Official Shiny Things thread—Part III

[swan02]

as flower palms said, time in market is more important. However, it is also good to know that.....

1. There are many counters in iwda which have very low multiples ie cheap
Such as financials.

2. What’s currently pushing up the market is tech and reits given low interest rates. Is it expensive ?

Well this is the beginning of frothiness, not yet reached sky high tech prices in 2000. At least the current high price is justified but I assume will stall once people get back to normal which likely to a small extent won’t.

3. Assume no crash ensued from tech or black swans, we then still hope or expect a rotation to cyclical stocks such as financials to push the market further up.

Sounds like a good question to add to the thread's FAQs!

 

[swan02]

If I’m not mistaken,

BBC and Shiny rank critical illness and if there is. a derivative cancer insurance lowly.

However in my opinion, an early stage cancer insurance may be justified if u r adamant in getting it.

Still, it’s not a must have as u r likely to survive will not affect your ability to work.

How about cancer insurance. is it neccessary?

 

[Shiny Things]

ref .6994 atmf .6460/.5900 1x1 put spread, 1.25/2.25 vol spread, 11.75 vol mid on the near strike

Nice neutral price, bit wide though

That's wide for vn spread. I'm 1.4/2.0. He's prob seller

Ooh, that seems like a pretty aggressive read, and I was the one guy on the street who liked owning AUD wings. MINE at 2 vol, Net settlement in beers next time I’m in town?

 

[BBCWatcher]

How about cancer insurance. is it neccessary?

Cancer-specific insurance? Certainly not. In fact, cancer-related treatment is one of the very few types of medical services that is covered in Integrated Shield plans even on an outpatient basis, without requiring any hospitalization to trigger a coverage window. Cancer is something of an anti-pattern now in Singapore's insurance market given how modern Integrated Shield plans work.

The broader point, though, is that it doesn't matter whether you have cancer or non-cancer. What matters is the impact of whatever you have. Does it matter if you become mentally ill because of a cancerous tumor in your head or because of some other cause, such as a chemical imbalance due to genetic predisposition? It doesn't matter at all! Not in the real world. You should be automatically suspicious and skeptical of insurance products (or "insurance") that consist of "named perils."

So, if I become mentally ill (no matter why), what do I genuinely need? Well, if I'm unable to hold down a job and earn a living -- if that's the actual impact, no matter what the causes -- I'll need some income to stay afloat. OK, that's Disability Income Insurance (DII) that solves that problem. If I die from this mental illness (such as dementia), and if I have at least one dependent, then I want to make sure that dependent's basic, decent, dignified lifestyle is defended adequately. Term life insurance neatly solves that class of problems. If I need long-term care (again, no matter why) because I need somebody to help me bathe, move around, etc. -- and if I need some help paying for somebody's help -- then CareShield Life (perhaps supplemented) is a fairly good answer to that class of problems. And so on.

 

[chrisloh65]

https://www.marketwatch.com/story/its-time-for-investors-to-stop-buying-stocks-that-are-stunningly-decoupled-from-reality-economist-warns-2020-07-14

It’s time for investors to stop buying stocks that are ‘stunningly decoupled’ from reality, economist warns
Published: July 14, 2020 at 12:19 p.m. ET

Timely warning, and this include index ETFs owning mostly US stocks!

 

[888888888888]

Some may have a mark to model process implemented that derives prices off a mid market, find a fair value & mark the derivative up, then recognize the diff between fair value and the selling price as profit.

OTC markets are attractive in that they offer tailor-made option contracts, the highly flexible nature of these contracts allows banks to offer option contracts in numerous currencies with any strike price or maturity to their customers.
Mkt participants are able to hedge a specific amount of foreign exchange risk over any horizon or any strike price.

There is a lack of price transparency – it can be difficult for the customer to know if the premium charged by the bank equals a fair market value.
Subsequent dynamic hedging may be required for complex securities, and slippages incurred once it attains a large size.

 

[Torenoo]

That’s why the big three Death, TPD and DII have to be grounded firmly FIRST. Having DII alone would largely negate the need of personal accident insurance with any form of hospitalization benefits as well as the need of CI. Correct me if I’m wrong anyone.

.

can anymore shed more light on this?

If i have term, DII and hospital plan

PA may not really be tat necessary ?

Thanks in advance!

 

[flowerpalms]

can anymore shed more light on this?

If i have term, DII and hospital plan

PA may not really be tat necessary ?

Thanks in advance!

DII yes

Hospital plan standard 1 will do.

Term if you have dependants

Posted from PCWX using SM-G973F

 

[viventa]

Ooh, that seems like a pretty aggressive read, and I was the one guy on the street who liked owning AUD wings. MINE at 2 vol, Net settlement in beers next time I’m in town?

