SIMBA Telecom discussion thread

[firesong]

Not popular opinion, but a race to the bottom benefits nobody.

Yes consumers are happy with lower prices. As a consumer, I want the best value I can get.

However, the flip side is that the telco model is a "high upfront capex, cost-recovery" model. They spend the money to deploy hardware for upgrades, along with the day-to-day BAU maintenance, services and replacements, which are also costly. The challenge is that the telco must also build enough cash reserves to be able to upgrade as needed to keep up.

Where most of us have issues with is that the high telco monthly subscription costs also very visibly contribute to shareholders and management pockets in large payouts. Staff also want higher salaries and are themselves unhappy when they see their big bosses take home lots of money in bonus payouts - for many of them their big boss's bonuses exceed what they would earn in a year including their own bonuses.

The key is to have a bottom that pleases every user and is capped at a balance where there are no obscene payouts to investors and management. But this will lead to possible exits since very few want to be in an unprofitable industry. In pro-business Singapore where Yusof Ishak still calls the shots, this remains a tough, probably impossible, balance.

 

[neptunesea]

What it does is forcing the others down to its playing field. Last time $10 plan only has 4G. Now everyone is rushing to offer 5G+ at $10.
Let’s see if it is able to even lower the playing field further.

Last time there was 1 for 1 top ups, entry level 5G plan's nett price was ~$6.

Now since most sane people's wallets are depleted, they have adjusted the nett price of entry level 5G plans to ~$10.

 

[jeff79]

Not popular opinion, but a race to the bottom benefits nobody.

Yes consumers are happy with lower prices. As a consumer, I want the best value I can get.

However, the flip side is that the telco model is a "high upfront capex, cost-recovery" model. They spend the money to deploy hardware for upgrades, along with the day-to-day BAU maintenance, services and replacements, which are also costly. The challenge is that the telco must also build enough cash reserves to be able to upgrade as needed to keep up.

Where most of us have issues with is that the high telco monthly subscription costs also very visibly contribute to shareholders and management pockets in large payouts. Staff also want higher salaries and are themselves unhappy when they see their big bosses take home lots of money in bonus payouts - for many of them their big boss's bonuses exceed what they would earn in a year including their own bonuses.

The key is to have a bottom that pleases every user and is capped at a balance where there are no obscene payouts to investors and management. But this will lead to possible exits since very few want to be in an unprofitable industry. In pro-business Singapore where Yusof Ishak still calls the shots, this remains a tough, probably impossible, balance.

The problem is does telco reduce price when it had recovered capex cost in few years. Major capex is only when there is technology upgrade like from 3g to 4g, 4g to 5g and buy new spectrum. How often was technology upgrade. About every ten years?

Worldwide issue. Mid 2010s few years after 4g rollout, many countries 4G plans price cut by half. I heard of this first from taiwan during 2016. Industry analysts then said the telco had recovered 4g capex for couple of years already so could start price war.

Singapore telco price war only started in 2018? When imda awarded 4th telco license to simba. Then many mvno launched with cheaper plans. circle life launched jn 2016 with ＄28 base plan 3gb data.

Multiple by millions of subscribers how much excess profit per year.

https://www.businesstimes.com.sg/startups-tech/technology/circleslife-starts-offering-mobile-plans

 

[firesong]

The problem is does telco reduce price when it had recovered capex cost in few years. Major capex is only when there is technology upgrade like from 3g to 4g, 4g to 5g and buy new spectrum. How often was technology upgrade. About every ten years?

Worldwide issue. Mid 2010s few years after 4g rollout, many countries 4G plans price cut by half. I heard of this first from taiwan during 2016. Industry analysts then said the telco had recovered 4g capex for couple of years already so could start price war.

Singapore telco price war only started in 2018? When imda awarded 4th telco license to simba. Then many mvno launched with cheaper plans. circle life launched jn 2016 with ＄28 base plan 3gb data.

Multiple by millions of subscribers how much excess profit per year.

https://www.businesstimes.com.sg/startups-tech/technology/circleslife-starts-offering-mobile-plans

It looks like you assume expenses are one-off and no bills in between. Equipment deployment for upgrades are the "one-off" capital expenditures, but there's a lot more.

Replacement of spoilt hardware also counts towards maintenance cost. As do salaries, electricity, licensing, etc.

And btw, I already pointed out the imbalances with excesses, as you already quoted.

The key point is balance, not excess.

 

[twosix]

Last time there was 1 for 1 top ups, entry level 5G plan's nett price was ~$6.

Now since most sane people's wallets are depleted, they have adjusted the nett price of entry level 5G plans to ~$10.

Senior plan still $5 though. My father never complained to me the line is no good.

I also dun seem to have any issues with the $10 plan. It also has 6 months roll over for roaming data.

My only concern is there are no information on them doing system migration and some users reportedly lost their phone lines in the process.

