Roboadvisor: Stashaway vs Syfe

[blurpandasg2014]

Hi All

Here's a new comparison thread to compare stashaway vs syfe.

A short introduction of the companies:

Stashaway uses Economic Regime-based Asset Allocation® (ERAA) that harnesses economic trends to maximise returns at your desired risk level. Traditionally, portfolios have been optimised according to the Nobel Prize-winning Modern Portfolio Theory (MPT). However, academic and industry research indicate that MPT fails to consider the impact of external, changing economic conditions, and how they impact returns.

ERAA® (Economic Regime-based Asset Allocation) enhances MPT by addressing external economic forces, which ultimately drive asset class’ returns, volatility, and correlations. ERAA®’s three pillars, Economic Regimes Determine Asset Allocation, Risk Shield, and Valuation Gaps, together deliver a macroeconomic portfolio management strategy that minimises risk and maximises returns for personalised portfolios across any economic environment.

Syfe uses ARI or Automated Risk-managed Investments strategy that combines the best of two leading approaches - Global Market Portfolio (GMP) and Risk Parity Portfolio (RP). Stress tested across the last 15 years, ARI automatically adjusts your portfolio to ensure enhanced risk-adjusted returns by managing your portfolio's Downside Risk (DR).

Experiment Outline
Monthly investment of $100 into each portfolio on every 15th of the month beginning 15th Aug 2019. Last contribution 15 May 2020. No further contribution will be made

- Stashaway Profile 30
- Syfe Profile 25 (Highest Risk)

Why Syfe Portfolio 25 vs Stashaway P30

Stashaway risk index is calculated based on 99% value at risk (VAR) meaning that for portfolio 30, there is 99% chance the portfolio will not lose more than 30% at any given time

Whereas, syfe portfolio is based on a 97.5% VAR, where it will not lose more than 25% in value 97.5% of the time (or another way of saying 39 of 40yrs will not lose more than 25%)

In order to equalise the 2 different formulas, we need to standardise the measure

99% Var = 2.326 SD
97.5% Var= 1.960 SD

To convert 25% risk syfe portfolio into 99% VAR,

25%/1.96 * 2.326 = 29.66%

Which is why stashaway portfolio 30 is a more suitable competitor to syfe portfolio 25.

https://merage.uci.edu/~jorion/oc/case3.html

https://www.value-at-risk.net/linear-transformation-procedures/

Will be updating this thread on the performance periodically. Stay Tuned

Investment updates (Stashaway vs Syfe) :
15 Aug 2019 (Invested: $100/acc) : $100.00/$100.00
20 Aug 2019 (Invested: $100/acc) :$101.07/$100.92
23 Aug 2019 (Invested: $100/acc) : $101.13/$102.06
31 Aug 2019 (Invested: $100/acc) : $101.31/$102.29
08 Sep 2019 (Invested: $100/acc) : $102.30/$103.76
16 Sep 2019 (Invested: $200/acc) : $202.62/$204.64
25 Sep 2019 (Invested: $200/acc) : $200.96/$203.20
03 Oct 2019 (Invested: $200/acc) : $197.56/$202.63
07 Oct 2019 (Invested: $200/acc) : $199.71/$199.79
13 Oct 2019 (Invested: $200/acc) : $198.95/$200.31
21 Oct 2019 (Invested: $300/acc) : $300.23/$302.27
28 Oct 2019 (Invested: $300/acc) : $302.48/$305.23
02 Nov 2019 (Invested: $300/acc) : $305.18/$305.07
11 Nov 2019 (Invested: $300/acc) : $305.61/$309.33
20 Nov 2019 (Invested: $400/acc) : $408.59/$410.26
29 Nov 2019 (Invested: $400/acc) : $415.17/$415.27
06 Dec 2019 (Invested: $400/acc) : $410.98/$409.97
20 Dec 2019 (Invested: $500/acc) : $517.71/$518.14
25 Dec 2019 (Invested: $500/acc) : $521.91/$521.07
31 Dec 2019 (Invested: $500/acc) : $523.56/$521.80
19 Jan 2020 (Invested: $600/acc) : $633.68/$628.44
27 Jan 2020 (Invested: $600/acc) : $628.57/$629.19
30 Jan 2020 (Invested: $600/acc) : $628.93/$622.24
11 Feb 2020 (Invested: $600/acc) : $654.91/$643.31
19 Feb 2020 (Invested: $700/acc) : $760.08/$748.50
28 Feb 2020 (Invested: $700/acc) : $689.74/$673.14
11 Mar 2020 (Invested: $700/acc) : $646.12/$637.80
14 Mar 2020 (Invested: $700/acc) : $633.25/$618.36
30 Mar 2020 (Invested: $800/acc) : $714.87/$722.13
07 Apr 2020 (Invested: $800/acc) : $747.18/$735.10
10 Apr 2020 (Invested: $800/acc) : $773.41/$731.32
18 Apr 2020 (Invested: $900/acc) : $899.30/$849.78
23 Apr 2020 (Invested: $900/acc) : $881.90/$846.44
08 May 2020 (Invested: $900/acc) : $894.59/$829.56
21 May 2020 (Invested: $1000/acc) : $1014.44/$928.97
30 May 2020 (Invested: $1000/acc) : $1031.70/$933.84
08 Jun 2020 (Invested: $1000/acc) : $1057.28/$909.17
17 Jun 2020 (Invested: $1000/acc) :$1047.31/$916.88
04 Jul 2020 (Invested: $1000/acc) :$1061.90/$934.53
16 Jul 2020 (Invested: $1000/acc) :$1093.46/$953.03
----PROJECT TERMINATED----

If you are interested in other comparisons, refer to the links below

- Stashaway vs Smartly (Project Terminated) : https://forums.hardwarezone.com.sg/...stashaway-vs-smartly-performance-5756289.html

- MoneyOwl DFA vs Stashaway: https://forums.hardwarezone.com.sg/...d-dfa-vs-stashaway-6046242.html#post120835024

 

[assiak71]

Hmm maybe in all your first posts, provide all the links to your comparisons. Already lost track of what you are comparing.

