*Official* Shiny Things club - Part 2

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BBCWatcher

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Actually I missed out on PSEA. It's like I'll be using my sibling's PSEA account to pay for majority of the tuition fees, we still have matching 11k from her previously unmatched baby bonus. Totalling about 24k including her previous PSEA balance which means I'll likely be paying the remaining in cash.
You get another $3,000 into your PSEA from National Service, right? Anyway, whatever the source(s), you'll want to spend the PSEA dollars later in your studies, assuming 2.5% interest remains comparatively attractive.

Given that the other choices (SCB JumpStart, SSB) have lower interest rates than the PSEA, I should just put the first 10k I save from NS straight into PSEA?
If you're allowed to do that, sure. I'm under the impression that you cannot, but if you can, awesome.

The remaining that I save after ORD will be used top up the remaining 1k matching bonus and then the rest of the funds that I might need (roughly 8k + miscellaneous) be parked in SSB/SCB JumpStart?
Makes sense to me if allowed. Just be aware that PSEA dollars must be spent on qualified higher education expenses (in Singapore). If they aren't, they'll roll into your CPF Ordinary Account when you're about 31 years old. It's usually quite hard to have "too many" PSEA dollars, though.

Ideally, I had planned to take the MOE Tuition Fee Loan, then keep the money invested until I graduated and then pay off the loan using PSEA but I'm not sure if you're allowed to use one's sibling's account to pay off the loan (I've emailed MOE but they have yet to respond).
That's a really good question. I don't know either. If that is allowed, that'd be awesome.

That way the money could be generating interest for 5 - 6 years before I pay use it to pay for tuition which was an idea from a Seedly article I read a while back. I would try to use my personal PSEA account for this but then I would be missing out 11k matching funds which doesn't make much sense
Agreed.

I understand but technically if interest rates fall couldn't one switch out from SCB to SSB? Or is it likely SSB rates will fall as well?
The latter is certainly possible.
 

sks888

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Hi Shiny and all,
Sorry for the intercept with so many queries before me. Like to clear some doubts n pardon me if some already ask before. A Singaporean looking to retire in 20 years.
My portfolio:
Federal bond(35%)-ibtm 50%+ Sdia or corp 50%
Stocks(65%)-eimi 13%+Iwda 77% and China A shares-cnya 10% or vwra 90% and China A shares-cnya 10%
1)ibtm(LSE listed) Vs ief(us listed), do I get tax on this bond dividend? And is ief bond etf counted towards the 60k estate tax exemption?
2)As for how much dividend I'm receiving like ibtm, should I look at weighted average coupon or weighted average YTM ?
3)If bankruptcy were to happen at ib or BlackRock, what happens to my funds and most are from BlackRock.
4)Getting bonds assets equal or less than 10yrs bonds for my portfolio is it advisable ? Will Sdia or corp works better for my portfolio?
5) which method is better?7yrs before retirement, portfolio adjust to 55/45 or every 5yrs,adjust portfolio till 55bond/45stocks until end of 20yrs. Inaddition, injections new funds of 10k to mbh n sti etf and rebalancing the whole portfolio once per yr.
 

cassowary18

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Has anyone here used Kristal.AI as their broker? Fee free for up to USD 50,000 investment, 0.3% for AUM over USD 50,000. Currency conversion at 5bps which is quite competitive. What's the catch here?
 

Ornion

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Here to share that DBS Invest Saver allows you to buy Nikko AM Corporate Bond ETF (MBH) and Nikko AM Reit ETF (CFA) now. It is not official yet, but it is available on the list of ETFs available for RSP. You all might want to take a look.
 

cassowary18

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Here to share that DBS Invest Saver allows you to buy Nikko AM Corporate Bond ETF (MBH) and Nikko AM Reit ETF (CFA) now. It is not official yet, but it is available on the list of ETFs available for RSP. You all might want to take a look.

Interesting...0.5% sales charge for MBH and 0.82% for CFA. A game changer, definitely. Would use this over OCBC BCIP.
 

yellownova

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Think my question is gonna sound stupid: If I have a portfolio overly weighted in bonds, and I want to rebalance, and the bond amount is 10x of my average monthly DCA, do I sell my bonds then just continue to DCA? Or does a lump sum make sense here?
 

paythel

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Given Singapore residents are not subject to capital gains tax, withholding tax on US assets is fairly substantial, and trading commissions are relatively low, would "dividend avoidance" be a reasonable action?

Say you wanted to buy-and-hold shares of a bond ETF listed in the US, perhaps BND. You purchase the shares as usual, but you also sell it at market close the day before each ex-div, and buy it back at market open the next day.