Just curious... assuming there were no travel restrictions or other COVID-19 issues, how often would you normally visit?

 

[mozzozo]

Hi shiny, BBC and all. Would like to find out your opinion on roboadvisors? Especially stashaway, I've been reading up and am liking their interface etc. As a layman investor, I believe they will definitely do better than me in the long term both in growth as well as managing gains. So would like to find out your thoughts

 

[cassowary18]

Hi shiny, BBC and all. Would like to find out your opinion on roboadvisors? Especially stashaway, I've been reading up and am liking their interface etc. As a layman investor, I believe they will definitely do better than me in the long term both in growth as well as managing gains. So would like to find out your thoughts

My personal take: for roboadvisors, you're basically paying 75-80 bps for the convenience of auto rebalancing. You could just as well take their recommendations and DIY your own portfolio.

AFAIK only DBS digiportfolio offers Irish domiciled ETFs. The other big roboadvisors invest in US domiciled ETFs.

 

[Shiny Things]

Hi shiny, BBC and all. Would like to find out your opinion on roboadvisors? Especially stashaway, I've been reading up and am liking their interface etc. As a layman investor, I believe they will definitely do better than me in the long term both in growth as well as managing gains. So would like to find out your thoughts

Generally I think roboadvisors are a good thing, but I don't think there are any in the Singaporean market that I'd recommend. Either their fees are too high; their lineup of funds they invest in doesn't make sense; or both.

My offer still stands to any bank or fintech that wants to build one—if you're building a Singapore roboadvisor, call me! I'll help you build it right!

 

[Torenoo]

DII yes

Hospital plan standard 1 will do.

Term if you have dependants

Posted from PCWX using SM-G973F

aviva mindef group DII ok ?
seems pretty cheap to insurance up to 10k monthly income (50% of income *12 up to max of 120k) for 6 bucks for 36-40 yo , am i missing anything here?

Thanks

 

[flowerpalms]

aviva mindef group DII ok ?
seems pretty cheap to insurance up to 10k monthly income (50% of income *12 up to max of 120k) for 6 bucks for 36-40 yo , am i missing anything here?

Thanks

I use great eastern

Posted from PCWX using SM-G973F

 

[swan02]

Firstly it’s cheap because it’s a group insurance. I don’t even know any single insurance can beat them in cost.

secondly did u notice it’s 50 percent of income which is unusual hence cheap. If u earn only 5k a month, but is a high spender or have too many loans, u can tell that a disability insurance may not fit everyone as upon disability, u just don’t have enough dough to continue paying your bills.

Also go and enquire what their waiting period is. The longer the waiting period, it becomes cheaper considerably. I would take 90 days but u have to adjust your emergency fund accordingly ie increase it to cover the 90 days no income.

U also need to enquire whether the income is inflation hedged and whether cpf paid etc etc as all affects the cost.

Lastly,...that’s why agents do not like to sell disability income insurance... they earn less...as it basically redundant the need for personal accident and critical illness.

remember DII if cover is too low, and insufficient to cover your expenses, u thus need to beef up your term TPD insurance to ensure your debt is cleared at present value.

I’ve seen people meeting definition of TPD yet can live for more than 30 years because of excellent carers. Thus the trigger of both TPD and DII must together cover both debt repayments and Daily expenses with inflation factored into.

so spend some time thinking of all sorts of scenarios to see whether any loop hole can be found. Loop holes can usually be found in the definition of trigger of the DII and payout definition ... u must read it carefully as insurers will find ways not to.

I’m not an expert in singapore DII products but I found no loop holes holding to term TPD n death, and DII and obviously medical insurance in Australia.

aviva mindef group DII ok ?
seems pretty cheap to insurance up to 10k monthly income (50% of income *12 up to max of 120k) for 6 bucks for 36-40 yo , am i missing anything here?

Thanks

 

[Torenoo]

Firstly it’s cheap because it’s a group insurance. I don’t even know any single insurance can beat them in cost.

secondly did u notice it’s 50 percent of income which is unusual hence cheap. If u earn only 5k a month, but is a high spender or have too many loans, u can tell that a disability insurance may not fit everyone as upon disability, u just don’t have enough dough to continue paying your bills.

Also go and enquire what their waiting period is. The longer the waiting period, it becomes cheaper considerably. I would take 90 days but u have to adjust your emergency fund accordingly ie increase it to cover the 90 days no income.

U also need to enquire whether the income is inflation hedged and whether cpf paid etc etc as all affects the cost.