 

[blurpandasg2014]

Hmm maybe in all your first posts, provide all the links to your comparisons. Already lost track of what you are comparing.

ok i will update to include other comparison threads.

 

[kokjj87]

Bookmarked

 

[blurpandasg2014]

Updated

 

[hellfire88]

Hi All

Here's a new comparison thread to compare stashaway vs syfe.

A short introduction of the companies:





Experiment Outline
Monthly investment of $100 into each portfolio on every 15th of the month beginning 15th Aug 2019.

- Stashaway Profile 36 (Highest Risk)
- Syfe Profile 25 (Highest Risk)

Will be updating this thread on the performance periodically. Stay Tuned

Investment updates (Stashaway vs Syfe) :
15 Aug 2019 (Invested: $100/acc) : $100.00/$100.00
20 Aug 2019 (Invested: $100/acc) :$101.07/$100.92

Hi pardon me for asking, just wondering, why the difference risk level if it's for fair comparison?

 

[blurpandasg2014]

Hi pardon me for asking, just wondering, why the difference risk level if it's for fair comparison?

Both companies rate their portfolio differently.

However, what is similar is both stashaway and syfe highest risk portfolio have a 99% VAR of 33-36%, therefore the same risk profile

 

[hellfire88]

Both companies rate their portfolio differently.

However, what is similar is both stashaway and syfe highest risk portfolio have a 99% VAR of 33-36%, therefore the same risk profile

Hmmm according to the Syfe website seems like they are using 97.5% VAR (39 out of 40 years) for their risk profiles, so the 25% risk profile should be roughly equivalent to 29.7% risk profile on a 99% VAR basis

 

[blurpandasg2014]

Hmmm according to the Syfe website seems like they are using 97.5% VAR (39 out of 40 years) for their risk profiles, so the 25% risk profile should be roughly equivalent to 29.7% risk profile on a 99% VAR basis

Sorry my bad. I calculated wrongly! Will change stashaway to portfolio 30 for a fairer comparison.

Thanks for highlighting

 

[ChickRice]

I like stashaway for their sleek interface and their proprietary investing method. I think their algorithm system is one of the best out there.

Sent from Samsung SM-G950F using GAGT

 

[blurpandasg2014]

Updated! Bumps for awareness

 

[hellfire88]

thanks for the update! I've a Stashaway account about 6 months and also started a Syfe account. Syfe seems to be performing well so far at 17% downside risk.

 

[ChickRice]

thanks for the update! I've a Stashaway account about 6 months and also started a Syfe account. Syfe seems to be performing well so far at 17% downside risk.

What's the asset they invest in?

Sent from Samsung SM-G950F using GAGT

 

[blitzio]

Hey OP, thanks for doing this. I was looking around for comparisons and found this thread. Been using StashAway since early 2018 and got interested in Syfe. Looking forward to your results.

 

[undergrd]

So far how's your Stashaway performance since 2018?

Hey OP, thanks for doing this. I was looking around for comparisons and found this thread. Been using StashAway since early 2018 and got interested in Syfe. Looking forward to your results.

 

[ChickRice]

I think in long run Stashaway gotta be competitive in their fees as other robo advisor are catching up. And not to mention the big boys DBS and OCBC have already came out with thier own robo advisor.

Sent from Samsung SM-G950F using GAGT

 

[blurpandasg2014]

Updated

 

[ChickRice]

Hi All

Here's a new comparison thread to compare stashaway vs syfe.

A short introduction of the companies:





Experiment Outline
Monthly investment of $100 into each portfolio on every 15th of the month beginning 15th Aug 2019.

- Stashaway Profile 30
- Syfe Profile 25 (Highest Risk)

Will be updating this thread on the performance periodically. Stay Tuned

Investment updates (Stashaway vs Syfe) :
15 Aug 2019 (Invested: $100/acc) : $100.00/$100.00
20 Aug 2019 (Invested: $100/acc) :$101.07/$100.92
23 Aug 2019 (Invested: $100/acc) : $101.13/$102.06
31 Aug 2019 (Invested: $100/acc) : $101.31/$102.29
08 Sep 2019 (Invested: $100/acc) : $102.30/$103.76

TS stashaway highest risk is 36%, you're on 30. So it might not be a fair comparison..

Sent from Samsung SM-G950F using GAGT

 

[ceciltan]

I think stashaway could be the lowest in fee if you can invest 1m with them. 0.2% only right?

Ok I am wrong. The fee decreased by incremental increase in the invested amount

 

[blitzio]

So far how's your Stashaway performance since 2018?

8% on the max aggressive portfolio (36% risk index)