This way, assuming the price of BND drops by exactly the dividend payout, you'd be able to buy back more shares each time, effectively amounting to a gain of the full dividend amount, while avoiding the 30% withholding tax.
For BND, this would save you 30% of a 2.24% yield, a gain of 0.675%.

The cost would be the commissions involved in buying and selling each distribution.
For BND, each buy or sell transaction would be about 0.50 SGD, and with monthly distributions, mean 12 SGD per year.

It would seem that so long as the holding were larger than 1778 SGD, it would make sense to avoid dividends in this way. If the ticker in question had fewer distributions or had a higher yield, the threshold would be even lower.

There are two concerns I can forsee with this approach -
1) You'd presumably cross the bid/ask spread, which while usually minimal (Vanguard suggests it is 0.01 USD for BND), can vary at times.

2) There may be some slippage/tracking error when selling and buying, from overnight news/changes in sentiment, as well as just volatility in general. But I suppose arguably this can be treated as effectively random, and cancel out directionally.


I wonder what Shiny, BBC or whoever else might think about this?
 

jq1130

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Here to share that DBS Invest Saver allows you to buy Nikko AM Corporate Bond ETF (MBH) and Nikko AM Reit ETF (CFA) now. It is not official yet, but it is available on the list of ETFs available for RSP. You all might want to take a look.

Yeah,i just checked online sales charge 0.5%
 

intime

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Interesting...0.5% sales charge for MBH and 0.82% for CFA. A game changer, definitely. Would use this over OCBC BCIP.

not sure why ocbc bcip want to have that age 30 limit for 0.88% fees. min $5/counter is so irritating. :s22:
i'm switching to dbs/posb invest-saver.
 

BBCWatcher

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Given Singapore residents are not subject to capital gains tax, withholding tax on US assets is fairly substantial, and trading commissions are relatively low, would "dividend avoidance" be a reasonable action?

Say you wanted to buy-and-hold shares of a bond ETF listed in the US, perhaps BND.
OK, BND is a low cost index fund domiciled in the United States that invests in U.S. dollar denominated investment grade U.S. corporate bonds.

You purchase the shares as usual, but you also sell it at market close the day before each ex-div, and buy it back at market open the next day.

This way, assuming the price of BND drops by exactly the dividend payout, you'd be able to buy back more shares each time, effectively amounting to a gain of the full dividend amount, while avoiding the 30% withholding tax.
For BND, this would save you 30% of a 2.24% yield, a gain of 0.675%.
You forgot at least one important part. Practically everybody holding that fund also owes U.S. dividend tax, including U.S. persons. The top marginal federal tax rate on those dividends is 23.8% for U.S. persons, and many of them will also be subject to some additional state income tax. I'd conservatively figure a 20% average effective tax rate that your U.S. counterparts face.

Basic finance theory suggests, ceteris paribus, that BND's share price should indeed fall ex-dividend to compensate for the net (after-tax) dividend payout, not the gross (pre-tax).

If you assume the average BND investor pays 20 cents of tax per dollar of dividend while you pay 30, then you might be able to squeeze out about 10% (not 30%) of that 2.24% annual gross dividend yield, or about 22 basis points per year. BND distributes dividends monthly, so you might be able to eke out 2 basis points per "recycle" trade, give or take.

Another reasonable assumption is that you're not the first person to dream up this idea. There could be some other international "tax recyclers" from low or zero tax jurisdictions pushing the share price down a bit extra just before the dividend and pushing it back up a bit more just after. If that's happening (probably, a tiny bit), it'll erode those ~2 basis points.

Another potential issue is that BND is a U.S. domiciled fund, so it's U.S. estate taxable. If that fact bothers you, you can buy more life insurance to pay the future U.S. estate tax. If applicable, you could factor the cost of that additional life insurance into your calculations.

If you're a reasonably "big whale" or bigger, there's another possible solution: buy a variety of U.S. bonds directly, if that's what you want to do. That's not as easy with U.S. corporate bonds because each issue is rather limited, but for U.S. Treasuries it's quite easy. As a non-U.S. person living in Singapore directly holding individual bonds there's no U.S. capital gains, dividends, interest, or estate tax. It's when the bonds get packaged up into funds that the dividend and estate taxes apply. (U.S. persons are different, of course, and I'm making some other basic assumptions that typically hold -- for example that the bonds are not "effectively connected," not associated with a U.S. trade or U.S. business of some kind.)

Yet another possible approach is to use derivatives to place your bet(s) -- the futures markets. Somebody who's more of an options expert than I am might be able to come up with a reasonable recipe to make a similar bet to a long position in BND.
 

paythel

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Thanks for the response!

