(GPGT)Espresso machine hoot

[chanvh]

It's actually a bit of a leapfrog for me here. Where I'm on the same page with what has been suggested. So, yes while I wanted the entry level machines, I had put some thoughts into Lelit Bianca and Bezzera E61 heads.

I don't mind doing the work on minor barista tasks such as weighing the beans a little and practicing some frothing so I can please the missus. The only thing is that with limited counter space I think I may need either reno my kitchen or basically get rid of the microwave unit altogether.

 

[codling]

How about lelit mara x for 2k budget?

 

[vbhelper]

hijack abit
which standalone milk frother to recommend?

 

[chobo_kel]

It's actually a bit of a leapfrog for me here. Where I'm on the same page with what has been suggested. So, yes while I wanted the entry level machines, I had put some thoughts into Lelit Bianca and Bezzera E61 heads.

I don't mind doing the work on minor barista tasks such as weighing the beans a little and practicing some frothing so I can please the missus. The only thing is that with limited counter space I think I may need either reno my kitchen or basically get rid of the microwave unit altogether.

I’m using the Breville Infuser and Dose Control grinder. Bought it from Oz a couple of years ago on holiday. Nearly half the price as compared to Singapore. I think the espresso quality I’m getting is pretty decent. You’ll soon realise that it’s not easy to get consistent results without doing measurements. Over time I started adding more processes (weighing, timing and distribution) to my routine to get a more consistent result, not to mention having to ‘dial in’ the coffee every time I swap beans. But I enjoy the process

I wouldn’t get a Breville in Singapore though because of the prices...

 

[nubbyyy]

How about lelit mara x for 2k budget?

I second this. I got a MaraX for about 2 months now, waiting for my Niche Zero to arrive. MaraX gives you flexibility to adjust brew temperatures for different roasts (e.g. higher temp for light roasts) in a very user-friendly way. Looks good and is small in size.

That said if you have the budget go for the Bianca. Looks even better plus you can do sexy profiling or plumb in. You may not need/want to use it now but.. future-proofing

Ordered Six Four Apache. Came damn fast, received today (1 Jan) with roast date 31 Dec ?!

Should have let the bean to breath a few more days, but ran out of bean so made a cup immediately. Quite a nice blend for its price, will become my go to staple most likely.

Ordered a few different bags from Paksong as they had a year end sale. Hope they are great as its insane for its price ($5.90 ish for 250g Laos Paksong's own farm).

I just ordered two bags too. Six Four is just great value. I use Paksong for cold brew as it's so cheap.

 

[chanvh]

Thanks Everyone, I begin to see very practical advise in terms of the machine purchase. To be honest I believe I need to really consider my options in the coming months ahead before March hits. Thats not very far away to be honest. In this case, it would be beneficial to think of my options as below:

I like the below for machines that touches the ranges between 2K - 3K range. It is a serious consideration since it now becomes more of a prized item at home rather than any mere appliance. Price decreases down the list.

1. Lelit Bianca
2. Lelit MaraX (with wooden knobs, bottomless portafilter or without)
3. Bezzera Magica (with PID or without)
4. Start with Gaggia Classic Pro - no frills, but lower pricing in this list

So of course, the Lelit Bianca is the "go for the dream and don't look back for the next 5-7 years", but it puts it at top tier machine that crossses the $3K and likely dive into the $4K range. Its not a La Marzocco, Slayer, Nuovo Simonelli or Mr Espresso and the likes, but still worth to consider the options when thinking at least 5-years of practicality.

One note, I'm in corporate so might be returning to the office when the vaccines roll their way into town in the months or years ahead. perhaps only mornings / evenings and weekends I get to have my time with the machine.

..am already consuming 6-8 espressos daily anyway, again, wife is an Americano and sometimes Cappuccino.

Is shooting for Lelit Bianca a good jump or its just too impulsive altogether being a first time mover from Nespresso Citiz?

Also, where did you obtain your prosumer espresso machines? from Tangs, Takashimaya, Local Cafes, or other modes?

