008, 2011, 2016 and now 2020, could significantly average down ur cost significantly.

There are two tricky things to this. Let’s assume that you do this, you need to be able to answer two questions:

1) What counts as a “dip”? A 5% drawdown? 10%? 20%? Set it too big and you’ll never get invested.

2) When the dip comes, will you really be able to buy? You’ve seen people in this forum over the last two months running around asking “should I sell everything? Is the sky falling in? The sky is falling in, why aren’t I allowed to sell? I want to sell, I want the bleeding to stop!”. That’s the natural reflex, and keeping a war chest assumes that you’ll be able to go against the natural instinct to run for cover in a crash.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Important Forum Advisory Note
This forum is moderated by volunteer moderators who will react only to members' feedback on posts. Moderators are not employees or representatives of HWZ. Forum members and moderators are responsible for their own posts.

Please refer to our Community Guidelines and Standards, Terms of Service and Member T&Cs for more information.
Top