CPF Accounts Value thread

[verilyverily]

Flexibility vs single purpose efficiency

I have an idea what I'll probably do when the time comes with respect to CPF LIFE starting age, participation level, and payout plan choice, but I'm certainly not firmly wedded to that idea and am actively seeking ways to maximize the range of choices I'll have.

and so we appreciate there are CPF members who prefer flexibility depending on the prevailing external and personal situation, at the expense of some loss in efficiency/efficacy.

Thanks to all for the great inputs.

 

[maple96]

You cannot really predict that and shouldn't, not now.

....Or some combination.

I'm really fascinated by all these grossly premature decisions. I have an idea what I'll probably do when the time comes with respect to CPF LIFE starting age, participation level, and payout plan choice, but I'm certainly not firmly wedded to that idea and am actively seeking ways to maximize the range of choices I'll have.

So now u are telling hwzoners u are not "fixated" on starting payout at 70 and not choosing escalating plan at 70? U are keeping your options open cos of some changes in US tax regulations?

I repeat one more time, insurance plays with your greed and fear, u have extreme greed and fear, u listed so many if then else, so u were so "fixated" on starting payout at 70 and choosing escalating plan in the past, recommending it to all hwzoners here regardless of their situation.

As a US citizen, u are different from we Singaporeans here! U have additional considerations which will strongly influence your decision and choice of CPF Life Plans, payout start age, etc A change in those regulations will sway u here and there when u reach your decision age/time.

A tax advantage or disadvantage will make u change your plans, maybe u will cashout before 65 by giving up your PR, or maybe u will delay till 70 to cashout to earn mat returns, all to offset the tax benefit or "dis-benefit" which will affect u as US citizen. Extreme greed and fear

 

[BBCWatcher]

So now u are telling hwzoners u are not "fixated" on starting payout at 70 and not choosing escalating plan at 70?

I have repeatedly explained how I haven't made any firm decision, and I don't need to make any decision until as late as age 70. Why would I make a decision now?

If I were to make a starting age, payout plan, and participation level decision today, I have an idea what decisions I'd make. But they're not cast in stone, that's for sure.

U are keeping your options open cos of some changes in US tax regulations?

Sure, that's one possible factor, not necessarily the most important.

I repeat one more time, insurance plays with your greed and fear, u have extreme greed and fear....

Oh, my word, you have it so exactly backwards.

....u listed so many if then else, so u were so "fixated" on starting payout at 70 and choosing escalating plan in the past, recommending it to all hwzoners here regardless of their situation.

No, I haven't done that either. If I'm to be accused of something, at least quote what I've actually written and with proper context. I repeatedly explain the important assumptions involved in particular recommendations.

As a US citizen, u are different from we Singaporeans here!

Yes! And you know this fact because I told you, and I repeatedly point it out when it's relevant.

Another important difference is that Singaporeans typically don't enjoy nice, inflation-linked, lifetime retirement annuities from other high quality sovereigns, and CPF LIFE even at ERS level is a rather modest life annuity by global developed country standards, especially for such an expensive place to retire (Singapore). CPF LIFE is certainly never lavish, so the arguments that you can buy "too much" of it ring hollow with me in most cases. The rather low absolute level of CPF LIFE payout choices is an important consideration, too, if that's your only longevity insurance. Meaning, buy up, other things being equal.

Another important difference is that Singaporeans in Singapore tend to live longer than Americans in the United States. That means their need for longevity insurance is greater, other things being equal.

Aren't these differences fun?

 

[tmkedmw]

Decision timeliness, not timeless decision.

We don't know what we don't know as there are unknown unknowns in the future, to paraphrase Donald Rumsfeld.

 

[maple96]

we share and discuss here, so those that are due know and understand. Those who are not due yet, can wait as there are usually changes to be expected.

those who are due cannot afford to be blur and not know what options they have before it is too late.

I discuss for those who are due, not those who are not. Those who are not can tell their own stories

we live with what we have, ren bi ren chi si ren, we are Singaporeans!

 

[henrylbh]

Also depends on when you top up your RA. If you top up at 79, I guess, you're better off getting AMP.

Whether you top up at 79 or earlier, you get what you put it, no less or more AMP. AMP is not part of CPF Life but merely a drawdown of money you top up into RA after payout started.

 

[henrylbh]

Thanks BBC; I got that now. The AMP is related to top ups post 65 and beyond.

Suggest you check with CPF. I think AMP is for top ups after payout started, anytime between 65 and 70.

 

[henrylbh]

If u topup after payout starts, I would prefer AMP over buying additional CPF Life. I think CPF will write to u on the options and when to start. Need to read the rules in detail, need time to locate it.

I am with you on that. Only I not sure whether one got option on when to commence AMP or defer indefinitely.

