(GPGT)Espresso machine hoot

chikyblink

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http://livestream.com/worldcoffee/events/5653864

Check out our very own Regina Tay from Stranger's Reunion in the recent WBC. Very interesting concept of using ultrasonication.

Also this year's champion Berg Wu from Taiwan, he actually chill his portafilters before pulling shots, said to preserve the floral flavours in the coffee.

Ben Put from Canada also very interesting. After pulling espresso shots, he puts them into a vacuum sealer i think? Removing the carbonic acid and thus reducing the bitterness.

Also I notice quite a number of them using the OCD this year.
 

sohzai

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I'm not 100% sure about the science behind this, but I believe you don't need O2 to release CO2.

The carbon dioxide is trapped inside the bean when it's roasted, so it will release by itself over time after the roasting.

The bulk of the carbon dioxide is released within first 24hrs from roasting, so assuming the shop doesn't weigh and pack immediately after roasting (usually they would let the beans degas first), the weight in the retail pack shouldn't differ too much from the stated weight on the bag.
To be honest. I don't understand too. Lol. But I still stick by my current logic that lesser o2 in my vacuvin will allow the beans to last longer before getting stale. Beans release co2 whether or not they are in vacuum. I don't see why vacuum won't help by cutting down on o2.

Sent from LGE LG-H961N using GAGT
 

sohzai

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http://livestream.com/worldcoffee/events/5653864

Check out our very own Regina Tay from Stranger's Reunion in the recent WBC. Very interesting concept of using ultrasonication.

Also this year's champion Berg Wu from Taiwan, he actually chill his portafilters before pulling shots, said to preserve the floral flavours in the coffee.

Ben Put from Canada also very interesting. After pulling espresso shots, he puts them into a vacuum sealer i think? Removing the carbonic acid and thus reducing the bitterness.

Also I notice quite a number of them using the OCD this year.
Interesting chilling of portafilter... We could try!

Actually, what is ocd huh?

Sent from LGE LG-H961N using GAGT
 

calbay

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Actually, I don't do distribution at all and had never had problem with extraction, making 300 to 800 extractions a day.
 

calbay

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To be honest. I don't understand too. Lol. But I still stick by my current logic that lesser o2 in my vacuvin will allow the beans to last longer before getting stale. Beans release co2 whether or not they are in vacuum. I don't see why vacuum won't help by cutting down on o2.

Sent from LGE LG-H961N using GAGT
It will slow down the oxidation.
However note that the volatile aromatic notes are sucked out as well.
I won't recommend that. Suggest get what you can finish in a week unless the packaging is really well done.

In any case, it's important to tune the grinder to match the machine, and the current condition of the beans.
If you are not a fussy drinker, and not after delicate flowery notes, maybe it's alright.

Another important note, many 1 way valves don't work.
If you squash a bag, and it grows back in size quickly, something is wrong there, unless it's still degassing massively, which should not.
Something roasters won't want consumers to know.
 
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Koma75

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I am selling off my Bezzera BZ13 Push button and BB005 grinder. Bought in Dec 2015, still under warranty. Condition 9.5/10, selling cos of low usage.

Will throw in some accessories, such as bottomless filter holder, SS tamper set etc, Can PM me if interested. Thanks
 

prozaizxc

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I think it might be better if you can take a few photos of your coffee puck - pre-tamp, tamped, post-extraction, so that we can have a better idea.

Without looking at those, I can also suggest to try a longer pre-infusion (try 8-10 secs at a much lower pressure) as it definitely helped to minimize a lot of channeling for me.

Alright, took photos of the coffee puck pre tamped tamped and post extraction! Also included a photo of my grouphead and after taking that photo, I realised that my rubber gasket may be worn out as there is a little golden color the can be seen beneath the rubber gasket. Also, I realised that at the sides of the PF drips of espresso is coming out sometimes during extraction which is why i think the gasket is worn out as well.

http://imgur.com/a/kOUUo

I distribute my grinds by tapping the side of the portafilter about 3-4 times while its filling up so that the middle and the bottom of the grounds in the PF are even and not just the top part if i tap after the whole PF is filled

PS: Idk how to upload photos so ill just leave the link to the album there
 
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CrazyBlue

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Hi all, was thinking of making lattes at home and somehow thought of getting an espresso machine. Read through quite a number of pages already but - confusing :s22:

Googled some websites - was recommending breville, but after checking the prices and also in HWZ, it seems it wasn't really favoured and other reviews seem to say it isn't very durable?

I wasn't thinking of spending more than 1k but i realised I rather spend more and have something that spoils after 2 years. So it seems Bezzera or Expobar is favoured here?

