2 gunmen shooting at Bondi Beach

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green72

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paul02 said:


Australia - as with the rest of the world - should learn a thing or two about the history of Islam. Else they’re doomed to have a repeat of it.
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Just be wary when wanting to learn Islam. Point of contact should be Islamic Scholars.

Not sure if this Raymond Ibrahim is an Islamic Scholar. Who is he in the Islamic world.

Anyone can google or use chatgpt but reading text and understanding the context can mean differently for the common person as compared to those who studied it from other scholars based on the correct narration and context.

That's why we have many religious zealots and radicals in various religion, not only Islam, like the 2 that terrorized at Bondi Beach.
 
paul02

paul02

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green72 said:
Just be wary when wanting to learn Islam. Point of contact should be Islamic Scholars.

Not sure if this Raymond Ibrahim is an Islamic Scholar. Who is he in the Islamic world.

Anyone can google or use chatgpt but reading text and understanding the context can mean differently for the common person as compared to those who studied it from other scholars based on the correct narration and context.

That's why we have many religious zealots and radicals in various religion, not only Islam, like the 2 that terrorized at Bondi Beach.
Click to expand...
This is more about the history of Islam, you should watch it first before commenting.

Also it sounds like you're trying to control access to the religion when anybody can read the verses about disbelievers. How do you reconcile this when most scholars explains them as the Quran reads it and we see it acted out in the world today?
 
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Mechafanboy said:
Modi exporting problems to the rest of the world...
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Modi is a Hindu nationalist. The 2 guys are Muslims. Modi has stoked anti-Islam rhetoric that created a lot of Muslim hate towards India's own Muslim population. He doesn't give a damn about these guys, and one of the guy is an Australian citizen.
 
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green72

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paul02 said:
This is more about the history of Islam, you should watch it first before commenting.

Also it sounds like you're trying to control access to the religion when anybody can read the verses about disbelievers. How do you reconcile this when most scholars explains them as the Quran reads it and we see it acted out in the world today?
Click to expand...
No, Islam is narrated from the source to the Prophet by the Angel Jibril (Gabriel) and then past down through generations of scholars, recorded by who and when, from the time of the prophet to his companion without any deviations in linguistic and narration until todays scholars. Who teach who, from where and when, all documented since 1400+ years ago, got the chain of names.

That's how the knowledge is preserved. It's not about controlled access by scholars as you put it.

It's about preserving the message as previous scriptures was not preserved as intended.

Don't need to believe me, ask any scholars registered under PERGAS which is registered and affliated by MUIS.

Too many falsehood (especially online), which is one of the prophecies (from 1400 years ago) of the many signs of the End of Days in Islam.

Sharing of knowledge is caring. Chillax.
 
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ElonMuskSg

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green72 said:
Just be wary when wanting to learn Islam. Point of contact should be Islamic Scholars.

Not sure if this Raymond Ibrahim is an Islamic Scholar. Who is he in the Islamic world.

Anyone can google or use chatgpt but reading text and understanding the context can mean differently for the common person as compared to those who studied it from other scholars based on the correct narration and context.

That's why we have many religious zealots and radicals in various religion, not only Islam, like the 2 that terrorized at Bondi Beach.
Click to expand...
I agree... However even within Islamic Scholars one must also be careful to which scholar's preaching you listen to. Some Islamic Scholars/Preachers that follow Activist Salafism and Salafi-Jihadism ideologies (Found in neighbouring countries & middle east) can spread extremely radical messages. Salafi-jihadism scholars considered as good as spreading terrorism alr. This is why you occasionally see news of ICA banning certain Islamic Scholars from Indonesia or Malaysia from entering our country. I had a more interesting NS experience in the past, which part of it was to monitor the movement and activities of all these funny funny people.

If really want to learn more about Islam safely, best is to learn from Singapore's Islamic Scholars accredited by MUIS, as Islam preached in Singapore goes through a higher degree of filtering and sanitisation, arguably more than any other country in the world. Those overseas one see lesser better...
 
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green72

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This is what I meant by overwhelming falsehood online.

With regards to the Raymond Ibrahim from @paul02 post, not sure if he's (raymond ibrahim) a muslim but it's easy (no need scholar level) to confirm if he is really a muslim.

If he can't even recite 1 verse from the Quran, in arabic of course, (normally at least a few, millions today can recite cover to cover), especially Surah Al-fateha, we know we have an imposter, it's that easy yeah.
Not really asking you all but can try it on your muslim friends, they will be surprise but not offended instead be more than happy.

They can utter it instantenously.
 
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Geminiboy

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New video shows couple attacking the gunman but they later shot dead.

 
paul02

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green72 said:
No, Islam is narrated from the source to the Prophet by the Angel Jibril (Gabriel) and then past down through generations of scholars, recorded by who and when, from the time of the prophet to his companion without any deviations in linguistic and narration until todays scholars. Who teach who, from where and when, all documented since 1400+ years ago, got the chain of names.

That's how the knowledge is preserved. It's not about controlled access by scholars as you put it.

It's about preserving the message as previous scriptures was not preserved as intended.

Don't need to believe me, ask any scholars registered under PERGAS which is registered and affliated by MUIS.

Too many falsehood (especially online), which is one of the prophecies (from 1400 years ago) of the many signs of the End of Days in Islam.

Sharing of knowledge is caring. Chillax.
Click to expand...
That wasn't the point, I'm letting you know that you can't just tell people that "Point of contact should be Islamic Scholars.".

Even if I grant your position that there is no deviations, the chains you talk about is the reason we know the violent verses are authentic! Also, saying that PERGAS/MUIS may work in Singapore but not for scholars outside the region. What makes them the authority over the rest of the scholars?
 
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Mechafanboy

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Lance321 said:
Modi is a Hindu nationalist. The 2 guys are Muslims. Modi has stoked anti-Islam rhetoric that created a lot of Muslim hate towards India's own Muslim population. He doesn't give a damn about these guys, and one of the guy is an Australian citizen.
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That's the point. Modi encourages sectarianism. Extremism breeding in Modi's backyard.
 
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