 

[codling]

When buying such machines, do you guys factor in cost of upkeep for the machine such as servicing costs? I am also considering between the Mara x and a bezzera bz10, so it’s a toss up between e61 and modified bezzera group.
Main gripe is the start up time for the marax - I know can use a timer but I need to explain to wife why I pay more than 2k but the BE start up faster...zzz

 

[codling]

Thanks Everyone, I begin to see very practical advise in terms of the machine purchase. To be honest I believe I need to really consider my options in the coming months ahead before March hits. Thats not very far away to be honest. In this case, it would be beneficial to think of my options as below:

I like the below for machines that touches the ranges between 2K - 3K range. It is a serious consideration since it now becomes more of a prized item at home rather than any mere appliance. Price decreases down the list.

1. Lelit Bianca
2. Lelit MaraX (with wooden knobs, bottomless portafilter or without)
3. Bezzera Magica (with PID or without)
4. Start with Gaggia Classic Pro - no frills, but lower pricing in this list

So of course, the Lelit Bianca is the "go for the dream and don't look back for the next 5-7 years", but it puts it at top tier machine that crossses the $3K and likely dive into the $4K range. Its not a La Marzocco, Slayer, Nuovo Simonelli or Mr Espresso and the likes, but still worth to consider the options when thinking at least 5-years of practicality.

One note, I'm in corporate so might be returning to the office when the vaccines roll their way into town in the months or years ahead. perhaps only mornings / evenings and weekends I get to have my time with the machine.

..am already consuming 6-8 espressos daily anyway, again, wife is an Americano and sometimes Cappuccino.

Is shooting for Lelit Bianca a good jump or its just too impulsive altogether being a first time mover from Nespresso Citiz?

Also, where did you obtain your prosumer espresso machines? from Tangs, Takashimaya, Local Cafes, or other modes?

So far bezzera is brought in by FCC, lelit have a few companies such as highlander and Cowpresso. Personally think highlander seems to have a better package due to their 18 month warranty.

My consumption is even less than yours: 3 flat white a day but since it’s so little, quality counts!

 

[DriftKing]

..am already consuming 6-8 espressos daily anyway, again, wife is an Americano and sometimes Cappuccino.

[/I]

You can quote me, I only drink a cup a day (on rare occasion to make 3-4 cups for friends), and I got the LMLM.

Instead of $4.5 - $7 a cup outside, I would be paying $1.6k onwards. With a 50% (estimated) saving of making your own cup, I would save $800 a year at least + the experience and joy of making your own cuppa.

From your consumption you'll get back your machine cost in no time!

 

[nubbyyy]

You will always find a way to justify this hobby Because there's no doubt that's what this is - a hobby which will take up time and money but you do it because you enjoy it. If you just needed caffeine you would drink instant coffee - fast, cheap, effective haha

@Chanvh's point - Servicing costs/ease of getting servicing was important for me too. Like you said Bezzera only has one distributor in Singapore, Lelit has 3 that I know of - Highlander, Cowpresso, Ace Home Barista. I figure that I will have options if one of the distributors can't fix an issue with my machine.

@Codling - Before making any decision, go to a retailer which lets you try the machines/pull a shot. I knowingly paid slightly more for my machine from Highlander as it had all the machines in the cafe for me to look at and try. I would have felt bad if I tried the machines there and bought elsewhere. Highlander also offers peace of mind like what Chanvh mentioned with an extended warranty so I used that to justify the price premium. I also had a slight user problem issue one or two weeks after getting the machine - I Whatsapped them and he immediately Whatsapp video-called me to troubleshoot.

Seeing the machines side-by-side is a big plus so you can decide if any one option is too big for your counter or if a single boiler, HX, double boiler bets suits your needs.

I actually wanted a Bezzera because I like the 'brand story' of 'inventor of the first espresso machine' but the distributor's experience centre was closed for renovation so I never made it there.

For MaraX - you can also Biancify it - adding an official Lelit profiling kit to get the same benefits as a Bianca. You can watch this video - this is by the Ace Home Barista guy. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mclPbSeO5lM

 

[tremor]

I went with rocket appartamento and did not look back.

Compared to my cheapo dedica the only cons is need to switch it on 20mins before brewing to warm up sufficiently.

I used a smart plug and set schedule according to my wake up alarm clock.

