Need NAS Recommendation

groovinZhou

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Hi ,

I'm new to NAS, few months ago I purchased Buffalo Personal Cloud Storage , which I sold back after a week because even to copy using local connection it requires forever to copy 1 GB file. Eventhough to have the bitorent feature is nice.

I was told that Synology is the best.

I would want to ask for recommendation which NAS should I buy in Singapore , I will need fast copy on local connection, other features is bonus.

Thank you in advance!
 

Seedbox

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Hi ,

I'm new to NAS, few months ago I purchased Buffalo Personal Cloud Storage , which I sold back after a week because even to copy using local connection it requires forever to copy 1 GB file. Eventhough to have the bitorent feature is nice.

I was told that Synology is the best.

I would want to ask for recommendation which NAS should I buy in Singapore , I will need fast copy on local connection, other features is bonus.

Thank you in advance!

Have you check if your connection to the router is gbit? :o
 

groovinZhou

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Hi yes is gbit, the LAN cable need to be special? Because I just use the one come with the box which suppose to be gbit compbatible right? I tried in my office also receive same speed.

My budget around $300 - $600
 

IronMac

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I won't recommend a NAS for you but I just purchased a Synology DS-212j from Storage Studio (5th floor). Both pre-sales and after-sales support was great. Had an issue with the first unit (entirely my fault as it turned out afterwards) but they exchanged it and set it up without hesitation.
 

fribro

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I've just upgraded from wd mybooklive to buffalo linkstation pro duo.
I also thinking to get synology.
Transfer speed is on par with synology j series.
Only apps not much but I only want is bt remote access.
Set up remote web access and bittorent. Perfect for my usage for my budget.
 

GSR_WildCard

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Hi yes is gbit, the LAN cable need to be special? Because I just use the one come with the box which suppose to be gbit compbatible right? I tried in my office also receive same speed.

My budget around $300 - $600

What copying speed were you having with the old NAS box?

What disk space / sizes are you looking at?

Depending on disks, an off-the-shel NAS might go over your budget.
 

groovinZhou

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Thanks all for the reply. Getting more confused lol. I can't remember the speed but a wild guess to remember is like 30GB require days to finish, and 1GB require 1hr++ to finish.

I think 2TB should be enough for me. What is the difference between Buffalo Link Station and Synology?

Will Buffalo link station transfer faster than my previous: Buffalo CloudStor® Pro Personal Cloud Storage (1TB)?
 

fribro

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Thanks all for the reply. Getting more confused lol. I can't remember the speed but a wild guess to remember is like 30GB require days to finish, and 1GB require 1hr++ to finish.

I think 2TB should be enough for me. What is the difference between Buffalo Link Station and Synology?

Will Buffalo link station transfer faster than my previous: Buffalo CloudStor® Pro Personal Cloud Storage (1TB)?
Are you using wired or wireless connection?
 

bravobb

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1. How much data do you need to store ?
2. Do you need fast network ?
3. Do you need reliability ?
4. Do you have a budget ?
 

groovinZhou

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Wireless connection. I tried in 2 environments, same result
Do you think the problem is my setup not the Buffalo cloudstore? I thinking Linkstation will do better? I expecting the speed like when I copy to my external HDD , not possible?

1. I need about 1TB or 2TB only
2. I need fast network
3. Of course reliability
4. Budget $300-600
 

groovinZhou

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Hmm, but if I copy from 1 laptop to another laptop using wireless router it can be very fast. NAS not able to have that speed?
 

bravobb

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How many wireless devices are you using ?
If only 2 notebook, then you can source for a NAS that has high speed wireless compatibility.
I do not use wireless in my NAS, so i am not able to help you, but i am sure there are products out there that can meet your requirement with that budget, but HDD may not be included.
 

elleryc

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A coupe of quick unpleasant facts about NAS.

1. speed
If speed of transfer is the key point you will need to use cat 6 certified lan cable for all cabling for a gigbit router. No it is not always that the supplied lan cable for the NAS will be cat 6 for some strange reason most mfers want to save the little bit by giving you a cat 5 cable. Wifi well if you read the manual it will be obvious that even if its rate say at 54mbs if you get 20mbs its consider as good. Heavy data flow needs lan cabling.

2. most consumer NAS boxes are not high end cpu and chip set so the transfer rate even with lan cable is slower than USB 2. Those that are faster cost considerably more. Roughly speaking in the region of 3K just for the box no HD.

If you are thinking of using the budget NAS as production HD for digital image work well based on checking with people in the IT trade - it is not going to happen. Using the NAS as a secondary store okay if you are prepare for slow transfer speeds plus do in batches. If you try to move 1T at a go it is going to look like the NAS hanged.
 

davidktw

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Are you sure you got the facts right ? Don't seems to be consistent with my knowledge :)

A coupe of quick unpleasant facts about NAS.