 

[JuniorLion]

Whether you top up at 79 or earlier, you get what you put it, no less or more AMP. AMP is not part of CPF Life but merely a drawdown of money you top up into RA after payout started.

The money you put into RA after CPF Life started (i.e. AMP) will get interest no?

 

[henrylbh]

The money you put into RA after CPF Life started (i.e. AMP) will get interest no?

Whatever in RA will earn interest accordingly and will be part of your bequest.

 

[JuniorLion]

Whatever in RA will earn interest accordingly and will be part of your bequest.

So if you top up RA after CPF LIFE started, it will earn interest, and the AMP will start the next year. During the AMP period, it will continue to earn interest right?

 

[SKenny]

Whatever in RA will earn interest accordingly and will be part of your bequest.

Not necessarily.

 

[SKenny]

So if you top up RA after CPF LIFE started, it will earn interest, and the AMP will start the next year. During the AMP period, it will continue to earn interest right?

Yes.

10char.

 

[SKenny]

Skenny, I wasn't aware of this. If there is a link about this information, appreciate if you could share. Thanks!

On a personal note, I topped up my wife's RA account via Cash to ERS at age 56, (a year after she selected CPFLife Basic upon turning 55 and a small premium was deducted). It has been 3 years since the cash top up, does it mean that the cash top up will eventually be streamed as AMP until it runs out at age 90? Appreciate your input. Thanks

I spoke to CPF at length, on this matter and not from their website.

I have used 65 age interchangable with CPFLife withdrawal age, as it is what I intend to do. The AMP will auto kick in one year after your withdrawal age IF you do not do anything after you top up post your withdrawal age.

As for your case, I believe your wife may be on ERS due to your latest top-up but I am not 100% sure. Best you call CPF to confirm. In any case your wife have until her withdrawal age to decide what she want to do with her top-up, i.e. either to buy more CPFLife or go for the AMP (default option).

 

[henrylbh]

I spoke to CPF at length, on this matter and not from their website.

I have used 65 age interchangable with CPFLife withdrawal age, as it is what I intend to do. The AMP will auto kick in one year after your withdrawal age IF you do not do anything after you top up post your withdrawal age.

As for your case, I believe your wife may be on ERS due to your latest top-up but I am not 100% sure. Best you call CPF to confirm. In any case your wife have until her withdrawal age to decide what she want to do with her top-up, i.e. either to buy more CPFLife or go for the AMP (default option).

If I remember correctly, if you top to ERS you cannot subsequently opt for BRS. Whole amount will be committed to CPF life. But if top up is after payout started, the amount will remain in RA to be payout as AMP (over remaining years to 90 as someone mentioned here) or as life payout if you opt for that which involve deduction of annuity premium.

 

[henrylbh]

Not necessarily.

If cause it depends on what is left in RA when up lorry.

 

[JuniorLion]

Not necessarily.

If cause it depends on what is left in RA when up lorry.

I am only wondering if there're benefits to top up to get AMP if it's not earning any interest, and the interest also not streaming out to you as payouts.

 

[maple96]

I am only wondering if there're benefits to top up to get AMP if it's not earning any interest, and the interest also not streaming out to you as payouts.

"rubbish" creates more "rubbish"

Under the Basic Plan, all monies in RA will earn 4+2%. It will always earn the extra 2% so long your combined balances (CPF Life premium + OA/SA/MA/RA) are not zero. If this is true, there will definitely be some bequest.

Since RA earns 4+2% interest, any topup after payout start will stream out as AMP if u did not opt for additional CPF Life cover.

With AMP, one day your RA might be zero ( if your combined balances = zero), of course bequest will be zero then.

 

[maple96]

As for your case, I believe your wife may be on ERS due to your latest top-up but I am not 100% sure. Best you call CPF to confirm. In any case your wife have until her withdrawal age to decide what she want to do with her top-up, i.e. either to buy more CPFLife or go for the AMP (default option).

So long u topup before payout starts, it becomes ERS and becomes part of CPF Life, u do not have any other option to choose unless u exit CPF Life.

 

[maple96]

Q What happens when there are inflows into my Retirement Account after I have started receiving my monthly payout?

A If there are inflows into your Retirement Account (RA) after you have started receiving your monthly payout, there are two options you can consider:

You can leave the money in your RA. In July, we will automatically pay this money to you as additional monthly payout (AMP). We will tell you the exact revised monthly payout you will receive two to three months before we make the adjustments. This payment will stop when the money in your RA runs out.

Note: If you are under CPF LIFE Escalating Plan, the AMP will not increase by 2% every year in the month that the first payout was made.

You may choose to buy another annuity to give you a higher annuity payout to last you for life. To buy an additional annuity, you may: