[serious]NSMen needing help

[firsttimebuyer]

Hi all, I need some help.

In my full-time civilian day job, i was "drafted", by my company's management, into this quasi civil defence scheme that practices mobilization and exercises, like SAF does for NSMen.

In this civil defence scheme, the very type of scenarios and situation in which we are mobilized, are also the very exact type of scenarios that will result in me getting mobilized by my unit. I am not talking about advance call-up or notification of ICT or reservist duties but unannounced, shock/sudden mobilization.

So in effect, I am called up to 2 same places at the same time.

I have been trying to get out of this "quasi civil defence scheme" that my company manages (I cannot reveal more details than that because there are repercussions), due to severe health issues.

Unfortunately, whenever i raised this health issue, the people-in-charge just throw the whole thing back at me, saying that i need to resolve this with my own line managers and not only that, but also find a one-for-one replacement, something that is politically unfeasible ("politically" in the sense of office politics), which is because it is a saikang job.

I understand that what I am saying doesn't make sense, because the context matters but I really can't reveal more details or it would be really obvious which organization I am working for. Unfortunately, that is the reality I am in.

Of course, if my line managers support me, I can bring this up. But unfortunately, things are not simple, and I fear they will resent me for bringing up this complication. Which will affect my performance appraisal. In the worst case scenario, I am condemned and force to leave the company.

So far, i have tried asking my officer (in my NS unit) for help, to see if OC can draft a letter saying that my duties in mobilization take precedence but....radio silence from my officer.........then I tried asking NS department from help but they don't seem to understand......

Has anyone here had ever tried getting a letter from MINDEF saying that NSMen duties take precedence over all other matters?

 

[reddevil0728]

Hi all, I need some help.

In my full-time civilian day job, i was "drafted", by my company's management, into this quasi civil defence scheme that practices mobilization and exercises, like SAF does for NSMen.

In this civil defence scheme, the very type of scenarios and situation in which we are mobilized, are also the very exact type of scenarios that will result in me getting mobilized by my unit. I am not talking about advance call-up or notification of ICT or reservist duties but unannounced, shock/sudden mobilization.

So in effect, I am called up to 2 same places at the same time.

I have been trying to get out of this "quasi civil defence scheme" that my company manages (I cannot reveal more details than that because there are repercussions), due to severe health issues.

Unfortunately, whenever i raised this health issue, the people-in-charge just throw the whole thing back at me, saying that i need to resolve this with my own line managers and not only that, but also find a one-for-one replacement, something that is politically unfeasible ("politically" in the sense of office politics), which is because it is a saikang job.

I understand that what I am saying doesn't make sense, because the context matters but I really can't reveal more details or it would be really obvious which organization I am working for. Unfortunately, that is the reality I am in.

Of course, if my line managers support me, I can bring this up. But unfortunately, things are not simple, and I fear they will resent me for bringing up this complication. Which will affect my performance appraisal. In the worst case scenario, I am condemned and force to leave the company.

So far, i have tried asking my officer (in my NS unit) for help, to see if OC can draft a letter saying that my duties in mobilization take precedence but....radio silence from my officer.........then I tried asking NS department from help but they don't seem to help.

Has anyone here had ever tried getting a letter from MINDEG saying that NSMen duties take precedence over all other matters?

So you saying your company role so happen to coincide with your NS role?

 

[flowerpalms]

Hi all, I need some help.

In my full-time civilian day job, i was "drafted", by my company's management, into this quasi civil defence scheme that practices mobilization and exercises, like SAF does for NSMen.

In this civil defence scheme, the very type of scenarios and situation in which we are mobilized, are also the very exact type of scenarios that will result in me getting mobilized by my unit. I am not talking about advance call-up or notification of ICT or reservist duties but unannounced, shock/sudden mobilization.

So in effect, I am called up to 2 same places at the same time.

I have been trying to get out of this "quasi civil defence scheme" that my company manages (I cannot reveal more details than that because there are repercussions), due to severe health issues.

Unfortunately, whenever i raised this health issue, the people-in-charge just throw the whole thing back at me, saying that i need to resolve this with my own line managers and not only that, but also find a one-for-one replacement, something that is politically unfeasible ("politically" in the sense of office politics), which is because it is a saikang job.

I understand that what I am saying doesn't make sense, because the context matters but I really can't reveal more details or it would be really obvious which organization I am working for. Unfortunately, that is the reality I am in.

Of course, if my line managers support me, I can bring this up. But unfortunately, things are not simple, and I fear they will resent me for bringing up this complication. Which will affect my performance appraisal. In the worst case scenario, I am condemned and force to leave the company.

So far, i have tried asking my officer (in my NS unit) for help, to see if OC can draft a letter saying that my duties in mobilization take precedence but....radio silence from my officer.........then I tried asking NS department from help but they don't seem to understand......