Practically everybody holding that fund also owes U.S. dividend tax, including U.S. persons.

There could be some other international "tax recyclers" from low or zero tax jurisdictions pushing the share price down a bit extra just before the dividend and pushing it back up a bit more just after.

Fair points both. I overlooked them and was overstating the possible gain.
Still, there looks to be a positive expectation from expending the effort to avoid dividends. So I guess I gotta decide I'm lazy enough to leave money on the table.


If you're a reasonably "big whale" or bigger, there's another possible solution: buy a variety of U.S. bonds directly, if that's what you want to do. That's not as easy with U.S. corporate bonds because each issue is rather limited, but for U.S. Treasuries it's quite easy. As a non-U.S. person living in Singapore directly holding individual bonds there's no U.S. capital gains, dividends, interest, or estate tax. It's when the bonds get packaged up into funds that the dividend and estate taxes apply. (U.S. persons are different, of course, and I'm making some other basic assumptions that typically hold -- for example that the bonds are not "effectively connected," not associated with a U.S. trade or U.S. business of some kind.)

Ah yes, I was aware of this, but the diversification/allocation/ease-of-use benefits of the ETF packaging are worth the fees/tax for me.


Yet another possible approach is to use derivatives to place your bet(s) -- the futures markets. Somebody who's more of an options expert than I am might be able to come up with a reasonable recipe to make a similar bet to a long position in BND.

Oh, I hadn't considered this! Presumably both options and futures would be priced to negate the impact of distributions?

I suppose the most obvious option would be to buy an ATM call and sell an ATM put to establish a synthetic long. Otherwise, I guess you could buy some deep ITM calls?
 

Rknight

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I think that means you're trying to send a market order (or a limit order with the price a long way through the market), and IB is just letting you know that they're going to limit the price you get filled at. If you click OK on that, I think the order will get sent straight to the exchange?

I am using market order, and i click enter and okay. But after that nothing happens. :s11: tried a few times, nothing happened. I have deposited more than enough funds in the system already. Am i missing something here ?
 

kram62

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I am using market order, and i click enter and okay. But after that nothing happens. :s11: tried a few times, nothing happened. I have deposited more than enough funds in the system already. Am i missing something here ?
Try a limit order instead at or near the ask price. This is what I do and it avoids problems.
 

viventa

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Here to share that DBS Invest Saver allows you to buy Nikko AM Corporate Bond ETF (MBH) and Nikko AM Reit ETF (CFA) now. It is not official yet, but it is available on the list of ETFs available for RSP. You all might want to take a look.


Where did you see this? The DBS/POSB Invest-Saver website still only refers to the Nikko AM Singapore STI ETF and ABF Singapore Bond Index Fund. I also didn't see any other options available when I logged into iBanking.
 

jq1130

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Where did you see this? The DBS/POSB Invest-Saver website still only refers to the Nikko AM Singapore STI ETF and ABF Singapore Bond Index Fund. I also didn't see any other options available when I logged into iBanking.

Login DBS Digibank > Invest > Unit Trust & ETFs > View All or search for a Fund > Monthly Recurring > Search for fund (type ETF, then u will see Nikko Am SGD Investment GRD Corp Bd ETF)
 

Converged

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I'm investing S$500/ month in G3B using POSB-IS. Let's say i'm progressing and will be investing S$1200/ month in local etf.
According to ST, I should be using SCB to purchase local etf.

Is there anyway I can transfer my g3b stocks from posb to scb?
If not, by logic, I will just keep the g3b stocks in posb and continue dca using scb?

Other than that, I'll be getting a lumpsum year end bonus. I'll be planning to use that to do a lumpsum investment in local etf using SCB. Can I purchase ES3 instead of G3B? I suppose it will not make any difference right?

TIA and sorry for these 'noob' questions!
 

pylpoh

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Anything from 501-1700, can consider OCBC bcip, $5 trade fee. If want transfer, maybe better to your cdp.

I'm investing S$500/ month in G3B using POSB-IS. Let's say i'm progressing and will be investing S$1200/ month in local etf.
According to ST, I should be using SCB to purchase local etf.

Is there anyway I can transfer my g3b stocks from posb to scb?
If not, by logic, I will just keep the g3b stocks in posb and continue dca using scb?

Other than that, I'll be getting a lumpsum year end bonus. I'll be planning to use that to do a lumpsum investment in local etf using SCB. Can I purchase ES3 instead of G3B? I suppose it will not make any difference right?

TIA and sorry for these 'noob' questions!
 

Shiny Things

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Hi Shiny Things and all

I have been reading ur book and will be starting to put some money into investing.
[...]
Is this approach feasible? I am looking for long term investment for about 30 years.

Thank you.

Well, that's basically the approach I recommend in the book, so yeah, you've got the right idea. I'd personally do a 50-50 local-global split in your equities, but that's less important than just getting started.

1) I am currently using OCBC as my main bank, so will likely go for their BCIP to invest in G3B and MBH instead of opening another POSB account.

May I know how G3B/MBH stacks up against ES3/A35?

G3B and ES3 are basically the same. MBH is higher-yielding than A35, though; I'd use it if that's an option.

2) Will be investing in IWDA/SWRD (80%) and EIMI (20%) through IBKR.
How does this ratio look?
With regards to IWDA and SWRD, are there any big differences considering they track the same index?

I wouldn't bother allocating to EIMI at all. You're going to have a tiny amount in them and it's not going to make any real difference to your returns.


Is this too risky?

Thank you!

It's a bit riskier than I'd go for, unless you're like 20 years old. Your time horizon might be long, but it'll get shorter as you get older.
 

Shiny Things

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I'm investing S$500/ month in G3B using POSB-IS. Let's say i'm progressing and will be investing S$1200/ month in local etf.
According to ST, I should be using SCB to purchase local etf.

Is there anyway I can transfer my g3b stocks from posb to scb?

Nah, unfortunately; you'll need to redeem from POSB and buy them again at Stanchart. It's not the end of the world, though.

Oh, I hadn't considered this! Presumably both options and futures would be priced to negate the impact of distributions?

I suppose the most obvious option would be to buy an ATM call and sell an ATM put to establish a synthetic long. Otherwise, I guess you could buy some deep ITM calls?
Oh my god, no, you're thinking way too hard about this. This is a thing you can do, but just don't, it's too much hassle and you're gonna end up paying spread cross on the options as well. You haven't even explained why a Singapore investor would want to own USD-denominated bonds in the first place, unless I missed it?

Given Singapore residents are not subject to capital gains tax, withholding tax on US assets is fairly substantial, and trading commissions are relatively low, would "dividend avoidance" be a reasonable action?

Say you wanted to buy-and-hold shares of a bond ETF listed in the US, perhaps BND. You purchase the shares as usual, but you also sell it at market close the day before each ex-div, and buy it back at market open the next day.

...and run up a truckload of transaction costs, slippage, etc etc etc...

Just save yourself a whole lot of trouble and find a UK-listed equivalent.

Has anyone here used Kristal.AI as their broker? Fee free for up to USD 50,000 investment, 0.3% for AUM over USD 50,000. Currency conversion at 5bps which is quite competitive. What's the catch here?

Never heard of them, but I can't see anything about their portfolios on their website. Not investing in something if I don't know what they're going to put me into.

Hi Shiny and all,
Sorry for the intercept with so many queries before me. Like to clear some doubts n pardon me if some already ask before. A Singaporean looking to retire in 20 years.
My portfolio:
Federal bond(35%)-ibtm 50%+ Sdia or corp 50%
Stocks(65%)-eimi 13%+Iwda 77% and China A shares-cnya 10% or vwra 90% and China A shares-cnya 10%

Mate, there's a LOT going on here, you have gotten yourself in way too deep. All your bonds are USD bonds, you've got no SGD bond allocation so you've got a huge pile of FX risk. You're taking a yield curve position with IBTM+SDIA, you're buying the short end after the curve has steepened. You're plowing money into A-shares for no clear reason, when A-shares are trading at a hefty premium to H-shares.

If you came to me as a consulting client with that portfolio I'd tell you to toss it all out the window and start from scratch. This doesn't make any sense.

3)If bankruptcy were to happen at ib or BlackRock, what happens to my funds and most are from BlackRock.

Nothing will happen. The fund's trustee will appoint a new fund manager to manage the fund. The money will still be there.

Why, what did you think would happen?

(Side note: I've lost count of the number of people who've asked this question! "What happens if IB/Stanchart fails"; "what happens if Blackrock/State Street/Vanguard fails"... and I genuinely don't understand why? I never hear anyone asking "what if UOBKH fails?" or "what if Great Eastern fails?"...)
 
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loveboon

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MBH is an index fund that invests in Singapore dollar denominated corporate and government agency bonds of reasonable or better quality, while A35 invests in Singapore Government Securities. Other things being equal, MBH is a better choice for long-term investors. Each individual bond it holds is somewhat riskier, but there are lots of bond issuers to spread out that risk and long-term average returns should be somewhat higher to compensate for the risk.

Hi BBCWatcher, i was comparing the dividend yield between the MBH (0.47%) and A35 (2.20%) for the year of 2019 and was wondering if buying and holding onto A35 would be better in the long term if I intend to live off the dividends?
 
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