Lastly,...that’s why agents do not like to sell disability income insurance... they earn less...as it basically redundant the need for personal accident and critical illness.

remember DII if cover is too low, and insufficient to cover your expenses, u thus need to beef up your term TPD insurance to ensure your debt is cleared at present value.

I’ve seen people meeting definition of TPD yet can live for more than 30 years because of excellent carers. Thus the trigger of both TPD and DII must together cover both debt repayments and Daily expenses with inflation factored into.

so spend some time thinking of all sorts of scenarios to see whether any loop hole can be found. Loop holes can usually be found in the definition of trigger of the DII and payout definition ... u must read it carefully as insurers will find ways not to.

I’m not an expert in singapore DII products but I found no loop holes holding to term TPD n death, and DII and obviously medical insurance in Australia.

Thanks Swan02 for writing at lengths on this

1. Yeah i noticed its at 50% compared to 75% for other cos, at $6/m for my age group its quite cheap hence i can accept that.

2. What does the waiting period means and how does it work in DII?

3. Thanks for highlighting on the trigger and payout definitions, shall go read up on that.

Thanks again, much appreciated.

 

[swan02]

Thanks Swan02 for writing at lengths on this

1. Yeah i noticed its at 50% compared to 75% for other cos, at $6/m for my age group its quite cheap hence i can accept that.

2. What does the waiting period means and how does it work in DII?

3. Thanks for highlighting on the trigger and payout definitions, shall go read up on that.

Thanks again, much appreciated.

The point I’m making regarding about that 50 percent is that though it’s dirt cheap, you might actually have to top up your TPD coverage instead, or even personal accident .Which is costing you.

Also DII premiums are also based on your coverage. It might be cheap cuz u r not a high income earner ? It looks like this group DII is pretty good for high income earners.

.... do u mind telling us your gross income per month ?

You do really need to look at TPD and DII together ... also ensure there is no clause in your DII preventing you to have DII triggered when TPD is triggered simultaneously.

In a scenario , where you are only getting TPD and not both, this can greatly impact in a scenario where eg u are fully paralyzed but can live for yonky years as your wife loves and cares for u and not kick u when u r throwing a fit. U need to dangle enough carrot for the family to love u ie MONEY!!!

So DII group maybe very cheap, make sure It can trigger simultaneously with TPD. if it doesn’t, you need to increase your TPD coverage a lot more such as not only your debt but the years ensuring survival till 90.

Waiting period means upon being afflicted by a disability, the DII does not trigger until your waiting period is up. Many disability resolves within 30 days, that’s why it gets considerably cheaper for a 90 days waiting as u can’t claim anything if you have a disability that resolves let say 50 days.

 

[BBCWatcher]

You do really need to look at TPD and DII together ...

Not really, not much. You seem to be implying you add them together. I don't think that makes much sense. You certainly cannot assume that DII and TPD will both pay out. Just figure out how much DII coverage you need. The TPD part is pretty easy (and separate) since it's bundled with life insurance, and it's pretty easy to figure out how much life insurance you need as a separate matter.

 

[Torenoo]

The point I’m making regarding about that 50 percent is that though it’s dirt cheap, you might actually have to top up your TPD coverage instead, or even personal accident .Which is costing you.

Also DII premiums are also based on your coverage. It might be cheap cuz u r not a high income earner ? It looks like this group DII is pretty good for high income earners.

.... do u mind telling us your gross income per month ?

You do really need to look at TPD and DII together ... also ensure there is no clause in your DII preventing you to have DII triggered when TPD is triggered simultaneously.

In a scenario , where you are only getting TPD and not both, this can greatly impact in a scenario where eg u are fully paralyzed but can live for yonky years as your wife loves and cares for u and not kick u when u r throwing a fit. U need to dangle enough carrot for the family to love u ie MONEY!!!

So DII group maybe very cheap, make sure It can trigger simultaneously with TPD. if it doesn’t, you need to increase your TPD coverage a lot more such as not only your debt but the years ensuring survival till 90.

Waiting period means upon being afflicted by a disability, the DII does not trigger until your waiting period is up. Many disability resolves within 30 days, that’s why it gets considerably cheaper for a 90 days waiting as u can’t claim anything if you have a disability that resolves let say 50 days.

1. I had a 400k of term with company X until recently a friend told me i can get 1M with aviva for less than half what of im paying to X currently. So that is what i will be doing as next step.

2. While doing my research, i came across this DII, from the product summary sheet and for my age group, my interpretation is that it seems to say my monthly premium is 6 bucks a month for a 10k block of sum insured.