Is there any particular model I should be looking at..? Like BZ10, BZ13? Expobar? My barista friend seems to favour double boiler over HX. And E61 grouphead? TIA!
 

ArtURtlE

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Hi all, was thinking of making lattes at home and somehow thought of getting an espresso machine. Read through quite a number of pages already but - confusing :s22:

Googled some websites - was recommending breville, but after checking the prices and also in HWZ, it seems it wasn't really favoured and other reviews seem to say it isn't very durable?

I wasn't thinking of spending more than 1k but i realised I rather spend more and have something that spoils after 2 years. So it seems Bezzera or Expobar is favoured here?

Is there any particular model I should be looking at..? Like BZ10, BZ13? Expobar? My barista friend seems to favour double boiler over HX. And E61 grouphead? TIA!

Hi I bought the breville infuser and smart grinder about 3-4 yrs ago . Espresso shots are decent . minimal cleaning req and no breakdowns before, still gg strong .Somehow I do feel the coffee taste more similar to the ones I drank in Aus for some weird reason ( prob due to the pid) my lattes and flat white turn out nicely done , so for au400 bucks I would say it's a good buy :p
 

testerjp

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Is there any particular model I should be looking at..? Like BZ10, BZ13? Expobar? My barista friend seems to favour double boiler over HX. And E61 grouphead? TIA!

That was what I thought at first.

There was this video, where the creator of home barista forum actually commented and did a live taste test with somoene, which he thinks that HX creates clearer notes, HX start up faster for sure.
When i bought the BZ13 that time, tried the double boiler side by side.
The coffee done from the BZ13 taste a little brighter so bought the BZ13.
Got one guy selling Bezzera BZ13 in the previous page.

I claimed PIC for my company so also bought the Bezzera Strega, that is even better.
I ever used a 60% robusta blend, it also makes it taste pretty smooth.
 
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embrosiur

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Alright, took photos of the coffee puck pre tamped tamped and post extraction! Also included a photo of my grouphead and after taking that photo, I realised that my rubber gasket may be worn out as there is a little golden color the can be seen beneath the rubber gasket. Also, I realised that at the sides of the PF drips of espresso is coming out sometimes during extraction which is why i think the gasket is worn out as well.

http://imgur.com/a/kOUUo

I distribute my grinds by tapping the side of the portafilter about 3-4 times while its filling up so that the middle and the bottom of the grounds in the PF are even and not just the top part if i tap after the whole PF is filled

PS: Idk how to upload photos so ill just leave the link to the album there

Hi, I see a print of the shower screen on your puck. The print on the right of the puck is quite deep compared to the left. I see that your temp before extraction looks even from your photo. I assume the puck is the same height from the filter basket ridge after temping, but you may want to validate this. A deeper print can suggest that there are more grounds in that area (puck height higher on one side compared to the other). This leads to more restriction and lower flow on the right. Perhaps you can consider reducing your dose until you do not see a print of your shower screen on your puck.
 
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Radeon

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The shower screen print doesn't look that deep though, try locking in the portafilter and taking it out pre brew to see if there's an impression. Sometimes the impression is from the backpressure when the exhaust valve is opened.
 

calbay

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Alright, took photos of the coffee puck pre tamped tamped and post extraction! Also included a photo of my grouphead and after taking that photo, I realised that my rubber gasket may be worn out as there is a little golden color the can be seen beneath the rubber gasket. Also, I realised that at the sides of the PF drips of espresso is coming out sometimes during extraction which is why i think the gasket is worn out as well.

http://imgur.com/a/kOUUo

I distribute my grinds by tapping the side of the portafilter about 3-4 times while its filling up so that the middle and the bottom of the grounds in the PF are even and not just the top part if i tap after the whole PF is filled

PS: Idk how to upload photos so ill just leave the link to the album there
Actually it doesn't matter how much you distribute if you did not tamp evenly.

After tamping, check if the coffee bed is even. There's a line in your basket, check if it is parallel. The tamper you are using, should not be too long. To allow you to feel the rim of the portafilter while you are pressing to know it's even.



On the other hand, needs to look at how many ml it is coming out per second to comment further. Better still, also get a video up.
 

Lazy_Tiger

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It will slow down the oxidation.
However note that the volatile aromatic notes are sucked out as well.

I don't think the vacuvin will suck out the aromatic notes significantly enough for people to notice. I have yet to test but if getting oxygen out (by creating a partial vacuum or replacing oxygen with inert gasses), it should be better if oxidisation does indeed degrade the beans and spoils the flavours.

