Surge Protector

[westom]

buy those audiophile type of surge protector (far superior to those sold at computer stores)..............can improve picture and sound quality too...........

So what happens to that improved AC electricity? Well audiophile hardware first filters it. Then converts it to DC (even dirty electricity now eliminated). Then it converts it into radio frequency spikes. Now electricity if far 'dirtier' than anything on AC mains. Those spikes are then converted to low, stable, DC by galvanic isolation, more filters, regulators. And then filtered again so that DC voltage do not vary by even 0.2 volts.

If dirtiest electricity is intentionally created inside and then made completely irrelevant, then what does that $500 magic box do? Anything that box might do is intentionally undone. Anything it might do is already done before it is 'intentionally undone'. So where is this improved audio and video?

How does it improve picture and sound quality when DC voltages do not vary by even 0.2 volts with cleanest or 'dirtiest' AC electricity? Anything done by a $500 protector (or by an electrically equivalent $20 protector does) is first completely undone. Then superior filters, regulators, etc even make that 'dirtiest' power into ideal cleanest DC voltages.

BTW, a surge protector does nothing (remains inert) until a spike exceeds its let-through voltage. That occurs maybe once every seven years - a microseconds event. That protector does absolutely nothing during another six years, 11 months, 30 days, 23 hours, 59 minutes, and 59 seconds. One need only read (or post) its specification numbers. Since a recommendation without numbers is often a scam.

 

[napoleon bohlumpar]

So what happens to that improved AC electricity? Well audiophile hardware first filters it. Then converts it to DC (even dirty electricity now eliminated). Then it converts it into radio frequency spikes. Now electricity if far 'dirtier' than anything on AC mains. Those spikes are then converted to low, stable, DC by galvanic isolation, more filters, regulators. And then filtered again so that DC voltage do not vary by even 0.2 volts.

If dirtiest electricity is intentionally created inside and then made completely irrelevant, then what does that $500 magic box do? Anything that box might do is intentionally undone. Anything it might do is already done before it is 'intentionally undone'. So where is this improved audio and video?

How does it improve picture and sound quality when DC voltages do not vary by even 0.2 volts with cleanest or 'dirtiest' AC electricity? Anything done by a $500 protector (or by an electrically equivalent $20 protector does) is first completely undone. Then superior filters, regulators, etc even make that 'dirtiest' power into ideal cleanest DC voltages.

BTW, a surge protector does nothing (remains inert) until a spike exceeds its let-through voltage. That occurs maybe once every seven years - a microseconds event. That protector does absolutely nothing during another six years, 11 months, 30 days, 23 hours, 59 minutes, and 59 seconds. One need only read (or post) its specification numbers. Since a recommendation without numbers is often a scam.

mine is a Chang Lightspeed........these filters improve the sound and picture quality...........of course if one is just looking for protection and not improvement then can buy cheaper ones........

 

[westom]

mine is a Chang Lightspeed........these filters improve the sound and picture quality...........

Again a blanket statement without even one reason to believe it. That is how corrupt politicians and retail scammers operate. If it improves sound and picture quality, then posted is why. How does it do that? Facts and numbers say it does not and cannot. So your reply with a same soundbyte? And we should believe you? Honesty means the 'whys' are posted - tempered by specification numbers. None have been posted.

No reasons why and no numbers are the first indication of a scam. So please demonstrate honesty. Explain how this box does any of that. And say by how much; that means the relevant manufacturer specification number for each is cited.

 

[napoleon bohlumpar]

Again a blanket statement without even one reason to believe it. That is how corrupt politicians and retail scammers operate. If it improves sound and picture quality, then posted is why. How does it do that? Facts and numbers say it does not and cannot. So your reply with a same soundbyte? And we should believe you? Honesty means the 'whys' are posted - tempered by specification numbers. None have been posted.

No reasons why and no numbers are the first indication of a scam. So please demonstrate honesty. Explain how this box does any of that. And say by how much; that means the relevant manufacturer specification number for each is cited.

go to the Chang Lightspeed website to read why...........it removes RFI and EMI.........the higher models over $1K can make the sound system sound more powerful even thru Power Factor

my friend had a cheaper one that worked so i bought the more expensive one..........i sold off my system before i put the filter in it and forgot about it till last year

 

[westom]

go to the Chang Lightspeed website to read why...........it removes RFI and EMI.........

Did they mention that tying a knot in the power cord also removes RFI and EMI? All claims are subjective. Subjective is why junk science (urban myths) is alive and well. A knot in a power cord or that magic box removes near zero RFI and EMI. Anyone who demands reasons why with numbers would obviously see that.

Others, who are easily scammed, will assume that near zero RFI and EMI filter is 100% filtering. No filter is 100%. Claiming it will remove all RFI and EMI demonstrates that lies in color glossy sales brochures are both legal and believed.

Where is the specification number? Where is your sentence that states which spec number is relevant? Those should have been in your very first post. Instead, constantly posted is same hearsay, subjective claims, and wild speculation. Not one spec number - ever.

Nobody should read pages and pages of subjective claims on the Chang Lightspeed website. You are making a recommendation. Therefore you have quoted a specific website statement that defines how much RFI and EMI protection. When someone says, "Go read the website", then that is a first indicator that even a poster did not even know what number is relevant - if any number even exists. Apparently no spec numbers define RFI and EMI protection.