1. speed
If speed of transfer is the key point you will need to use cat 6 certified lan cable for all cabling for a gigbit router. No it is not always that the supplied lan cable for the NAS will be cat 6 for some strange reason most mfers want to save the little bit by giving you a cat 5 cable. Wifi well if you read the manual it will be obvious that even if its rate say at 54mbs if you get 20mbs its consider as good. Heavy data flow needs lan cabling.

A normal Cat 5E operating at at least 250MHz would be good enough for gigabit purpose. Cat 6 is not necessary unless you have a large distance to cover or your area is filled with tons of radiation interferences. Normal consumer home shouldn't be of such issue unless you place your network cable near to power sources or power lines. CAT 6 are especially good in data centre due to the large number of electronics in the premises.

2. most consumer NAS boxes are not high end cpu and chip set so the transfer rate even with lan cable is slower than USB 2. Those that are faster cost considerably more. Roughly speaking in the region of 3K just for the box no HD.

First speed is subjective to purpose. Obviously it is recognized that consumer grade NAS are not going to match up with dedicated Enterprising solution, but I don't think you need a 3K grade system to get good performance that surpass most consumer.

I got my Synology DS1511+, which is a SOHO class system with 5 bays only cost me 1.5K. With 3x 2T Green WD drives, each only $130 in today's price, means a total of $390, I can already exceed 100MB/s for write and read using consumer level L2 switches sequentially consistency at above 80MB/s. As for Random I/O access, I am not going to say it's fantastic.

If I will to spend S$200 for each 300GB WD Velociraptor, I can get 5 of them for 1K. Using RAID 5, I can get 1200 Million Bytes worth of disk space, roughly slightly less than 1.1TB worth of actual diskspace. I can tell you 5x WD is going to pack quite sufficient Random I/O, though not as good as SSD for sure.

However, it's still not even 3K !!!! How did you come up with such imaginary number ?

If you are thinking of using the budget NAS as production HD for digital image work well based on checking with people in the IT trade - it is not going to happen. Using the NAS as a secondary store okay if you are prepare for slow transfer speeds plus do in batches. If you try to move 1T at a go it is going to look like the NAS hanged.

It's true, moving 1TB at sustain 80MB/s is going to take 3.6hours. Can I ask if you transfer 1TB internally using SATA, is it going to be significantly faster ? The answer is NO.

Reason very simple, Not to mention SATA 6G, just use SATA 3G as the example. Having a faster interface is not going to make your actual throughput of your harddisk faster it is still going to sustain at roughly between 80-100MB/s. As such the argument that because it takes a long time to transfer 1TB from the NAS to the COMPUTER and hence it makes a bad choice to use NAS is totally nonsense. Even internally, 1TB of data to be transfer from 1 harddisk to another is going to take almost the same time, probably just marginal better due some factors here and there. But using this example to call NAS unsuitable, I don't know where you learn, but definitely not from what I experienced.

There are a few important points required to iron out. NAS doesn't require high processing power, but rather good implementation of the actual network filesystem used, and good operating system, good network interfaces with high processing throughput. Memory modestly provisioned will do. The only time where you need more is when you are also running something else on those NAS with bells and whistles. Data Deduplication, if supported at all, also require substantially more memory.

Next is if performance is paramount, then iSCSI should be used instead of NFS, or CIFS, or AFP. Not all NAS have good iSCSI target implementation. Format the iSCSI block device to the required filesystem used by the host. Ensure the network connectivity is good between the NAS and the host. That should give rather good results.

Conclusion, I find your explanation about NAS rather ill informed and not facts.
If really wanted a good NAS, one can DIY one. It will not be as feature rich as those like QNAP, Synology, Thecus and so forth, but it will serve the purpose of a dedicate NAS and still don't require 3K. I suspect you can even add it a 64GB SSD for read and write-back caching. All these using OpenIndiana(ZFS) on RAID-Z with L2ARC and ZIL.
 
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elleryc

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David info I had is based on what I came away with after sitting down with vendors for NAS and some informal chats with other people in my trade. My focus is on entry level around TS's budget level. Your solution is more high end. If there are budget level boxes that can do this I would be most happy to hear of it from you.

What I was looking at was a NAS based hard disk "farm" where I could add to if I need to build capacity. Cost is a consideration. Necessity for ability to upload and down load multiple files of total capacity 100 gigs upwards plus accessing files for use in applications like Lightroom and Photoshop with performance like as if the hard disk was accessed like a SATA drive in a laptop or PC.

