Why is WiFi performance only 60-70% of what they claim?

[alex22]

Anyone experience congestion at node on fibre?
Eg some user in ur block massively downloading till the other users dl speed impacted?

 

[xiaofan]

Anyone experience congestion at node on fibre?
Eg some user in ur block massively downloading till the other users dl speed impacted?

Unlikely for 500Mbps plan and 1Gbps plan, at least not for big ones like Singtel and Starhub.

Right now it seems that 10Gbps plan may cause some issues for Starhub/MR 10Gbps users.

Reference: how GPON works. It is said that Singtel/Starhub typically use 1:32 split ratio.
https://www.gpon.com/

 

[alex22]

1:32 makes the most sense.
Theoratically 1gbps user can spam 1 direction of high bandwidth stuff 247 and almost end up like DOS on the node's mux and not get flagged for abuse by the isp right

 

[Henry Ng]

Unlikely for 500Mbps plan and 1Gbps plan, at least not for big ones like Singtel and Starhub.

Right now it seems that 10Gbps plan may cause some issues for Starhub/MR 10Gbps users.

Reference: how GPON works. It is said that Singtel/Starhub typically use 1:32 split ratio.
https://www.gpon.com/

On my router it is PON on and nothing mentioned about GPON.

 

[Henry Ng]

Anyone experience congestion at node on fibre?
Eg some user in ur block massively downloading till the other users dl speed impacted?

Yes my speed suddenly went down last night.

 

[Henry Ng]

1:32 makes the most sense.
Theoratically 1gbps user can spam 1 direction of high bandwidth stuff 247 and almost end up like DOS on the node's mux and not get flagged for abuse by the isp right

i think it feel like 1:128 la, 1:32 i do not think so. My speed can suddenly go down.

 

[Henry Ng]

See this article. XGS-PON is for 10G dl and ul. 1:256

http://www.tarluz.com/ftth/specification-differences-among-gpon-xg-pon-and-xgs-pon/#:~:text=What Is XG(S)-,bandwidth, symmetric version of GPON.​

 

[xiaofan]

On my router it is PON on and nothing mentioned about GPON.

10Gbps plans from ST/SH/MR use XGS-PON ONT/ONR.

GPON is for 500Mbps/1Gbps/dual 1Gbps/2Gbps/2.5Gbps plan offered now.

 

[Henry Ng]

10Gbps plans from ST/SH/MR use XGS-PON ONT/ONR.

GPON is for 500Mbps/1Gbps/dual 1Gbps/2Gbps/2.5Gbps plan offered now.

Yes but I think it is using standard spilt of 1:128 but may be after NLT upgrading may be 1:32 la.

 

[xiaofan]

See this article. XGS-PON is for 10G dl and ul. 1:256
http://www.tarluz.com/ftth/specification-differences-among-gpon-xg-pon-and-xgs-pon/#:~:text=What Is XG(S)-,bandwidth, symmetric version of GPON.

Yes but I think it is using standard spilt of 1:128 but may be after upgrading will be 1:64 or may be 1:32 la.

1:128 is the max split ratio for GPON, 1:256 is the max split ratio for XGS-PON.

I do not know about the typical split ratio of the 10G plans offered by ST/SH/MR.

On the other hand, based on the previous reports, most likely 32 is used by the SG ISPs for GPON (at least for Singtel and Starhub). Last time it was said M1 may use 64 in some areas and sometimes M1 users would feel lower SpeedTest results. Now maybe the situation has also changed for M1.

Not sure about XGS-PON, maybe 64 now.

 

[firesong]

6GHz will be an interesting thing to watch.

Enterprise also uses 6GHz now (more on WiFi 6E now, WiFi 7 will probably only really catching up in 2025/2026)


More about 6GHz in Europe (Singapore is pretty much in line with continental Europe).
https://blogs.arubanetworks.com/solutions/wi-fi-6e-in-europe-frequently-asked-questions/
https://www.qorvo.com/design-hub/blog/connectivity-q-and-a-whats-next-wi-fi-6-6e-in-european-union

+++++++++++++++
It is also interesting to see that large Enterprise Deployment is quite conservative in terms of channel bandwidth used.
https://www.ekahau.com/blog/channel-planning-best-practices-for-better-wi-fi/

Summary
We know we covered a ton in this blog and hope it is a wealth of information for you as you consider your channel plans. Want the TLDR? Here is a short summary of some recommendations for each frequency band:

2.4 GHz – Use 20 MHz wide channels only and use channels 1, 6 & 11.

5 GHz – Use 20 MHz wide channels in highly congested networks. If your environment allows, use the widest channel you can without causing contention on your network. Use all the available 5 GHz channels for your region that your client devices support.

6 GHz – If the region you are planning for has access to 1200 MHz of 6 GHz spectrum, use 80 MHz wide channels. For anywhere else that has less available 6 GHz spectrum at around 500 MHz – use 20 or 40 MHz wide channels.

And remember, avoid using mixed channel widths in 5 and 6 GHz, as this can be a big cause of Wi-Fi performance degradation!

That's why I was looking forward to it.

Major bonus when people's thinking about wifi matures and they start deploying multiple APs properly and stop blasting high-power signals that add to crosstalk and congestion.

 

[xiaofan]

That's why I was looking forward to it.

Major bonus when people's thinking about wifi matures and they start deploying multiple APs properly and stop blasting high-power signals that add to crosstalk and congestion.

WiFi 8 will further improve multiple AP coordination.

802.11be (i.e., Wi-Fi 7) mainly focuses on improving the throughput (i.e., Extremely High Throughput Wi-Fi, EHT), WiFi 8 will put more focus on UHR (Ultra High Reliability).

