FIRE (Financial Independence, Retire Early) Movement

[3dfxplayer]

Came across this on Twitter. I guess there are lots of people who have hit multi millions working in tech in the Bay area. But eventually you dont really need that much money. After you cross 2M, probably more worth it to focus on other aspects of life. The marginal utility of that extra money >2M is probably not much, it is going to be wasted anyways.

It can even be less than 2m, many people are just as happy with way less money, theres more to life than money.

 

[revhappy]

It can even be less than 2m, many people are just as happy with way less money, theres more to life than money.

Exactly, it is a bit like you are going for a trek and you need to pack some of the essential stuff, water, food, clothes etc but you carried loads of water, but not enough food and clothes. Money is also like that. Carrying way more than what is needed is also a waste. If someone is so fortunate to make loads of money, then maybe time to stop and think what else can be done with their precious little remaining time of their life than just continue to earn more and more because they would get bored otherwise. It just feels like a waste.

I am specifically talking about this guys case because there is a huge disparity between 2M and 12M. Around 5M was the time to stop already. But he says he will get bored. What to say...

 

[minamikaze]

Exactly, it is a bit like you are going for a trek and you need to pack some of the essential stuff, water, food, clothes etc but you carried loads of water, but not enough food and clothes. Money is also like that. Carrying way more than what is needed is also a waste. If someone is so fortunate to make loads of money, then maybe time to stop and think what else can be done with their precious little remaining time of their life than just continue to earn more and more because they would get bored otherwise. It just feels like a waste.

I am specifically talking about this guys case because there is a huge disparity between 2M and 12M. Around 5M was the time to stop already. But he says he will get bored. What to say...

Earning money in itself can be addictive - it might be hard for someone to stop earning their 500k per annum salary out of a sudden, even if they don't actually need it.

 

[highsulphur]

Earning money in itself can be addictive - it might be hard for someone to stop earning their 500k per annum salary out of a sudden, even if they don't actually need it.

It's hard to walk away. There is always something to spend on

Esp for those with dependents

 

[BrandonnC]

The fact that he says he will continue to work, because he will feel bored otherwise, makes it look like he would have done whatever he is doing, regardless. I mean if you are remorseful of something and feel you did wrong, you would change.

I also have this belief, that we all look back in hindsight and say we should have done this and we should have done that, but actually if we are given 2nd chance to relive our lives, we will relive it exactly the same way.

It is as tho if one does not have a strong sense of awareness (and execute the 'retirement'), then he deserves to feel regretful when the time (end) comes.

Reading from this thread, i sensed that many cannot simply 'let it go'.

 

[andyhtc]

I guess many cannot let go of their lifestyle if the active income is gone. Some also peg their self worth to the job title. When you are at the peak of your career you may just want to stay on.

 

[celtosaxon]

It is not always about money, pride or lifestyle, some people actually enjoy their job and derive a sense of satisfaction from it. I’d like to count myself in that category.

Although my paycheck is still meaningful and pays the bills, my gains each year have far exceeded my annual pay… at least they have for the last 3 years.

 

[revhappy]

It is not always about money, pride or lifestyle, some people actually enjoy their job and derive a sense of satisfaction from it. I’d like to count myself in that category.

Although my paycheck is still meaningful and pays the bills, my gains each year have far exceeded my annual pay… at least they have for the last 3 years.

Yes, you are really fortunate. But most people are not like that. Especially that guy who says, he would be bored if he doesnt go to work. So that seems to be his driver to go to work.

 

[Prof. Utonium]

TC means?

My bad, I only know town council and total cholesterol.

 

[revhappy]

TC means?

My bad, I only know town council and total cholesterol.

I think it means Total Comp(ensation).

The post originated in blind and when I googled for Msft TC, this came up.

https://www.teamblind.com/post/Is-TC-@Microsoft-comparable-to-FANG-mnWojwmF

 

[highsulphur]

A good reference point. I suppose hitting top 1% should allow one to fire safely?

https://blog.seedly.sg/millionaires-in-singapore/

 

[limster]

Interesting report, but as the article points out, millionaires may not be as well-represented in such surveys.

I've previously read and recommended "Millionaire Next Door" and currently reading the sequel "The Next Millionaire Next Door" where far more rigorous research was done on the lifestyles and habits of millionaires. Both are available to borrow for free from library.

The sequel also answers one of the challenges to the first book - the claim of survivorship bias, that they only interviewed millionaires who 'made it' and not those who didn't make it. The study looks not just at wealth, but at the difference between "actual" and "expected" wealth.

So there is a focus not just on 'absolute' wealth, but those that 'outperform' by generating a lot more wealth than their 'expected' wealth.

 

[revhappy]

Interesting report, but as the article points out, millionaires may not be as well-represented in such surveys.

I've previously read and recommended "Millionaire Next Door" and currently reading the sequel "The Next Millionaire Next Door" where far more rigorous research was done on the lifestyles and habits of millionaires. Both are available to borrow for free from library.

