[GVGT]Is Liu Bei a hypocrite?

[Multiversal]

zoomers and yoomers always make fun of boomers who are in their minds some kind of lo yeh or ah lau who are further assumed to be only bilingual in Hokkien and Cantonese, and can't read and write English wor.

But the above boomer can speak and write far better English than they leh.

 

[tank_t]

If Lu bu not useful Liu bei also don’t want him.

Cos he was strong mah so Liu bei wants him to help him conquer the land.

 

[TheITGuy]

After mankind invented time machine then we know hokay. Until then it’s all BS

 

[gloria2004]

i think during that era, you need to be witty to survive. So being labeled as hypocrite is subjective liu bei was more popular thus was labelled as a hero. those below manager level will label liu bei as a hero, while those managers level and above will label caocao as a hero. caocao had a greater cause that is to unite the han dynasty under 1 rule

 

[Multiversal]

Exactly, normally most wouldn't get there withou letting a few people down. To me Liu Bei is not a gentlemen because 君子报仇十年不晚 want to avenge his deceased brothers at least plan it out to make sure it's executed flawlessly. End up waste his army and couldn't get his vengeance, delay Zhuge Liang's plans.

"End up wasting his army"

Upon reading this, I could not help feeling that throughout history, in every country, even in Russia today (referring to Putin), it is always about the few peepur who hold power, who wield it with the army at their disposal.

Those in power must live, they must be protected while the masse, the army, they are ordered to go into the battlefield, and if they die, well, that's just too bad.

Eew...the army is not merely bullets, and if you fire at nothing, you are wasting bullets. The army is men who are fathers, chewren, brothers, someone's (or many ones') loved ones. The death of a low ranking foot soldier is no less tragic than the death of the emperor. To me, all men are equal. It is a good thing that this "royal nonsense" is abolished. I wonder why they still keep that in England, the silly monarchy,

Ranting and musings over...

 

[Nevereatrice]

u all anyhow link de. whether liu bei ish true royal blood oso questionable lol.
ish just that his armies went to support the emperor,
so they likely chinchye came up with a background check and says that he ish from royal ancestry, lol.
there ish at least 2 other instances in han dynasty where the true ID of a royal was questionable.

According to historical records and traditional Chinese history, Liu Bei, the warlord and later the founding emperor of the Shu Han dynasty during the Three Kingdoms period, claimed to be a descendant of Liu Bang, the founder of the Han dynasty. Sima Qian, the famous Chinese historian who lived during the Han dynasty, also recorded this claim in his work "Records of the Grand Historian" (Shiji).

Liu Bei traced his lineage back to Liu Bang through several generations. According to the historical accounts, Liu Bei's family belonged to the Liu clan, which claimed descent from the mythical sage-king Liu Lei and later Liu Bang. Liu Bang, also known as Emperor Gaozu, was the first emperor of the Han dynasty and reigned from 202 BC to 195 BC.

Sima Qian's "Records of the Grand Historian" is one of the most important historical texts in ancient China. While it provides valuable information about Liu Bei and the Han dynasty, it's worth noting that Sima Qian's work was completed several centuries after the events it describes. As with any historical account, there may be discrepancies, biases, or uncertainties regarding specific details.

Therefore, while it is widely accepted that Liu Bei claimed descent from Liu Bang and this claim is recorded in Sima Qian's work, the precise genealogical connections between the two figures may not be entirely verifiable.

It might be dubious since 2000 years ago but it is stated by sima qian not me so i maybe right u maybe right nobody knows

 

[ponpokku]

According to historical records and traditional Chinese history, Liu Bei, the warlord and later the founding emperor of the Shu Han dynasty during the Three Kingdoms period, claimed to be a descendant of Liu Bang, the founder of the Han dynasty. Sima Qian, the famous Chinese historian who lived during the Han dynasty, also recorded this claim in his work "Records of the Grand Historian" (Shiji).

Liu Bei traced his lineage back to Liu Bang through several generations. According to the historical accounts, Liu Bei's family belonged to the Liu clan, which claimed descent from the mythical sage-king Liu Lei and later Liu Bang. Liu Bang, also known as Emperor Gaozu, was the first emperor of the Han dynasty and reigned from 202 BC to 195 BC.

Sima Qian's "Records of the Grand Historian" is one of the most important historical texts in ancient China. While it provides valuable information about Liu Bei and the Han dynasty, it's worth noting that Sima Qian's work was completed several centuries after the events it describes. As with any historical account, there may be discrepancies, biases, or uncertainties regarding specific details.

Therefore, while it is widely accepted that Liu Bei claimed descent from Liu Bang and this claim is recorded in Sima Qian's work, the precise genealogical connections between the two figures may not be entirely verifiable.

It might be dubious since 2000 years ago but it is stated by sima qian not me so i maybe right u maybe right nobody knows

mai haosiao plz, sima qian lived in mid western han dynasty, liu bei in late eastern han,
they were like 200yrs apart. unless sima qian can read the future 200yrs in advance,
he got no freaking idea who liubei ish.
from start already ish haosiao liao lol. all these historical claims got tons of water in it.
so funny that tiong supporters can get all these simple historical facts wrong. lol.