 

[xiaofan]

What it does is forcing the others down to its playing field. Last time $10 plan only has 4G. Now everyone is rushing to offer 5G+ at $10.
Let’s see if it is able to even lower the playing field further.

Last time there was 1 for 1 top ups, entry level 5G plan's nett price was ~$6.

Now since most sane people's wallets are depleted, they have adjusted the nett price of entry level 5G plans to ~$10.

Not counting senior plans, and not counting the one for one top-up offer from SIMBA and eight, and 50% OFF offer from Zym/Zero1/VIVIFI/CMLink and some special offers (CL S$6 and S$8 5G plans), the current trend for normal 5G plan is S$10 to S$11 5G plans.

Unlikely we will see one for one top-up offers from eight any time soon now that they are pushing for annual plan and free port-in benefits. For example eight 5G+ Power annual plan is at S$96 and got two months free for non-Starhub network port-in, average monthly price is at S$6.96 per month (note: eight annual plan can not be paid with wallet balance).

Singtel MVNOs Zym/Zero1/VIVIFI/CMLink are still pretty aggressive with 50% OFF promotions from until 30 Nov 2026, probably coordinated and backed by Singtel. Effective 5G plan monthly pricing for the six months period is at about S$5.5 to S$7.55.

So we may really see S$8 per month 5G pricing down the road (without counting special promotions).

Whether this is sustainable or not, let's see.

Take note the higher priced plans (seldom talked about in this forum) still have quite some users, often due to mobile phone subsidies and monthly installments (or company subsidies).

As for 6G mobile investment, one solution is for the government to give some incentives like the S$100 million fund to upgrade the Nationwide Broadband Network (NBN) to accelerate 10Gbps plan fibre broadband plan availability.

 

[Habrosus]

Considering the price, Simba is good for overseas roaming use. Although signal may not be as good in Singapore, I do not actually have any issues using it. May not be as fast, but it still gets the job done. So many users on Simba. If it is really crap, people will be jumping out en mass already. If only if Imda has been more fair to it…

Ya, I dare use Simba as my primary line coz I need it to let me roam effectively for elderly persons not to "an cua ka hor le bue tong eh?!?" Then locally I use Singtel line that I previously couldn't get a bloody network in JB, as data backup since all know how to use WhatsApp.

For others who call me locally, they can volunteer to pay for a "better" network if they think my $10 Simba line is no good for them. Get the drift? Pay up or suck it up.

Senior plan still $5 though. My father never complained to me the line is no good.

I also dun seem to have any issues with the $10 plan. It also has 6 months roll over for roaming data.

My only concern is there are no information on them doing system migration and some users reportedly lost their phone lines in the process.

I know many seniors are using Simba. Those around me, and I even overheard on the escalators in Nex of a few elderly asking each other if they've topped up to get the extra $20.

Think must teach these people to go bang imda table if their gets bullied.

 

[neptunesea]

Senior plan still $5 though. My father never complained to me the line is no good.

I also dun seem to have any issues with the $10 plan. It also has 6 months roll over for roaming data.

My only concern is there are no information on them doing system migration and some users reportedly lost their phone lines in the process.

Referring to the earlier post that commented on 5G plan prices going "down". The downward trend is a farce, nett price per month for the average bargain hunter is in fact going up.

Singtel's 3 MVNOs have kept their 4th to 6th month free promo for quite some time now.

People are only porting in droves when their 1 for 1 top ups are depleting around now.

SIMBA and Eight, do not seem so interested in retaining these bargain hunters and don't seem to mind them porting out to Singtel and Maxx.

 

[username03]

Still got at least 6 month worth of credits with simba.. I have two choices, either to hold and continue to use my main line with simba till the credits run out, while waiting to see if the network gets faster and better. Or just forgo the 6 months worth of credits and jump to hi by singtel or Maxx, guess the benefits are comparable but network connectivity is better?

 

[Habrosus]

Still got at least 6 month worth of credits with simba.. I have two choices, either to hold and continue to use my main line with simba till the credits run out, while waiting to see if the network gets faster and better. Or just forgo the 6 months worth of credits and jump to hi by singtel or Maxx, guess the benefits are comparable but network connectivity is better?

Network connectivity better or not, only you can apply on your daily needs and expectations before deciding.

Works for some doesn't mean it'll work for the rest.

Speaking from own experience.

Since there's no contract, go ahead and get a (temporary?) line to test.

 

[username03]

Network connectivity better or not, only you can apply on your daily needs and expectations before deciding.

Works for some doesn't mean it'll work for the rest.

Speaking from own experience.

Since there's no contract, go ahead and get a (temporary?) line to test.

For my use, not much issue. Not chasing for speed since I dont download files on the go. Only sometimes network drop during calls when driving on the open highway in Singapore. Roaming wise, it's good.

 

[SongManKranji]

previous genting Rd trip. signal v gd.


Life is v short. Ai song song kao tuas & Changi.