warning to all investors,the folly of the STI investor

[peterchan75]

No one can escape from a total financial collapse.

Risk is like gravity. No one can avoid it. Just learn to live with it.

 

[highsulphur]

which is why sometimes please spend a bit on yourself. Can't bring that cash to the next world yo...

YOLO

 

[blengend]

Going more and more off topic ><

 

[highsulphur]

Going more and more off topic ><

Like most investment strategies, there's really no right answer. Just go with what suits you.

 

[w1rbelw1nd]

Why? Because Sg is a dependent economy. Only rises along with the giants. When rise, we rise slower, when fall, we fall as hard but usually we have mutiple source of dependant and so is resilient during any fall except when it's GFC.

Unless we got mutiple good local company that can earn a fraction of the likes of XOM, AAPL, GOOG, FB, JNJ etc... we will be a dependant one.

Haha they wouldn't want to choose to list in Singapore one, Singapore market does not attract the local tech firms also.

While I do not agree with frenchbriefs overly "enthusiastic" defense of his point, I agree that we should be wary of the riskiness of STI. I would skew a greater proportion of more portfolio in overseas asserts than in STI.

 

[limster]

While I do not agree with frenchbriefs overly "enthusiastic" defense of his point, I agree that we should be wary of the riskiness of STI. I would skew a greater proportion of more portfolio in overseas asserts than in STI.

I also agree. Don't assume that your retirement home will be in Singapore. Identify backup countries for retirement and invest accordingly. If SG property is ridiculously high at retirement, I'll go somewhere else. Maybe a cottage in a village in UK with spare change to get a BMW. (probably a diesel...)

Anyway, with ABSD still in place, also worth it to look elsewhere for 2nd property.

 

[Perisher]

I also agree. Don't assume that your retirement home will be in Singapore. Identify backup countries for retirement and invest accordingly. If SG property is ridiculously high at retirement, I'll go somewhere else. Maybe a cottage in a village in UK with spare change to get a BMW. (probably a diesel...)

Anyway, with ABSD still in place, also worth it to look elsewhere for 2nd property.

got any lobang for property?

 

[Futureskid]

Mod, please close this thread. Sgx CEO and govt will not like to see this sort of thread getting too popular and leads to a spiral effect of retail investors avoiding sg market, a bearish market sentiment leading to a bearish fundamental. They are already having a hard time getting ppls interest to pile their money here, it's also for the good of those who already invested in sg market, so that more ppl can buy higher. Confidence in market is important.
Furthermore, there is no meaning to compare the performance of both indices, just like comparing different stocks.

 

[bibu00]

Mod, please close this thread. Sgx CEO and govt will not like to see this sort of thread getting too popular and leads to a spiral effect of retail investors avoiding sg market, a bearish market sentiment leading to a bearish fundamental. They are already having a hard time getting ppls interest to pile their money here, it's also for the good of those who already invested in sg market, so that more ppl can buy higher. Confidence in market is important.
Furthermore, there is no meaning to compare the performance of both indices, just like comparing different stocks.

Woah woah, don't call for a ban because you don't like what you read.
There's much to learn from this discussion with the experts here. Ts has an legit argument.

If the underlying businesses behind STI has a strong business model, it will naturally continue growing and attract investors. Some doomsayer on hwz won't change the fact that a strong business is strong.

 

[zhooge]

i kinda agree with TS that maybe sti is not gonna bring us where we should with the risk we are taking

equity risk for 2+% dividend yield and almost zero capital gains doesn't seem worth it.

Do you even beat inflation?

i don't believe all index are made equal so i don't believe the laggards will eventually "catch up"

i think stocks move mainly because of one thing, growth.

Unless local companies stop the habit of hiring family members and ex military ppl into key positions I find

it hard to believe that we are hiring the best for the job to compete in this global economy where growth is

key. You guys can argue all you want, but can u find me even one financially free singaporean who

invested in our index mainly? Isn't that our goal in investing?

If not why don't stick with bonds if only to preserve capital.

Single stock yes several multimillionaires/billionaire, our index, definitely not. Unless you are already

having a good paying job or inheritance/savings, investing in STI mainly long term i think its just gonna

make u remain poor or slightly above average at best.

I hope im wrong of course

 

[Shiny Things]

Frenchbrief highlighted a very important point here and i think it has great repercussions on the global economy. No one really knows what will happen when the qe bubble bursts. The usd has lost over 95% buying power over the last 100 years due to inflation and fiat money leverage. I think sooner or later the whole system will have to collapse and we need to restart from scratch again using gold.

If there was a "QE bubble" it would have burst in the US already. The US hasn't conducted any QE in a year, and markets are up since it ended. Don't read so much Zero Hedge; it's a hazard to your wealth.

 

[Asphodeli]

The US market is livelier than the SGX for sure, but do remember that GFC can happen. Don't forget the Pan-Electric crisis, Black Monday, and even the Eurozone crisis as well. When a financial crisis hits, you're going to see massive losses, even in the STI.

Also, I don't think it's fair to compare the S&P500 with the STI, as the laws and cultural norms are different in each country. The primary reason for investing in the local exchange is "home ground advantage", as these are the companies which you recognize is a local company and have a vested interest in Singapore's future (well, somewhat...if you don't count on Temasek selling Singapore assets, LOL). Also, it is easier to gauge the feel on Shenton Way than on Wall Street, whether you're living in Punggol or Joo Koon.

 

[w1rbelw1nd]

Anyway, where is the proof that the SGD long term returns of sti is substantially and consistently lower than the s&p500?

 

[wts2013]

hahaha, about 2 mths ago, we did an exercise to calculate the "real" performance of STI for the past 20 years and someone did the same for S&P 500, read the results here:

http://forums.hardwarezone.com.sg/96755865-post91.html

http://forums.hardwarezone.com.sg/96774167-post131.html

http://forums.hardwarezone.com.sg/96778572-post138.html

hahaha

 

[peterchan75]

Comparing STI to S&P500 is like comparing apple to orange. E.g. 30 components to 500, market cap S$5B-70B vs US$3B-650B and not to mention about company profiles. If it's your cash then you have choice but if it's CPF then only SGX, unit trust.

 

[Bedokian]

IMO, to view our local market as a whole, we should look at the FTSE ST All-Share Index instead, which includes the 30 STI companies as well as other mid caps and small caps. Unfortunately there is no ETF to track this.

 

[snakey256]

in the event of financial meltdown, it will affected globally since markets around the world are closely connected. A good example will be Asia china and West US, both are top 10 trade partners. We are globalization era leh..

 

[hogrider88]

why care?

my portfolio in equities is 50:50 STI and All-World Index (includes many top US companies)

whoever wins, I win.

one thing for sure SGX commission too exp, 1 lot is 100 shares now but no changes to minimum brokerage, wth?

 

[peterchan75]

If it's cash, then you might want to think again. BUT the past may not equal to future.

Here is what TS is griping about... a mere 10% for STI for the past 4 yrs vs 60% for S&P500.

 

[w1rbelw1nd]

If it's cash, then you might want to think again. BUT the past may not equal to future.

Here is what TS is griping about... a mere 10% for STI for the past 4 yrs vs 60% for S&P500.

In the grand scheme of looking at investing in sti for retirement, is it really relevant is 4 years of return?