 

[ponpokku]

"End up wasting his army"

Upon reading this, I could not help feeling that throughout history, in every country, even in Russia today (referring to Putin), it is always about the few peepur who hold power, who wield it with the army at their disposal.

Those in power must live, they must be protected while the masse, the army, they are ordered to go into the battlefield, and if they die, well, that's just too bad.

Eew...the army is not merely bullets, and if you fire at nothing, you are wasting bullets. The army is men who are fathers, chewren, brothers, someone's (or many ones') loved ones. The death of a low ranking foot soldier is no less tragic than the death of the emperor. To me, all men are equal. It is a good thing that this "royal nonsense" is abolished. I wonder why they still keep that in England, the silly monarchy,

Ranting and musings over...

urm his case ish plain and simple revenge, not simi protect his ppl.
and the revenge ish for some arrogant 'sworn brother' who went to disturb his ally's land and ppl,
then got his head chopped for it.

 

[Teyemittisi]

The real question is -… is Liu bei gay?

 

[Nevereatrice]

mai haosiao plz, sima qian lived in mid western han dynasty, liu bei in late eastern han,
they were like 200yrs apart. unless sima qian can read the future 200yrs in advance,
he got no freaking idea who liubei ish.
from start already ish haosiao liao lol. all these historical claims got tons of water in it.
so funny that tiong supporters can get all these simple historical facts wrong. lol.

Then who recorded sanguo? Chen shou?

 

[Shion]

中国古代的家谱大部分都是乱写的

民间写家谱的习俗更是荒唐，从明朝开始才出现的

 

[Justbear]

zhuge liang cannot see thru meh?

He seen thru. He is setting the stage up for himself to perform as well. And since CaoCao and Sun Quan probably has many more talents like himself, the only man he can join is Liu Bei.

 

[ponpokku]

Then who recorded sanguo? Chen shou?

u can write another WOT to tell his story lor.
remember need to come up with the original family records and prove that liubei ish of royal blood.
not simi u say, i say, they say, who confirm?

 

[ponpokku]

The real question is -… is Liu bei gay?

thats inconsequential becos it was a non-issue back then.
rem, ish like 1/2 the han emperors were gay or bi-, even emperors ish liddat, who cares.

 

[peaceheart]

Everyone is a hypocrite, just thst liu bei is the bigger one and he played it well

 

[Canis Lupus]

thats inconsequential becos it was a non-issue back then.
rem, ish like 1/2 the han emperors were gay or bi-, even emperors ish liddat, who cares.

sire dunno how many bas3rds with the gay gene riao..

 

[Multiversal]

mai haosiao plz, sima qian lived in mid western han dynasty, liu bei in late eastern han,
they were like 200yrs apart. unless sima qian can read the future 200yrs in advance,
he got no freaking idea who liubei ish.
from start already ish haosiao liao lol. all these historical claims got tons of water in it.
so funny that tiong supporters can get all these simple historical facts wrong. lol.

I get the feeling that a lot of peepur did not study Chinese history as a serious subject, doing due diligence by reading up history books to get the facts.

Instead, they get their knowledge of Chinese history from Hong Kong movies which juiced history up...how else could they sustain the audience's attention span, episode after episode? If they had shown history like the history teacher teaching it in school, where many students fell asleep with their eyes open, the Hong Kong period movie industry would not have lasted more than one week.

 

[skeptik]

Got more hypocrite than infront say all schools are good school then behind say lousy school?
Got more hypocrite than erection cry and say work for citizens then later take away citizens money and jobs?

In comparison, Liu bei is consider holy man already.

mansssss tis comment is awesomeeeer lol

 

[ponpokku]

I get the feeling that a lot of peepur did not study Chinese history as a serious subject, doing due diligence by reading up history books to get the facts.

Instead, they get their knowledge of Chinese history from Hong Kong movies which juiced history up...how else could they sustain the audience's attention span, episode after episode? If they had shown history like the history teacher teaching it in school, where many students fell asleep with their eyes open, the Hong Kong period movie industry would not have lasted more than one week.

my own experience (thus doesnt apply to all) ish more on the teacher than on the subject, on micro lvl.
if the teacher can teach the subject in an interesting manner, students can grasp the idea better.
oso, on a macro lvl, how the society perceived arts subjects like history and literature oso played a part.
if ppl got stuck with the idea that history ish dry and teachers are often conservative lao kokkok or lao ah mahs,
then there will be no motivation liao.

the reason why popular media gets better attention ish becos they presented the story better,
therefore attracting audience. but at the same time their own interpretation and presentation,
may oso derail from the actual recorded history then kena flak.
but bear in mind, recorded history ish not always REAL history.
different historians got diff agenda, take diff sides, and have diff POV.
we too need a lot of commonsense and logic to understand the records that we can get hold of.
the easiest way to start with historical studies, ish follow timeline. who ish where at what time doing what?
if the basic timeline ish correctly compiled, there will be less cockups, for a start.

 

[AnimeNewbie]

This is why I prefer Li Bai over Liu Bei.