However the definition of sum insured gets a lil confusing for me. (50% of monthly sal *12 but up to a max cap of 120k) So i dont understand my insured sum is on a monthly sal basis? or annual basis and with the 120k cap

https://www.aviva.com.sg/en/mindef-and-mha/disability-income/

I'm drawing 11k/m. Since its on a 10k block basis for sum insured. My guess for sum insured is its either $6 premium per mth *1.1 assuming they look at monthly sal basis (the 1.1 can be adjusted to match ur monthly)

Sum insured on annual basis and subjected the cap (0.5*11*12 =66k) which gives a sum to be insured of 66k , hence (6.6 * $6 premium per 10k) / mth
Should be either of these 2 amts, waiting for the cso to give me a call back to clarify.

3. Will take note on that impt qn to ask if both Term and DII could be triggered simultaneously under permissible scenarios , or if they would cancel overlapping amts due a certain clause which they might have specifically insert to target this.

4. Appreciate your pragmatic tips !

5. waiting period - i think i should be fine with middle ground, more importantly to insure against the risk of being permanently unable to work and not have any income. savings will eventually run out if you live long enough.


Apart from the 400k term, i only have the additional private rider for hospitalization from AIA (not sure wats the term for it, the one that increase madly in the last 3 years, i downgraded it 1 notch)

While looking thru the suite of group products from aviva/mindef, i was tempted to get maxed out across the whole suite under the group insurance as is its quite attractive in terms of coverage/dollar compare vis a vis with other insurance co (non group/ private). I just need to pay like extra 300 more p.a and get way hell more coverage.

But after some reading and on second thought, might skip the CI and ECI
But not sure if i should get the PA and its only 6/mth for 600k, altho my company covers generic PA, and just in case i switch jobs/out of job in the future/self employed etc.

Above offers only eligible if you served NS and below 40, so there is a limited window as well.

Sorry for the long post.

 

[swan02]

1. I'm not an expert and it tires me due to lack of passion and poor grasp of english to fully comprehend and complete the long product description. BBC watcher will soon critique Aviva's product. a/w him soon.

but
2. from what i've read before I slept. It is certainly $39.60 monthly premium.

3. Looks like in Singapore, its called deferred period. Did you notice that horrible 6 months deferred period !!!....now you know why its so cheap.

4. 1 mil term is a good start considering your higher than avg monthly income and assume higher expenditure, but definitely you need to spend time thinking really, how much you really need.

5. I suspect your AIA could be the rider that you need not pay excess ?

Anyways, wait for BBC watcher to critique the product as her (I assume a She from the way she writes) written and scrutiny befits a lawyer.

1. I had a 400k of term with company X until recently a friend told me i can get 1M with aviva for less than half what of im paying to X currently. So that is what i will be doing as next step.

2. While doing my research, i came across this DII, from the product summary sheet and for my age group, my interpretation is that it seems to say my monthly premium is 6 bucks a month for a 10k block of sum insured.

However the definition of sum insured gets a lil confusing for me. (50% of monthly sal *12 but up to a max cap of 120k) So i dont understand my insured sum is on a monthly sal basis? or annual basis and with the 120k cap

https://www.aviva.com.sg/en/mindef-and-mha/disability-income/

I'm drawing 11k/m. Since its on a 10k block basis for sum insured. My guess for sum insured is its either $6 premium per mth *1.1 assuming they look at monthly sal basis (the 1.1 can be adjusted to match ur monthly)

Sum insured on annual basis and subjected the cap (0.5*11*12 =66k) which gives a sum to be insured of 66k , hence (6.6 * $6 premium per 10k) / mth
Should be either of these 2 amts, waiting for the cso to give me a call back to clarify.

3. Will take note on that impt qn to ask if both Term and DII could be triggered simultaneously under permissible scenarios , or if they would cancel overlapping amts due a certain clause which they might have specifically insert to target this.

4. Appreciate your pragmatic tips !

5. waiting period - i think i should be fine with middle ground, more importantly to insure against the risk of being permanently unable to work and not have any income. savings will eventually run out if you live long enough.


Apart from the 400k term, i only have the additional private rider for hospitalization from AIA (not sure wats the term for it, the one that increase madly in the last 3 years, i downgraded it 1 notch)

While looking thru the suite of group products from aviva/mindef, i was tempted to get maxed out across the whole suite under the group insurance as is its quite attractive in terms of coverage/dollar compare vis a vis with other insurance co (non group/ private). I just need to pay like extra 300 more p.a and get way hell more coverage.

But after some reading and on second thought, might skip the CI and ECI
But not sure if i should get the PA and its only 6/mth for 600k, altho my company covers generic PA, and just in case i switch jobs/out of job in the future/self employed etc.

Above offers only eligible if you served NS and below 40, so there is a limited window as well.

Sorry for the long post.