Reference:
https://www.everythingrf.com/community/what-is-wi-fi-8

The upcoming Wi-Fi 8 standard is poised to address these needs with a special emphasis on the unique challenges posed by industrial applications. Wi-Fi 8 is expected to offer a range of powerful new features and capabilities designed to provide high-reliability, ultra-low latency, and support for extremely high node density. Some of the major features we can expect from Wi-Fi 8 include:

• Multiple Access Point (AP) Coordination and Transmission
• Millimeter Wave (mmWave) Frequencies [Note: this one has questions]
• Low Latency

 

[Mach3.2]

On the other hand, based on the previous reports, most likely 32 is used by the SG ISPs for GPON (at least for Singtel and Starhub). Last time it was said M1 may use 64 in some areas and sometimes M1 users would feel lower SpeedTest results. Now maybe the situation has also changed for M1.

The most recent (Dec 2023) Netlink Trust Interconnection Offer made mentions of either a 1:1 or 1:24 split ratio.

See page 9
https://www.imda.gov.sg/regulations...ork/netlink-trusts-interconnection-offer-2023

Also, there isn't any publicly available customised agreement to run anything other than the standardised split ratios stated in schedule 1 of the approved ICO.

https://www.imda.gov.sg/regulations...netlink-trusts-existing-customised-agreements

 

[xiaofan]

The most recent (Dec 2023) Netlink Trust Interconnection Offer made mentions of either a 1:1 or 1:24 split ratio.

See page 9
https://www.imda.gov.sg/regulations...ork/netlink-trusts-interconnection-offer-2023

Also, there isn't any publicly available customised agreement to run anything other than the standardised split ratios stated in schedule 1 of the approved ICO.

https://www.imda.gov.sg/regulations...netlink-trusts-existing-customised-agreements

Nice info. I was trying to find such info previously but can not find.

As mentioned by you, 1:24 and 1:1 ratio are mentioned in Chapter 3 of the following document for RESIDENTIAL END-USER CONNECTION.

https://www.imda.gov.sg/-/media/imd...-offer/dec-2023/sch-1-approved-7-dec-2023.pdf

 

[Henry Ng]

1:128 is the max split ratio for GPON, 1:256 is the max split ratio for XGS-PON.

I do not know about the typical split ratio of the 10G plans offered by ST/SH/MR.

On the other hand, based on the previous reports, most likely 32 is used by the SG ISPs for GPON (at least for Singtel and Starhub). Last time it was said M1 may use 64 in some areas and sometimes M1 users would feel lower SpeedTest results. Now maybe the situation has also changed for M1.

Not sure about XGS-PON, maybe 64 now.

If ISP use different spilt for different plan then if i am to upgrade from 1Gbps to 10Gbps then SH will have to send some one to change my connection cable from this to that. Everyday i am ok with 1Gbps and there is no down time for me and the tech just come and just plug and play only. Very fast the installation is completed so i think the spilt no change la. SH can not be so hardworking to go down on site to change it and there are so many who signed up Ultra Speed. Many night my speed will drop. I just complained and i think no choice just wait for them to settle it.

 

[xiaofan]

The most recent (Dec 2023) Netlink Trust Interconnection Offer made mentions of either a 1:1 or 1:24 split ratio.

Now the question is whether 1:24 split ratio is a good one to use with XGS-PON. I tend to think it is quite a good ratio to use with GPON.

Or maybe 1:24 split ratio is not an issue, but rather the capacity of the uplink OLT as well as the backend equipment. You can see Starhub/MR users are complaining that the speed can not really achieve 8.2Gbps from time to time.

Another case in point -- SIMBA 2.5Gbps -- users complained about SpeedTest results. More like a backend issue and interconnection with the SpeedTest servers.

 

[Henry Ng]

Nice info. I was trying to find such info previously but can not find.

As mentioned by you, 1:24 and 1:1 ratio are mentioned in Chapter of the following document for RESIDENTIAL END-USER CONNECTION.

https://www.imda.gov.sg/-/media/imd...-offer/dec-2023/sch-1-approved-7-dec-2023.pdf

i also trying but can not get it too.

 

[Henry Ng]

Now the question is whether 1:24 split ratio is a good one to use with XGS-PON. I tend to think it is quite a good ratio to use with GPOIN.

Or maybe 1:24 split ratio is not an issue, but rather the capacity of the uplink OLT as well as the backend equipment. You can see Starhub/MR users are complaining that the speed can not really achieve 8.2Gbps.

Yes but i believe that NLT and ISP is upgrading and soon the situation will improve and we can expect better speed for sure. May be next year everything nice nice for users. Just wait and see.

 

[xiaofan]

Yes but i believe that NLT and ISP is upgrading and soon the situation will improve and we can expect better speed for sure. May be next year everything nice nice for users. Just wait and see.

I agree. We will see improvement over the next few years (say 2025 to 2028) and 10Gbps will be the main stream in 2028 (or latest 2030).
Backend improvement -- more capacity, more consistent wired speed at least for local connections.
WiFi 7 router and clients getting more popular -- better wireless speed.

After 2028 WiFi 8 may come out and become popular in 2030, which will offer more robust WiFi connection to better match the 10G wired bandwidth.

 

[Mach3.2]

Now the question is whether 1:24 split ratio is a good one to use with XGS-PON.

Good for us, not so good for ISP, because they cannot oversubscribe it more.

but rather the capacity of the uplink OLT as well as the backend equipment.

Also this loh. The infrastructure have to keep up.