Has anyone here had ever tried getting a letter from MINDEF saying that NSMen duties take precedence over all other matters?

I dun really understand what you mean by civil defence role in ur company.

Anyway for Nsmen mobilization and ICT, as long got saf100 and you submitted it in advance, ur company have to release you. It is by law. So yes nsmen duties take precedence.

 

[reddevil0728]

I dun really understand what you mean by civil defence role in ur company.

Anyway for Nsmen mobilization and ICT, as long got saf100 and you submitted it in advance, ur company have to release you. It is by law. So yes nsmen duties take precedence.

There are some civilian contractors that gets mobilised too

 

[firsttimebuyer]

I dun really understand what you mean by civil defence role in ur company.

Anyway for Nsmen mobilization and ICT, as long got saf100 and you submitted it in advance, ur company have to release you. It is by law. So yes nsmen duties take precedence.

Without revealing more details, i can see how it won't make sense (but I really can't reveal more details), but it is exactly what it sounds like, a CD role in a company.

For mobilization, I mean those cases where there is no SAF100. basically when the green man logo start flashing on TV screen without warning.

 

[flowerpalms]

Without revealing more details, i can see how it won't make sense (but I really can't reveal more details), but it is exactly what it sounds like, a CD role in a company.

For mobilization, I mean those cases where there is no SAF100. basically when the green man logo start flashing on TV screen without warning.

Ok i try to understand

Which means for example if your call sign is flashed on tv one weekend afternoon for you to pack ur fbo and report to camp

And at the same time, you are also activated due to your civil defence role in the company. And you have to report somewhere. So it's a clash right?

Again, the mindef mobilization takes precedence. It is by law that you have to report to camp. Is your company going to be responsible when you be charged for not turning up? For this kind of mobilisation , your commanders alrdy know when is the activation and inform you all.

 

[firsttimebuyer]

Ok i try to understand

Which means for example if your call sign is flashed on tv one weekend afternoon for you to pack ur fbo and report to camp

And at the same time, you are also activated due to your civil defence role in the company. And you have to report somewhere. So it's a clash right?

Again, the mindef mobilization takes precedence. It is by law that you have to report to camp. Is your company going to be responsible when you be charged for not turning up? For this kind of mobilisation , your commanders alrdy know when is the activation and inform you all.

Yes, that is correct. Thank you very much for your help.

Actually, inside my head, I do have this plan. I just hope that it works out. Due to very serious issues of confidentiality, I can't reveal too many details but suffice to say, any kind situation that will result in my NS call sign flashing on the TV will almost certainly result in the activation of my civil defence role in the company - and vice versa as well/

It is very hard for me to explain online because of the level of confidentiality; but suffice to say, i will almost certainly get activated for my civil defence role in the company before I am activated by my unit.

Even worse, then moment I step onto the company's premises, in such a scenario, it is impossible to leave for health and safety reasons. I can't disclose why but it will certainly happen. In such a event, it is impossible to leave the company's premises to answer my NS Unit's mobilisation.

As such, in case (touch wood!) that kind of situation really does occur, i definitely plan to ignore my company's activation.

 

[flowerpalms]

Do you know why your company knows when the unit is going to mobilize you? Such that they can activate you before the mobilization??

And have you ask before your boss if the company is going to save you if you are being charged as awol for not turning up for NS mobilization? Because it is Singapore law that the mobilization takes precedence.

Yes you can ignore ur company's activation. If anything happen to you eg unlawful termination
, you can simply send an email to MOM

 

[Evil_Boss]

sounds like you need a better employer

 

[firsttimebuyer]

Do you know why your company knows when the unit is going to mobilize you? Such that they can activate you before the mobilization??

And have you ask before your boss if the company is going to save you if you are being charged as awol for not turning up for NS mobilization? Because it is Singapore law that the mobilization takes precedence.

Yes you can ignore ur company's activation. If anything happen to you eg unlawful termination
, you can simply send an email to MOM

I do know why but I would have to be deliberately very vague...for confidentiality reasons.

Basically, if XXXX event occurs, my company will definitely activate it's civil defence-related "volunteers". I know this because I was "volunteered" and attended the training.

I also know that if XXXX events occurs, my NS unit will also be activated. I know this because my OC, during ICT briefing, said so.

As for my company, everytime I raised this issue, they side-stepped the question to avoid giving an answer. They did the same when I raised personal health issues.

 

[LWZ]

what has your boss said about this ?

I suppose he/she knows of your CD role within the company ?

 

[reddevil0728]

I do know why but I would have to be deliberately very vague...for confidentiality reasons.

Basically, if XXXX event occurs, my company will definitely activate it's civil defence-related "volunteers". I know this because I was "volunteered" and attended the training.

I also know that if XXXX events occurs, my NS unit will also be activated. I know this because my OC, during ICT briefing, said so.

