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BBCWatcher

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It's unfortunate a CPF thread has devolved into a whole life insurance thread, but I'll make one comment since it's an underappreciated problem with all whole life policies: cash flow risks.

Let's suppose you're comparing a $250/month whole life policy with a $45/month term life policy. (The numbers don't necessarily need to be exact, but let's just go with this example.) "Buy Term, Invest the Rest" (BTIR) means you pay $45/month in premiums and save/invest $205/month.

OK, now there's a family emergency of some kind (practically any kind), and that $205/month of savings flow would be really, really nice to use for emergency purposes since you've got some cash flow issues. No problem, you can. The problem with a whole life policy, though, is that if you try to skip a premium you lose not only much, most, or even all of the high cost "investment," you also lose your insurance protection(s). It's a bundled product.

OK, so what do you do to keep paying your whole life premium? Well, you could take out a 12 month personal loan at 6.4+% interest, or incur credit card debt at 20+% interest. With some whole life policies you can even borrow against them at, say, 6% interest. (As one Prudential client did.) But these are all awful choices compared to just suspending your $205/month of savings/investment flow if you absolutely must.

That said, you have to be a "reasonably responsible" person for BTIR. If you're just going to blow that $205/month on, for example, blow, then maybe whole life insurance is the best you can do to force yourself to save something, even at a high cost. Some people need the power of a premium bill to help them save -- and the risk of losing their insurance protections if they don't.

What also seems to be happening in practice is that so many people are loading up on high cost whole life policies and then not buying insurance they really do need (notably Disability Income Insurance). That's because they've got a certain insurance budget available (they feel, which makes a certain amount of sense), and then when the premiums rise to fill that particular budget, they're done. That's bad, too, because it means they've got high cost "investing," inadequate insurance protections, and cash flow risks. Not good!

It's generally not a good idea to bundle what doesn't need to be bundled. Do you want your electricity service to end if you cannot pay your Netflix bill? No, of course not, so you probably shouldn't bundle your electric and Netflix bills if somebody's offering to do that unless there's a damn good reason (a really nice offer that you can safely afford).
 

maple96

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Back to CPF Topic

I have new ideas, so I shall share.

CPF Life also has BI. Each CPF Life Plan also has a guaranteed and non-guaranteed component. So u must make sure u know what is the non-guaranteed component when evaluating the BIs
 

maple96

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Last year, I purposely made VC of more than 37740 to take advantage of credit card rebates.

Luckily I did that cos this year they close the loophole.

I still managed to squeeze in some credit card rebates this year before they close :s13:
 

BBCWatcher

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Last year, I purposely made VC of more than 37740 to take advantage of credit card rebates.

Luckily I did that cos this year they close the loophole.

I still managed to squeeze in some credit card rebates this year before they close :s13:
As far as I know you can still use a Diners Club card to make CPF contributions. You won't earn any Diners Club points, but at least you can "float" the contribution to the next credit or charge card billing cycle and earn a little more bank interest on the float. You also need to be careful about month end deadlines (for CPF interest earning) since Diners Club-based contributions aren't credited as quickly as some other contribution/top up channels, such as PayNow QR. And you still get your one airport lounge visit per year with a Diners Club card, although that's not too exciting during the COVID-19 pandemic.
 

yongsaver

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I have no issue with it turning into insurance topic. I actually wanted to change the title to "CPF cum Insurances" but I can't find anyway to change it. So long u guys and gals feel comfortable all is well :)

Or would u prefer a separate thread? Feel free to suggest

kaypohji say got few insurance agents here wor. maybe need to ask them? :s13:
 

maple96

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As far as I know you can still use a Diners Club card to make CPF contributions. You won't earn any Diners Club points, but at least you can "float" the contribution to the next credit or charge card billing cycle and earn a little more bank interest on the float. You also need to be careful about month end deadlines (for CPF interest earning) since Diners Club-based contributions aren't credited as quickly as some other contribution/top up channels, such as PayNow QR. And you still get your one airport lounge visit per year with a Diners Club card, although that's not too exciting during the COVID-19 pandemic.

