Retiring before 40?

Mecisteus

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minamikaze

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Yeah. I guess ideally it would be freedom to do whatever you wish - and maybe even settle for short periods in various countries, picking up different languages as you go along.
So it looks like the ideal number is somewhere around 2M-3M in assets, excluding primary residence.
 

ocs_woodlands

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You are looking solely from a financial point of view.

Some people view it differently.

Some would prefer to take advantage of their youth to do something that they can enjoy which they probably cannot achieve while working fulltime.

If they are happy with such arrangement, I don't think it is a waste to retire early.

I guess people should put more effort into finding satisfaction in their work, NOT so that they can get happiness BUT so that they can last in their work and reap the benefits of peak salaries in their 50s...
 

crimsontactics

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existential_reality

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I'm giving this a shot right now, but I took a sabbatical as a start. Would say a safe return would be somewhere between 2.5 - 3% for investment newbs who do not want to risk their principal.


Does anyone know of someone who retired before 40?
By retiring, I mean that they do not work full-time jobs anymore, instead just relying on their investments and savings (they might still do ad-hoc stuff just for fun). I'd like to hear about their experience retiring early, and how they managed to pull it off.

Assuming a fairly generous (in my opinion) monthly expenditure of say, $6000 (for a couple with no kids), how much in assets, investments and savings would be required to be able to retire?

The following would need to be taken care of, I suppose:
- Insurance needs (how much?)
- Food ($1000)
- Transport ($200)
- Utilities ($200)
- "Fun": Travel, movies, etc
- Income tax and property tax, if relying on property for passive income

And if a kid does come into the picture, as a rough gauge how much more would need to be added to that monthly $6000 allowance?
 

existential_reality

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revhappy

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If you really know what you want to do in life then it is great. Very few people know it. If you don't know what to do in life and just toiling away at work, trying to accumulate as much as you can, then how will retiring early help? You will only get bored. Might as well try to change your line of work if possible to something more enjoyable and lower paying. If not gun for the max salary keep making more and more money and produce kids, who know what they want to do in life, so they can then enjoy your savings :)

Sent from Xiaomi REDMI NOTE 4 using GAGT
 

havetheveryfun

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I guess people should put more effort into finding satisfaction in their work, NOT so that they can get happiness BUT so that they can last in their work and reap the benefits of peak salaries in their 50s...

if you earn so much in your 50s but don't have the energy to spend and or no chance to spend, then what is the point either? So many news nowadays of people dying at a young age of 18, 20+, 30+.

furthermore, not everyone has the ability to earn that much even in their peak. Age discrimination starts after 40 and chances of retrenchment are more likely than one climbing further up the corporate ladder. Personally I don't think most people hit their peak at 50yrs, maybe in the past yes, but nowadays most ppl hit their peak around 35-45 yrs and then after that you start worrying about retrenchment and all.
 

minamikaze

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I'm giving this a shot right now, but I took a sabbatical as a start. Would say a safe return would be somewhere between 2.5 - 3% for investment newbs who do not want to risk their principal.

That's awesome. If you don't mind sharing, how old are you now and how did you achieve this?
 

BBCWatcher

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if you earn so much in your 50s but don't have the energy to spend and or no chance to spend, then what is the point either?
I've never met anybody who is challenged in the way you describe. It's at least very rare. Spending money is not a problem. Usually you spend more money when you're pressed for time, not less. As examples, busy people tend to spend more on restaurants, childcare, domestic services, private jet travel, and taxis.

If you want to argue that working people (whether paid or volunteer) have less non-working time, that's tautologically true. There are two ways to solve that problem, if it's a problem, if it's financially possible to solve. One way is to work less, and thus free up more non-working time. Hiring somebody else (a nanny, a chef, a personal assistant, etc.) is one way to work less. The other option is to make work more like non-work, i.e. to find something you enjoy doing more.

So many news nowadays of people dying at a young age of 18, 20+, 30+.
There's so much "news" because that event is less common now than it was at any point in Singapore's entire history! People are living longer and healthier lives today. Life expectancies keep hitting new records in Singapore. Singaporeans are dying much less often from heat exhaustion, infectious diseases, childbirth.... the list goes on and on. What world are you describing here? It isn't today's Singapore.

Yes, I know, newspapers (and their online cousins) like to sell advertising and love such stories, but today's mortality statistics are better than they've ever been. Which is not an argument to skip essential insurance needs. Such risks are lower but not zero.

furthermore, not everyone has the ability to earn that much even in their peak.
No, but the amount of manual labor that Singaporeans do keeps decreasing. The trends are more in favor of (on average) older and more experienced, highly skilled workers now compared to the past, when labor was much more physically demanding on average, putting a premium on young adults in their prime physical years.

I think you're really trying to make ex post facto arguments explaining why many Singaporeans prefer early retirement, but they're not based on real factors. Frankly there's only one major driver here: Singaporeans continue to get wealthier on average, and some of them are choosing to drop out of the labor market simply because they can afford to do so and prefer it. If you can afford to drop out of the labor market partially or fully, and if that would make you happier, great, go for it. No further explanation or justification required.
 
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Perisher

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I agree, 30s worker are more favoured these days. They got the best of both, experience that 20s don't have and generally lower salary than those 40s.

Also, it's not just about being at the prime physically, it's also about being mentally sharp and doing things fast.
There is a stigma with regards to age, generally people has the view that older people are slower, no matter true or not.
 

havetheveryfun

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I've never met anybody who is challenged in the way you describe. It's at least very rare. Spending money is not a problem. Usually you spend more money when you're pressed for time, not less. As examples, busy people tend to spend more on restaurants, childcare, domestic services, private jet travel, and taxis.

It's not about busy, but that anything unexpected can happen in life. Chances of contracting chronic illnesses are much higher in your old age. I think not meeting anybody I have described is too much exaggeration.

By no chance to spend, I mean not just sudden death, but if one day you get illnesses like cancer, diabetes, kidney failure, stroke out of a sudden.. they are more common than you think. Sure they aren't really life threatening but it makes your overseas travelling much more complicated (e.g. people who need to go on dialysis can't go on long trips or need to arrange to go to the overseas dialysis centers mid-trip). Also you would have to watch your diet and can't splurge on good food that you enjoy, and so on. even just a simple high cholesterol problem can cause you to not be able to spend on the good food that you enjoy and so on.

But I do agree with you that there's no need to justify what you want to do if you really want to do it, it's your own life after all. Just pointing out that ocs_woodland's argument has its own flaw, because by the same logic, we could also ask why do so many ladies want to become housewife at such an early age of 35-40years old? Presuming the ladies only earn 30k-50k a year, which is not a lot (just 2.5k per month), they would have sacrificed close to half a million or more in dollars just to accompany their kids growing up
 

TabascoSauce

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I think it's not a matter of whether one can retire at 40 or not.

It's a matter of whether one should retire at 40.

For many of us, we hit our max pay @ 50 or so.

MoSt degree holders should hit at least 150k @ 50 or so. So 150k x 10 years (retire at 60) is 1.5m leh...

Between 40-50, @ average pay of 120k for 10 years is 1.2m leh...

So a person retire at 40 earns 2.7m leh...

Why would anyone want to throw away 2.7m???:s13:

Ppl who can onli hit 150k in their 50s are obviously not the one retiring before 40. Those who can afford to retire early are obviously earning much more than that at an earlier age.

And for high income earners, the value of an additional dollar is different. In economics, this is called diminishing marginal return. A few million of lost income may sound like a lot, but for those who alr have more than they need, the numbers are meaningless.
 

BBCWatcher

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By no chance to spend, I mean not just sudden death, but if one day you get illnesses like cancer, diabetes, kidney failure, stroke out of a sudden.. they are more common than you think.
No, I'm quite aware of how common they are. I repeatedly argue in favor of disability income insurance, in particular. CareShield Life will be a step forward, although it's not quite as much of a step forward as I'd like.

However, it's also true, simultaneously, that these and other ailments are less common at the same ages, today, than they were even 10 years ago. Singaporeans are statistically leading and living longer and healthier lives. That's just a basic fact, well documented. Singaporeans now have the world's second highest healthy lifespans, as it happens. So, while they still may be possible motivations for early retirement, they are statistically less common motivations than in the past.

No, it's really very simple: Singaporeans who want to retire early are doing it (if they're doing it) mostly because they can afford it more often than in the past. They're not doing it because they're sicker, or living shorter lives, or because work is tougher, or because 30-somethings are taking all their jobs. ALL of those problems are statistically less common now than they were in the past. It really isn't any more complicated than that. As wealth increases, some wealthy people choose to consume their wealth in the form of more leisure.

....But you still have to be rather wealthy to retire at 40. Within the top ~2% of wealthiest 40 year olds, probably. The financial math rapidly improves if you retire later rather than sooner, because you're closing any gap from both sides. If you're working and saving (which you should be in peak earning years), wealth is increasing, and retirement financial needs are decreasing. And, if the financial math is better, that can mean a more fabulous retirement with fewer financial worries when you eventually retire. On top of that, if you enjoy what you're doing professionally, that's even more fabulous.
 

BBCWatcher

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Those who can afford to retire early are obviously earning much more than that at an earlier age.
Yes, I agree, great point. I estimate only the top ~2% wealthiest 40 year olds can safely afford to retire at age 40, based on Singapore's current wealth statistics.
 

SKenny

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I retired in my mid 40's.

The most common question I get is "won't you be bored?" Well, now I get to do whatever I want, whenever I want.
 

Perisher

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I retired in my mid 40's.

The most common question I get is "won't you be bored?" Well, now I get to do whatever I want, whenever I want.

They are just wondering where you get the $$ to do whatever you want.
 
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