YTD 2025 Networth tracking thread

[PrincessBunny]

I think you must be feeling real old now!



For retail investors, there are two different scenarios:
1. Accumulation mode: Always adding money (or net addition), because haven't retired
XIRR (MWR) > TWR
Here, one can "cheat" for higher performance with XIRR by adding more borrowed money from outside and then cash out the same amount but leaving profits behind. So now the profits inflate the XIRR return ratio. TWR won't reflect this. Trading gurus who want to promote their track record do this to con their followers. They usually earn more from course fees, which get deposited into the portfolio.

2. Retirement mode: Always taking out money, because got no more high-paying job
TWR > XIRR (MWR)
Here, one "cheats" for higher performance by withdrawing money halfway to the make capital "smaller". The TWR calculates return with denominator that is smaller, so it always give higher number than XIRR return. Those participating in trading competitions with own accounts often do this withdrawal mid-way to boost ranking (The famous trader Mark Minervini did this in USIC).

If you haven't retired, then you'll be in the Mode 1. Mine is in Mode 2 (semi-retirement).
So my TWR is 40% YTD right now, but I have a withdrawal target rate of around 10% to 20% (varies, depends on whether I go for overseas holidays), so my net MWR returns is about 20% to 30% YTD.

So, it really depends on what you want to do with the return number. If you tell me yours is XIRR, that means you're still in Mode 1, which should match your younger age?

I beg to differ. Just giving some arbitrary prices (the same for both scenarios) for Stock ABC in the scenarios below.

Scenario 1. Accumulation mode:

Date	Qty	Price	Cashflow	Qty Total	NAV
1/1/20	10,000	$1.00	$10,000.00	10,000	$10,000.00
1/1/21	5,000	$2.00	$10,000.00	15,000	$30,000.00
1/1/22	4,000	$2.50	$10,000.00	19,000	$47,500.00
1/1/23	8,000	$1.25	$10,000.00	27,000	$33,750.00
1/1/24	10,000	$1.00	$10,000.00	37,000	$37,000.00
1/1/25	-37,000	$1.50	-$55,500.00	0	$0.00

TWRR: 50%; MWRR: 18.74%

Scenario 2. Retirement mode:

Date	Qty	Price	Cashflow	Qty Total	NAV
1/1/20	37,000	$1.00	$37,000.00	37,000	$37,000.00
1/1/21	-5,000	$2.00	-$10,000.00	32,000	$64,000.00
1/1/22	-4,000	$2.50	-$10,000.00	28,000	$70,000.00
1/1/23	-8,000	$1.25	-$10,000.00	20,000	$25,000.00
1/1/24	-10,000	$1.00	-$10,000.00	10,000	$10,000.00
1/1/25	-10,000	$1.50	-$15,000.00	0	$0.00

TWRR: 146.67%; MWRR: 91.75%

TWRR is higher in both cases. I am not even speaking about cases of "cheating" the numbers. Just the raw calculations when comparing apple to apple, in most cases, will point to a higher TWRR.

 

[PrincessBunny]

As long as both MWR and TWR exceed benchmark (SP500 or QQQ) is good enough.

I addressed this here (double-edged sword):

Tell Adam Khoo to use MWR, the MWR will likely be lower than the blue line

 

[stanlawj]

I beg to differ. Just giving some arbitrary prices (the same for both scenarios) for Stock ABC in the scenarios below.

Scenario 1. Accumulation mode:

Date	Qty	Price	Cashflow	Qty Total	NAV
1/1/20	10,000	$1.00	$10,000.00	10,000	$10,000.00
1/1/21	5,000	$2.00	$10,000.00	15,000	$30,000.00
1/1/22	4,000	$2.50	$10,000.00	19,000	$47,500.00
1/1/23	8,000	$1.25	$10,000.00	27,000	$33,750.00
1/1/24	10,000	$1.00	$10,000.00	37,000	$37,000.00
1/1/25	-37,000	$1.50	-$55,500.00	0	$0.00

TWRR: 50%; MWRR: 18.74%

Scenario 2. Retirement mode:

Date	Qty	Price	Cashflow	Qty Total	NAV
1/1/20	37,000	$1.00	$37,000.00	37,000	$37,000.00
1/1/21	-5,000	$2.00	-$10,000.00	32,000	$64,000.00
1/1/22	-4,000	$2.50	-$10,000.00	28,000	$70,000.00
1/1/23	-8,000	$1.25	-$10,000.00	20,000	$25,000.00
1/1/24	-10,000	$1.00	-$10,000.00	10,000	$10,000.00
1/1/25	-10,000	$1.50	-$15,000.00	0	$0.00

TWRR: 146.67%; MWRR: 91.75%

TWRR is higher in both cases. I am not even speaking about cases of "cheating" the numbers. Just the raw calculations when comparing apple to apple, in most cases, will point to a higher TWRR.

Yikes, looks like your calculations shows I don't really understand what is MWR and TWR.
I just checked my IBKR. The MWR ytd is actually slightly higher than my TWR ytd, which mystifies me even though I made big withdrawals this year. So I now realised, my understanding is wrong without knowing how the calculation is actually made in IBKR. I've got too many trades to do this calculation on my own.