U always dunno what u dunno :s13:

dun waste people's time here !
 
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maple96

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Financial Planning 101

Most people should learn some important lessons on Financial Planning 101 from COVID.

1. Always have an emergency fund of at least 6 mths
2. Dun spend beyond your means
3. Review your budget, focus on essentials/necessities, cut other expenses, tighten your belt in view of recession/crisis
4. Just some pointers here

The same applies when deciding how much u should put into CPF, after considering the above. It is a long term commitment, except for those nearing 55 or above 55.

Insurance is also a long term commitment, dun be greedy and over commit on premiums that u cannot continue to afford to pay as there is heavy penalty/loss. This is one of the root cause of most problems besides not taking care of Financial Planning 101.

Learn to provide for contingencies, just like the gov did, dig into reserves (your emergency fund) when circumstances require. Always have a plan B.
 

PhantomCarlos

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Hi all!

I have been regularly doing $7,000 topup to my SA since I started working. I have done some calculations and know that my CPF SA will hit the estimated FRS at the age of 39. Subsequently, my salary contributions and interest for SA should then be able to keep up with the yearly increase of FRS. That would mean that I am unable to do $7,000 topup yearly for tax relief.

My question is: Should I invest my CPF SA so that I free up some space for me to continue my yearly $7,000 topup for tax relief? Assuming my tax bracket stay at around 11.5% to 15%. I have also been topping up $15,300 to my SRS every year.

Thanks in advance for all the help!
 

oceanicmanta

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@PhantomCarlos - investing SA will not "free up space" for topping up

for tax relief, can consider top up parents RA or spouse SA ? (with conditions)
 
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maple96

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@PhantomCarlos - investing SA will not "free up space" for topping up

If u think deep enough, Yes to some extent, degree level thinking, not primary school level logic as someone else always use and post :s13:

But is it worth investing with SA now? Unless he has a secret to earn more than 4% pa compounded. Maybe when the stock market bull is back?

I actually earned more than 4% pa compounded on SA investment, but that is history not easy to repeat.

But your answer is correct.
 
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terence2112

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If u think deep enough, Yes to some extent, degree level thinking, not primary school level logic as someone else always use and post :s13:

But is it worth investing with SA now? Unless he has a secret to earn more than 4% pa compounded. Maybe when the stock market bull is back?

I actually earned more than 4% pa compounded on SA investment, but that is history not easy to repeat.

But your answer is correct.

How so? Just curious? I want to think deep enough as well.
 

BBCWatcher

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@PhantomCarlos - investing SA will not "free up space" for topping up
Hypothetically you could invest Special Account dollars in something dreadful that loses a lot of money, at least temporarily, and then you'd have more room for top ups with tax relief.

I don't think you should do that. :s22:
 

maple96

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Hypothetically you could invest Special Account dollars in something dreadful that loses a lot of money, at least temporarily, and then you'd have more room for top ups with tax relief.

I don't think you should do that. :s22:

Now u see, worst than primary school level logic :s13:
 

Andrew833

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My opinion, SA is best to keep inside CPF and sit for compound interest.
SA acc is restricted in term of investment.
 

maple96

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I have no issue with it turning into insurance topic. I actually wanted to change the title to "CPF cum Insurances" but I can't find anyway to change it. So long u guys and gals feel comfortable all is well :)

Or would u prefer a separate thread? Feel free to suggest

Peppermint7, I think I have done all I can to help u steer it back to CPF, sorry on my part straying it into insurance.

I will stop from here on both topics.

If u would like to change the title, just pm the moderator/admin.
 

elf108

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My opinion, SA is best to keep inside CPF and sit for compound interest.
SA acc is restricted in term of investment.

For me I transfer OA to SA to meet FRS. Tax relief can use other means. Compound interest is much more than the savings from 7k relief.
 
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