The sequel also answers one of the challenges to the first book - the claim of survivorship bias, that they only interviewed millionaires who 'made it' and not those who didn't make it. The study looks not just at wealth, but at the difference between "actual" and "expected" wealth.

So there is a focus not just on 'absolute' wealth, but those that 'outperform' by generating a lot more wealth than their 'expected' wealth.

I started reading the millionaire next door and found somethings shocking about how different America was in 1996, before the tech boom.

The typical millionaire in that book is very different from what we see these days. Also there is a lot of gender bias in that book. It keeps using the phrase "The millionaire and his wife"

 

[andyhtc]

Delaying retirement pays off​

A new study finds that govt measures have boosted the number of older folk staying in the workforce. This productivity is important as Singapore becomes a super-aged society.

In sum, the retirement and re-employment mandate has been a useful policy.

Granting older workers the option to stay employed longer and delay retirement augments our workforce and reduces the healthcare burden on national coffers.

Singapore's paced increase in the retirement and re-employment ages, coupled with other inclusive work policies, will be useful in mitigating the impacts of societal ageing on our economy.

https://www.straitstimes.com/opinion/delaying-retirement-pays-off

 

[limster]

I started reading the millionaire next door and found somethings shocking about how different America was in 1996, before the tech boom.

The typical millionaire in that book is very different from what we see these days. Also there is a lot of gender bias in that book. It keeps using the phrase "The millionaire and his wife"

I think some people gave him that feedback so he wrote Millionaire Women Next Door as well:
https://www.amazon.com/Millionaire-Women-Next-Door-Businesswomen/dp/0740755706
The Next Millionaire Next Door was released in 2019 and co-authored by original author's daughter and I think theres more gender representation, incorporating both these books.

 

[limster]

A good reference point. I suppose hitting top 1% should allow one to fire safely?

https://blog.seedly.sg/millionaires-in-singapore/

There is something not quite right about the numbers when you cross reference to property prices.

* I presume that the S$3.85m excludes your residential property.

* I checked the stats that say that 5.0% of households live in landed

* The median price of a landed is coincidentally S$3.85m while the average price of landed is $5m: median price of landed

* So if we assume that the top 1% live in a landed worth >$5m and that their net worth excluding property is 'only' $3.85m, this means that even in the top 1%, we see an 'asset rich' / (relatively) cash poor situation where their property value is far in excess of their liquid net worth.

 

[highsulphur]

There is something not quite right about the numbers when you cross reference to property prices.

* I presume that the S$3.85m excludes your residential property.

* I checked the stats that say that 5.0% of households live in landed

* The median price of a landed is coincidentally S$3.85m while the average price of landed is $5m: median price of landed

* So if we assume that the top 1% live in a landed worth >$5m and that their net worth excluding property is 'only' $3.85m, this means that even in the top 1%, we see an 'asset rich' / (relatively) cash poor situation where their property value is far in excess of their liquid net worth.

I agree. The number looks low. Esp when there is a separate report that top 1% earner gets 800k pa

 

[hwmook]

he seems to be hinting that he sacrificed his health (as health is the first item on his list in front of family), which frankly, is a lifestyle choice.

just because you are working doesn't mean you cannot eat healthy diet and exercise. thats called a 'false dichotomy.

I've visited friends working in tech in the bay area - they seemed to have very balanced lifestyles, they look healthy and not overweight, despite food in SF Chinatown being pretty good! Weather is great for outdoor activities like mountain biking too.

WFH has actually had a positive effect on my health - I've been using my condo Gym and pool more often. Morning swim in an empty pool before starting work helps me become more awake!

I really don't know what to think about healthy diet after I found my aunt dead last night in her house. She 65 and is extremely health conscious but still die of hypertensive heart disease.

 

[revhappy]

I really don't know what to think about healthy diet after I found my aunt dead last night in her house. She 65 and is extremely health conscious but still die of hypertensive heart disease.

This is just bad luck can hit anyone and we cannot do anything about it. But what we can do is try not to get stressed out due to work and that effects our health. Also make sure our work doesnt take so much time that we dont find even some time in the day to do some light walking atleast. Also sleep cycle is important. If our work takes a lot of time and then we also need time for play, there is just not enough time in the day and we take it out from our sleep time. This could also effect health.

 

[limster]

This is just bad luck can hit anyone and we cannot do anything about it. But what we can do is try not to get stressed out due to work and that effects our health. Also make sure our work doesnt take so much time that we dont find even some time in the day to do some light walking atleast. Also sleep cycle is important. If our work takes a lot of time and then we also need time for play, there is just not enough time in the day and we take it out from our sleep time. This could also effect health.

Just like some smokers can live longer than non-smokers... but smokers may face health issues that affect their quality of life even if they have a long lifespan

Improved fitness and weight might also be able to reduce the number of hours sleep needed ... presumably by improving sleep quality (6 hours of quality sleep better than 7 hours of poor sleep).