Most vendors when presented with this admit that entry level NAS's cannot have faster read/write, speeds are more in line with below USB2 connect externals. Experience with 2 NAS proved this was the case. Even with budget units some are slower than others. Other people I know tried other NAS's. One party managed to make it work by using Duplo (a brand Cathay pushes) which basically would be call enterprise class. The unit my guy used cost this much. This was however the position almost 2 years ago, things may have changed since.

You are also confirming the for large i.e. 1T size file transfers there are speed issues - yes ?
Right now my mid term solution involves going thunderbolt with a new iMac - the specs read like what scii vs ide for data throughput ability which is equally important as mode of connection speed. Probably go that way latter in the year after the new imacs get real world beta tested by early adoptees.

Hmm so you are saying that a cat 5 cable will in theory give you cat 6 performance ? That was decidedly not what the fiber cable installer was telling me. My switch also does from 10/100 to gig mode (or the led lights indicate that ) when a cat 5 and a cat 6 cable is plugged in.

If you are using a gigbit router, I assumed you want to max out what ever potential it can deliver. In most tech specs there is a gap between on paper and in the real world, I normally try to have overhead so that if the system underperforms it still better than starting lower and getting less. In a home environment upgrading a cable is not that big a deal especially if the main network is laid down with cat 6 already. Link via wireless to a lan and wanting fast multiple files transfer of significant size is to me like runn a 100m race with one leg only. Okay I am not a network person so it is a little like steering by feel here - happy to learn more.

Are you sure you got the facts right ? Don't seems to be consistent with my knowledge :)



A normal Cat 5E operating at at least 250MHz would be good enough for gigabit purpose. Cat 6 is not necessary unless you have a large distance to cover or your area is filled with tons of radiation interferences. Normal consumer home shouldn't be of such issue unless you place your network cable near to power sources or power lines. CAT 6 are especially good in data centre due to the large number of electronics in the premises.



First speed is subjective to purpose. Obviously it is recognized that consumer grade NAS are not going to match up with dedicated Enterprising solution, but I don't think you need a 3K grade system to get good performance that surpass most consumer.

I got my Synology DS1511+, which is a SOHO class system with 5 bays only cost me 1.5K. With 3x 2T Green WD drives, each only $130 in today's price, means a total of $390, I can already exceed 100MB/s for write and read using consumer level L2 switches sequentially consistency at above 80MB/s. As for Random I/O access, I am not going to say it's fantastic.

If I will to spend S$200 for each 300GB WD Velociraptor, I can get 5 of them for 1K. Using RAID 5, I can get 1200 Million Bytes worth of disk space, roughly slightly less than 1.1TB worth of actual diskspace. I can tell you 5x WD is going to pack quite sufficient Random I/O, though not as good as SSD for sure.

However, it's still not even 3K !!!! How did you come up with such imaginary number ?



It's true, moving 1TB at sustain 80MB/s is going to take 3.6hours. Can I ask if you transfer 1TB internally using SATA, is it going to be significantly faster ? The answer is NO.

Reason very simple, Not to mention SATA 6G, just use SATA 3G as the example. Having a faster interface is not going to make your actual throughput of your harddisk faster it is still going to sustain at roughly between 80-100MB/s. As such the argument that because it takes a long time to transfer 1TB from the NAS to the COMPUTER and hence it makes a bad choice to use NAS is totally nonsense. Even internally, 1TB of data to be transfer from 1 harddisk to another is going to take almost the same time, probably just marginal better due some factors here and there. But using this example to call NAS unsuitable, I don't know where you learn, but definitely not from what I experienced.

There are a few important points required to iron out. NAS doesn't require high processing power, but rather good implementation of the actual network filesystem used, and good operating system, good network interfaces with high processing throughput. Memory modestly provisioned will do. The only time where you need more is when you are also running something else on those NAS with bells and whistles. Data Deduplication, if supported at all, also require substantially more memory.

Next is if performance is paramount, then iSCSI should be used instead of NFS, or CIFS, or AFP. Not all NAS have good iSCSI target implementation. Format the iSCSI block device to the required filesystem used by the host. Ensure the network connectivity is good between the NAS and the host. That should give rather good results.

Conclusion, I find your explanation about NAS rather ill informed and not facts.
If really wanted a good NAS, one can DIY one. It will not be as feature rich as those like QNAP, Synology, Thecus and so forth, but it will serve the purpose of a dedicate NAS and still don't require 3K. I suspect you can even add it a 64GB SSD for read and write-back caching. All these using OpenIndiana(ZFS) on RAID-Z with L2ARC and ZIL.
 
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