 

[patryn33]

You will always find a way to justify this hobby Because there's no doubt that's what this is - a hobby which will take up time and money but you do it because you enjoy it. If you just needed caffeine you would drink instant coffee - fast, cheap, effective haha

Hobby will have to agree. Lol

Some just like drinking espresso or espresso base drink, they can be one machine and done.

Caffeine wise, tea has more caffeine in general lol

 

[codling]

I’m geared towards the bz as I think the upkeep would be lower comparatively to e61. Overall their bundle offer is also cheaper. But the issue is their centre is not open.
I also won’t mind for their killer serpent logo!

Still considering between that and Mara.

 

[chobo_kel]

Also, where did you obtain your prosumer espresso machines? from Tangs, Takashimaya, Local Cafes, or other modes?

You can find the Lelit machines in Taka, I think they are from Boncafe. Not sure whether you'll be able to pull a shot though.

I went with rocket appartamento and did not look back.

What were your considerations when buying the Appartamento?

I'm considering to get the Cronometro.

 

[purpleberry]

Apartamento was my second choice before I went for the Strega. Yes, was a bit charmed by the snake logo, but not Razer lol.

For really space constraint, the smallest I have seen is Lelit Mara. Taka should be coming up with a 10% member discount soon so keep an eye for it.

So far Bezzera's distributor FCC is very responsive, even during the holidays, they will reply within a few hours. Can also discuss possible upgrades and tweaks with them even though they dont sell the parts.

 

[prozaizxc]

I had a Mignon. Believe me, the Niche is a different class of grinder. It looks great, but besides that, nothing about it beats the Niche.

In the $2k+ range, I’d pick the Rocket Appartmento for the most style.

Interesting comparison here. I'm still deciding between upgrading to the Niche and a comparably cheaper grinder is the Mignon. Apart from the grind retention, how else is the Niche better, in particular taste wise or visually from the extraction from the bottomless portafilter? Are the grinds more even such that you can a nicer cone shape extraction from the centre of the portafilter? Taste wise for the espresso is it thicker and more syrupy cos the extraction is better?

 

[wahjohreno]

You can quote me, I only drink a cup a day (on rare occasion to make 3-4 cups for friends), and I got the LMLM.

Instead of $4.5 - $7 a cup outside, I would be paying $1.6k onwards. With a 50% (estimated) saving of making your own cup, I would save $800 a year at least + the experience and joy of making your own cuppa.

From your consumption you'll get back your machine cost in no time!

Haha! My LMLM is only turned on when I have guests!

I’m much more a pour over kind of guy...

 

[wahjohreno]

Interesting comparison here. I'm still deciding between upgrading to the Niche and a comparably cheaper grinder is the Mignon. Apart from the grind retention, how else is the Niche better, in particular taste wise or visually from the extraction from the bottomless portafilter? Are the grinds more even such that you can a nicer cone shape extraction from the centre of the portafilter? Taste wise for the espresso is it thicker and more syrupy cos the extraction is better?

Zero is better in these areas:
1) Much more even grind which does translate to taste
2) Much quieter
3) Crema makes up almost the whole shot (I’ve posted GIF somewhere in this thread)
4) The grind retention alone of the Mignon pisses me off. 30g in 27-8g out.

 

[chanvh]

I think there is a sale on Lelit Bianca now, the price at Tangs is still a tad bit higher than the local distributors like Cowpresso, Ace and Highlander, but then if anyone is into the service given by Boncafe, perhaps this is a reasonable deal?

 

[DriftKing]

Actually I'm not too sure what kind of service you are expecting though... Most basic servicing covers only backflush and wipe if I'm not wrong which all of us could do on our own. Touch wood (or steam knob), our machine has some issue any of the supplier would cover us under warranty anyway (most I think covers only 1-2years warranty ?) Anything beyond its all on us. There's a guy I got the Lmlm from, he does pro machine servicing, I guess he'll be the go to person if really any servicing is required. Most failures happen to the 3 way valve, excessive scale in boiler or water route. Which even at the worst condition for sg water quality, would take quite a number of years unless you're feeding mineralised water daily ( please don't). So far my machine is coming 3 years.. no issues so far except for a weird stuck of my lever actuation.