Lost money in commodities trading

[Johnlim2478]

I guessed he did his part, but things are beyond his control also when market suddenly reverses.
I very heart ache for you 2 .... but that's how brutal trading is.

Thanks for sharing. really appreciate that. So although he's a unlicensed trader, I got nothing on him for civil liability...?

If in that case I have no choice but to pick myself up from here.

 

[m/mink]

Thanks for sharing. really appreciate that. So although he's a unlicensed trader, I got nothing on him for civil liability...?

If in that case I have no choice but to pick myself up from here.

Moral yes, civil not really since he was authorised and entrusted with your account details.

Unless you can prove negligence on his part to have done nothing/disappeared at time of crash resulting in such steep losses.

Take care.

 

[OngHuatHuat]

Most likely occurred last week. World commodities price went down, same as Sti, Hsi.

TS, be strong. I lost 75 k in Noble too. Playing with margin is double edged sword, if you do not understand the risk involved, do not try. You will lose even more if you try to recoup your loss.

 

[Sai777]

I am not adding what already mentioned

There is really no case even you want to take the legal path. It is a civil case between you and your friend. If he has proven he had done his part and he was making money for you in 2017, then the recent crash is just a trading lost. Making a false statement will have greater implications on your creditability.

 

[sacredrays]

ya lor.. you already transferred profit $$ in the past means you had a mutual agreement between each other liao..

if can prove he suddenly trade much bigger position, or deviate away from how he used to trade that caused a wipe instantly. then maybe got one small argument point ba...


i wonder why the broker coy don't have measure to prevent losses over his margin capital though.. is it because of the gap down then cannot cover or other reasons? can anyone explain?

 

[JuniorLion]

I am not adding what already mentioned

There is really no case even you want to take the legal path. It is a civil case between you and your friend. If he has proven he had done his part and he was making money for you in 2017, then the recent crash is just a trading lost. Making a false statement will have greater implications on your creditability.

Completely agree on this. Don't go make a police report UNLESS you have evidence that he acted contrary to what you said, and he really logged into your account without your approval.

If it's a case of you giving your login willingly to him and you lied to the police, you can go to jail for making false report.

 

[alyssax]

suggest you speak to a lawyer if you want proper legal advice - many are free and don’t charge consultation for first meeting. Can also try writing to MAS if the guy is an unlicensed broker - but unlikely you can get your money back.

 

[Johnlim2478]

suggest you speak to a lawyer if you want proper legal advice - many are free and don’t charge consultation for first meeting. Can also try writing to MAS if the guy is an unlicensed broker - but unlikely you can get your money back.

Thanks guys for the advice. I think in my situation it seems wiser to accept this loss and rather than trying to get compensation back from the trader.

 

[Mecisteus]

Thanks guys for the advice. I think in my situation it seems wiser to accept this loss and rather than trying to get compensation back from the trader.

Treat it as an expensive tuition fees.

 

[Soul77]

You mentioned you lost about 90K. is it inclusive of the original amount you have plus the amount you owe with the broker? or just the amount you owe with the broker?

You can look at the angle why the broker never force close your position to limit the loss you're suffering. Maybe you may be able to reduce the amount you're owing. But need lawyer to help you. Or maybe approach FIDREC?

 

[Johnlim2478]

You mentioned you lost about 90K. is it inclusive of the original amount you have plus the amount you owe with the broker? or just the amount you owe with the broker?

You can look at the angle why the broker never force close your position to limit the loss you're suffering. Maybe you may be able to reduce the amount you're owing. But need lawyer to help you. Or maybe approach FIDREC?

Will the brokerage firm entertain this? Because i asked their support team on the why was so much margins used even though the trades are not ITM. They only gave a vague answer. Im afraid hiring lawyers and experts tonhelp me on my case may cause higher expense than my loss....

 

[m/mink]

Will the brokerage firm entertain this? Because i asked their support team on the why was so much margins used even though the trades are not ITM. They only gave a vague answer. Im afraid hiring lawyers and experts tonhelp me on my case may cause higher expense than my loss....

From my personal experience with margin accounts.

The leverage% is a variable set by the trader, not a fixed percentage by the brokerage firm.
The range can be 2x to 10x or even more depending on your own risk appetite.

I can only deduce that your trader friend over-leveraged in this case with no stop losses in place.
It's not even a case of gap down, but just reckless trades without stop losses.......
When prices fell below your capital, a margin call was triggered, meaning you would have to top up cash to maintain your position.
If you did not top up your account within a stipulated period, your positions will all be forced close.

 

[Mecisteus]

Your broker is so lousy. Don't have a proper risk management.

Good margin accounts will force close your positions if prices gone at the wrong direction. You only lose the capital that you put in.

 

[Johnlim2478]

Your broker is so lousy. Don't have a proper risk management.

Good margin accounts will force close your positions if prices gone at the wrong direction. You only lose the capital that you put in.

What i was told is that you can’t put stop loss for options. My trader did hedged the positions, which already ehlped to reduced the losses. Haiz

The broker says the prices dropped too fast and accounts were unable to liquidate on time to prevent negative balances

 

[3dfxplayer]

What i was told is that you can’t put stop loss for options. My trader did hedged the positions, which already ehlped to reduced the losses. Haiz

The broker says the prices dropped too fast and accounts were unable to liquidate on time to prevent negative balances

Options are supposed to give you unlimited gains for limited risk, you don't need to place a stop for options unless you sell short them naked. Traders who sell short options naked to profit from option premium have no edge because theta burn is not an edge, he was bound to give it all back eventually, like the infamous guy on reddit who sold volatility in the last 3 years, he went from 4m to zero overnight due to a 1 day VIX spike.

 

[Purplestars]

Options are supposed to give you unlimited gains for limited risk, you don't need to place a stop for options unless you sell short them naked. Traders who sell short options naked to profit from option premium have no edge because theta burn is not an edge, he was bound to give it all back eventually, like the infamous guy on reddit who sold volatility in the last 3 years, he went from 4m to zero overnight due to a 1 day VIX spike.

link to reddit guy?

I only know of 50 cent, who's method on hindsight is pretty smart. I wish I bought calls on Vix or s&p500 puts to insure my portfolio cheaply.

 

[Mr.Canberra]

There are many snake oil sellers on this forum so DYODD.

Threadstarter please let us know if this so call trader you cooperate with is lurking and active on this forum.

 

[Mecisteus]

Why don't you just share with us this broker?

At least, we can advise you further or learn.

 

[Johnlim2478]

There are many snake oil sellers on this forum so DYODD.

Threadstarter please let us know if this so call trader you cooperate with is lurking and active on this forum.

The broker is td ameritrade. Its still very weird why i get margin call when my trades are 2-300 points from atrike price. From what i know, my trader doesnt solicite as inwas the one that approach him for help. Well its not like i can recognise his id in HWZ too

 

[Mecisteus]

TD Ameritrade Asia is a MAS regulated broker in Singapore.

https://eservices.mas.gov.sg/fid/institution?page=186

Go and check with relevant authorities if his conduct is correct.