In any case, it's important to tune the grinder to match the machine, and the current condition of the beans.
If you are not a fussy drinker, and not after delicate flowery notes, maybe it's alright.

I find tuning grinders have nothing to do with getting the best aromas. Over extracted and under extracted coffee brewed using good quality beans at the peak after their roasting period will still smell great. Dialing in grinders is to get a good balance of taste flavours (sour, bitter, sweet) rather than olfaction. I find the best method to enjoy complex aromas, is to brew with a french press or just do cupping.

Another important note, many 1 way valves don't work.
If you squash a bag, and it grows back in size quickly, something is wrong there, unless it's still degassing massively, which should not.
Something roasters won't want consumers to know.

I agree. the 1 way valve and ziplock is not perfect. The bag expands because the compressed bag will decompress by itself and still sucks air back in. after sealing the bag i keep the bag folded and compressed with a rubber band.
 

chikyblink

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I agree. the 1 way valve and ziplock is not perfect. The bag expands because the compressed bag will decompress by itself and still sucks air back in. after sealing the bag i keep the bag folded and compressed with a rubber band.

What about solid containers with 1 way valve? Like the bean cellars from LynWeber. Are they better then bags since you can't compress them.
 

Lazy_Tiger

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Hi all, was thinking of making lattes at home and somehow thought of getting an espresso machine. Read through quite a number of pages already but - confusing :s22:

Googled some websites - was recommending breville, but after checking the prices and also in HWZ, it seems it wasn't really favoured and other reviews seem to say it isn't very durable?

I wasn't thinking of spending more than 1k but i realised I rather spend more and have something that spoils after 2 years. So it seems Bezzera or Expobar is favoured here?

Is there any particular model I should be looking at..? Like BZ10, BZ13? Expobar? My barista friend seems to favour double boiler over HX. And E61 grouphead? TIA!

Do you drink milk drinks or espressos most of the time?

If you drink espressos mostly and are very particular about fine tuning your espresso to get the balance you want then get a double boiler or a pid controlled single boiler if you want to save up and don't make milk drinks often.

If you make milk drinks most of the time and you are not particular about your espressos then a HX is ok.

if you have the money just get a double boiler. Brew boiler should be PID controlled.

I have used a single boiler with no PID. a double boiler with pid and a lever machine which you guesstimate the temp by touching the brew group and using a inaccurate temp strip. Have played around with a hx too.

If you want convenience and want to play arond with all kinds of light and dark roasted coffee just get a pided double boiler. It will save you the trouble of guesstimating with the HX flush routine

Some people say HX taste better, more clarity, better acidity etc etc. I think this is purely anecdotal...You can achieve pretty much the same results by lowering or increasing the temp of the pid. Home barista stuff must be read with an open but cautious mind.

In pro circles people are only starting to make sense of pressure or flow profiling and how this affects the taste profile.

In comparision, temperature profiling (i.e. stable temp vs a variable temp profile) is a relative mystery at this time. What is known is that increasing temp also increases your extraction rate which increases both the extraction of bitter AND sweet AND sour solubles. But because we tend to perceive bitter chemicals more easily increase temps to high will make it seem that the coffee is bitter. But extreme acidity is also there making the coffee very unpleasant.

The key is to hit the sweet spot in temperature, particle size, extraction rate so that the taste profile is balanced and pleasant. Sweetness, acidity and controlled bitterness is in harmony.

E61 grouphead has relatively stable temps at idle and also has mechanical preinfusion (only for true e61 groups). Gentle pressure ramp up (a kind of preinfusion) helps to mitigate mistakes in distribution in tamping. Long preinfusion (low flow or low pressure) allows you to grind very fine without choking the extraction which is especially useful for light roasted coffee.

A flow restrictor (linea mini) also helps with a gradual preinfusion.

But at the end of the day just get what is within your budget after educating yourself on the options.


need to get a good grinder too.
 

Lazy_Tiger

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What about solid containers with 1 way valve? Like the bean cellars from LynWeber. Are they better then bags since you can't compress them.

The vacuum that can be created with the vacuvin pumps are only partial vacuums. If the container is huge and the beans are little then there is still quite alot of air (and oxygen) inside the container. I don't have data how much air left in the vacuvin after using the small handpump but my guess is there is still quite alot of air especially if there are little beans and handpumps are not powerful.

This is why i just compress the bag so that there is as little space (and air) as possible. The bean cellars seems small enough to fit one dose just nice with minimal air inside so i guess it should be somewhat similar to a compressed bag.

Are you still roasting your beans?

so many options available online now for mail order...

cafebond
joe curious
hook coffee
perk coffee
Alma
 
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