 

[PrincessBunny]

Yikes, looks like your calculations shows I don't really understand what is MWR and TWR.
I just checked my IBKR. The MWR ytd is actually slightly higher than my TWR ytd, which mystifies me even though I made big withdrawals this year. So I now realised, my understanding is wrong without knowing how the calculation is actually made.

MWR is what we investors truely make from our money in the market.
TWR is just a way to sell the notion that it "removes cash inflows and outflows".

Sub-periods of negative returns will make TWR larger than MWR.
Hence, with a longer track record for professional portfolio managers, the gap between TWR and MWR actually widens over time as most are unable to beat the market index.

On the other hand, large positive returns will narrow the gap, especially so when you buy more during crashes. In such cases, MWR will outpace TWR.

The best investors tend to have a higher MWR than TWR as they buy the dips, so good job for you.

 

[Dividends Warrior]

No.

Without leverage is very impressive. Nice!
What's your top position now?

 

[PrincessBunny]

Without leverage is very impressive. Nice!
What's your top position now?

Some little known companies

Top 2 are WRB and FIX. Listed in NYSE

 

[DevilPlate]

Some little known companies

Top 2 are WRB and FIX. Listed in NYSE

Im impressed.
How u spot these hidden gems?

 

[yslvlys]

Some little known companies

Top 2 are WRB and FIX. Listed in NYSE

Can share what is the 3rd top company?

 

[dolph001]

Time weighted return is a "scam" that the finance industry uses to justify the impact of a fund manager on the performance of an investment. It tends to be higher than money weighted returns, which is the real reason why it is often used by professional portfolio managers. In fact this is the industry standard.

Just to add on, clients of finance industry also tend to withdraw during market crashes. This will also cause the MWRR to give a much lower return due to the smaller AUM base. To mitigate this, TWRR is used as the effect of cashflows are removed from the equation.

Some little known companies

Top 2 are WRB and FIX. Listed in NYSE

Care to share your top 5 holdings?

 

[DevilPlate]

Can share what is the 3rd top company?

Just to add on, clients of finance industry also tend to withdraw during market crashes. This will also cause the MWRR to give a much lower return due to the smaller AUM base. To mitigate this, TWRR is used as the effect of cashflows are removed from the equation.

Care to share your top 5 holdings?

Create a blog and show all holdings (like dividend warrior) for noobies like some of us to follow/copy.
Such a satki power stock picker with >15years impressive track record.

Maybe can charge a mthly fee as well.

 

[dolph001]

Create a blog and show all holdings (like dividend warrior) for noobies like some of us to follow/copy.
Such a satki power stock picker with >15years impressive track record.

Maybe can charge a mthly fee as well.

Are you replying to her or asking me to create a blog? My portfolio is available on stocks.cafe. iykyk

 

[CrashWire]

$1m over the years. The returns are in the previous post #4,030.

Thanks for clarifying. I think I got confused because @wutawa said in post #4,017 that you made a profit of $1.1m in "10 months".

So you occasionally sell some picks to realise the profit? That's why there's realised profit in #4,030, and the unrealised profit is just the other picks that you've been holding over time?

 

[wutawa]

Thanks for clarifying. I think I got confused because @wutawa said in post #4,017 that you made a profit of $1.1m in "10 months".

So you occasionally sell some picks to realise the profit? That's why there's realised profit in #4,030, and the unrealised profit is just the other picks that you've been holding over time?

Oops sry, I tot ytd is from 1 Jan 2025 to 18 sep 2025 (8.5 mths). Hehe

 

[highsulphur]

Oops sry, I tot ytd is from 1 Jan 2025 to 18 sep 2025 (8.5 mths). Hehe

YTD IS from exactly what you mentioned but your 1.1m profit wasn't from just this period right? Or is it

 

[wutawa]

YTD IS from exactly what you mentioned but your 1.1m profit wasn't from just this period right? Or is it

yes, the profit (not mine) is total profit over the years, not just for 2025 ytd.
my total unrealised profit just $100k

 

[highsulphur]

I have trying to track unrealised profits over the years in ibkr but I can't do it. They only show total portfolio value over time

 

[wutawa]

I have trying to track unrealised profits over the years in ibkr but I can't do it. They only show total portfolio value over time

Total unrealised profit = total portfolio value - total buy cost
It is more accurate to trace portfolio value and buy cost in sgd.
My tracking is in Google sheets.

 

[highsulphur]

Total unrealised profit = total portfolio value - total buy cost
It is more accurate to trace portfolio value and buy cost in sgd.
My tracking is in Google sheets.

i know how much is my current unrealised profits but I can't track past monthly unrealised profits

 

[DevilPlate]

i know how much is my current unrealised profits but I can't track past monthly unrealised profits

pay StockCafe but u still need to key in every buy/sell tx diligently.
They will also include all dividend collected .

 

[PrincessBunny]

Thanks for clarifying. I think I got confused because @wutawa said in post #4,017 that you made a profit of $1.1m in "10 months".

So you occasionally sell some picks to realise the profit? That's why there's realised profit in #4,030, and the unrealised profit is just the other picks that you've been holding over time?

Realised profit is from dividend and positions that I've closed.

YTD IS from exactly what you mentioned but your 1.1m profit wasn't from just this period right? Or is it

YTD is for this year alone.

I have trying to track unrealised profits over the years in ibkr but I can't do it. They only show total portfolio value over time

You can use excel for that. Investment Moats has a free stock portfolio tracker if you need a template to start with.