As for my company, everytime I raised this issue, they side-stepped the question to avoid giving an answer. They did the same when I raised personal health issues.

Go find mp

 

[firsttimebuyer]

And have you ask before your boss if the company is going to save you if you are being charged as awol for not turning up for NS mobilization? Because it is Singapore law that the mobilization takes precedence.

Yes you can ignore ur company's activation. If anything happen to you eg unlawful termination
, you can simply send an email to MOM

I actually have been searching online, to look for that exact line of legislation that says that I am subject to military law, so that in case SHTF (touch wood, because I don't want XXXX event to really occur), I can throw that piece of legislation at my conpany. My company can be a little scary some of the people in it sometimes act like the outside world does not exist.

In my mind, what happens most likely is my company's activation happens first (I get notified by SMS), then I have to let them know that I would most likely be called up by my NS unit to go back to army camp (most likely it will result in a shouting match with the people from my company), then I frantically call up my unit and ask if they are indeed mobilize (knowing the way things are done there, no one can give a straight answer for 8 hours straight).

 

[firsttimebuyer]

what has your boss said about this ?

I suppose he/she knows of your CD role within the company ?

Oh they know, but they don't really care.

Basically, what happens is that the higher-ups go around the different departments/divisions and ask the different department/divisions to contribute a certain number of "volunteers" to fulfill this CD role. So it is like fulfilling a KPI. But for the people who were "volunteered", if they want to withdraw, the onus is on the person "volunteered" to find a one-for-one replacement. That is quite hard because I am basically looking for someone to replace me in doing a saikang role, and even if this guy wants to withdraw in the future, he needs to find his own "one-for-one" replacement.

It is politically suicide for me to even approach my management without a "one-for-one" replacement in hand.

 

[flowerpalms]

I actually have been searching online, to look for that exact line of legislation that says that I am subject to military law, so that in case SHTF (touch wood, because I don't want XXXX event to really occur), I can throw that piece of legislation at my conpany. My company can be a little scary some of the people in it sometimes act like the outside world does not exist.

In my mind, what happens most likely is my company's activation happens first (I get notified by SMS), then I have to let them know that I would most likely be called up by my NS unit to go back to army camp (most likely it will result in a shouting match with the people from my company), then I frantically call up my unit and ask if they are indeed mobilize (knowing the way things are done there, no one can give a straight answer for 8 hours straight).

My question to you is what will happen to you if you turn up for the NS unit mobilization and not your company activation?

What will ur boss say, knowing that you have NS unit mobilized at the same time?

 

[reddevil0728]

My question to you is what will happen to you if you turn up for the NS unit mobilization and not your company activation?

What will ur boss say, knowing that you have NS unit mobilized at the same time?

Tbh, I think TS is a case of being drama.

 

[firsttimebuyer]

My question to you is what will happen to you if you turn up for the NS unit mobilization and not your company activation?

What will ur boss say, knowing that you have NS unit mobilized at the same time?

In the worst case scenario, inside my mind, I get hauled up before a disciplinary committee and then action is taken against me, but I am not sure what kind of action, maybe reduce my salary or place me on PIP. it is all very vague because they occasionally refer to us as "volunteers". But during activation exercises, it sure does not feel that way.

I think my boss does not want to get involved in this, I had been told before: "please solve your own problems", and I had seen bad stuff happen to other employees who raised similar issues.

I understand that this seems complex and very hard to understand but without revealing too much detail, the chain of command, the hierarchy and reporting line in my company is very complex and tangled up.

 

[flowerpalms]

In the worst case scenario, inside my mind, I get hauled up before a disciplinary committee and then action is taken against me, but I am not sure what kind of action, maybe reduce my salary or place me on PIP. it is all very vague because they occasionally refer to us as "volunteers". But during activation exercises, it sure does not feel that way.

I think my boss does not want to get involved in this, I had been told before: "please solve your own problems", and I had seen bad stuff happen to other employees who raised similar issues.

I understand that this seems complex and very hard to understand but without revealing too much detail, the chain of command, the hierarchy and reporting line in my company is very complex and tangled up.

Just send an email to MOM, cc Mindef
I am sure they will be able to step in if you are unfairly treated because of this by ur company.

Again for the last time , NS mobilization takes precedence . This is Singapore Law.

 

[Nuclear Boy]

Just send an email to MOM, cc Mindef
I am sure they will be able to step in if you are unfairly treated because of this by ur company.

Again for the last time , NS mobilization takes precedence . This is Singapore Law.

@firsttimebuyer
Second this... Know your rights as an employee (and S'pore citizen) and use it.

To be honest, I have no idea why you still remained in such an organisation.

 

[tuckloong]

It depends on the role in your civilian vs role in NS...see which one can be replaceable?

If really got issues can talk to NSPC or your unit/Formation S8/DyS8?