Meanwhile, all electronic power supplies routinely convert that RFI or EMI into DC voltages. Then into well over 300 volt radio frequency spikes. Where does a Chang Lightspeed product eliminate that? It doesn't. Because a best RFI and EMI eliminator is inside all electronics. Why do you constantly ignore that reality? And the so many layers of filters already inside electronics?

Only place they must be honest is in numeric specifications. An honest recommendation always cites the relevant number from those specifications. Until that is done, everyone should assume the worst. Otherwise junk science and scams live on.

 

[gcybill]

Hi weston,

We are living in a unit 6th floor out of 12th-floors HDB block and not a corner unit. Wondering whether recent lightning strikes may impact our appliances. I assume HDB has a safety standard of lightning rod installed and the risk is more on the highest floor compare to mid floors.

Just to put extra caution.

• How to check whether any outlet is properly grounded?
• Will below product helps to prevent direct power surges on PC?
  APC UPS with Backup Battery

 

[westom]

... Wondering whether recent lightning strikes may impact our appliances. I assume HDB has a safety standard of lightning rod installed and the risk is more on the highest floor compare to mid floors.

Just to put extra caution.
[*]How to check whether any outlet is properly grounded?
[*]Will below product helps to prevent direct power surges on PC?
APC UPS with Backup Battery

Irrelevant are a motherboard's digital ground, floating grounds, virtual ground, and wall receptacle safety ground. To lightning, those are no different than a telephone wire and TV cabe. Protection is about how that cloud connects to earth ground.

To protect a structure, a lightning rod connects lightning to earth ground. Then a structure is not damaged.

To protect an appliance, a lightning strike to any incoming wire (AC electric, telephone, satellite dish, etc) a kilometer away must be connected to earth ground before it enters. Otherwise appliances are damaged by a surge inside and hunting for earth ground destructively via that appliance.

Previous posts said same. For example:

A surge is an electric current connecting that cloud to earth. If that path is inside a structure, then that cloud connects to earth destructively via appliances. Your cable box is probably connected to a cable that is earthed. Since you did not earth a surge before it could enter, then a cable box was a best connection to earth. Damage created because a surge was not connected to earth BEFORE entering. Damage directly traceable to not learning what Ben Franklin demonstrated over 250 years ago.

Incoming on AC mains. Hunting for earth destructively inside. One destructive path is that [cable] box.

Protection means a surge is not anywhere inside a building. Protection means a main breaker box (or meter) connects every wire low impedance (ie less than 3 meters) to earth ground. Not floating ground, receptacle ground, or a floor beneath shoes (a static electric ground). Single point earth ground.

First question should have been for specification numbers. APC lists every relevant number often under a category called surge protection. How many joules does it claim to 'absorb'? Hundreds. A surge that tiny (that does not damage any appliance) is also the limit of (destructive to) that APC UPS protector circuit. IOW a surge too tiny to damage any appliance can also destroy near zero joules inside a UPS. Where is protection?

Since most consumers make scams easy by not always demanding numbers, then urban myths hype a UPS as hardware protection. One small problem apparent in those specification numbers. A UPS only is temporary and 'dirty' power too protect unsaved data. It does nothing to protect hardware or saved data.

Once a surge is inside a building, then nothing (as in nothing) will block that surge's hunt for earth ground. Especially not near zero joules in a UPS or power strip protector. Protection always means a surge connects to earth ground before entering a structure.

A lightning rod connects to earth before a surge gets into walls. A 'whole house' protector connect low impedance (ie less than 3 meters) to earth before a surge gets into any interior wires. First is building protection. Second is appliance protection. Both mean a surge is not anywhere inside.

 

[lycans]

Irrelevant are a motherboard's digital ground, floating grounds, virtual ground, and wall receptacle safety ground. To lightning, those are no different than a telephone wire and TV cabe. Protection is about how that cloud connects to earth ground.

To protect a structure, a lightning rod connects lightning to earth ground. Then a structure is not damaged.

To protect an appliance, a lightning strike to any incoming wire (AC electric, telephone, satellite dish, etc) a kilometer away must be connected to earth ground before it enters. Otherwise appliances are damaged by a surge inside and hunting for earth ground destructively via that appliance.

Previous posts said same. For example:

Protection means a surge is not anywhere inside a building. Protection means a main breaker box (or meter) connects every wire low impedance (ie less than 3 meters) to earth ground. Not floating ground, receptacle ground, or a floor beneath shoes (a static electric ground). Single point earth ground.

First question should have been for specification numbers. APC lists every relevant number often under a category called surge protection. How many joules does it claim to 'absorb'? Hundreds. A surge that tiny (that does not damage any appliance) is also the limit of (destructive to) that APC UPS protector circuit. IOW a surge too tiny to damage any appliance can also destroy near zero joules inside a UPS. Where is protection?

Since most consumers make scams easy by not always demanding numbers, then urban myths hype a UPS as hardware protection. One small problem apparent in those specification numbers. A UPS only is temporary and 'dirty' power too protect unsaved data. It does nothing to protect hardware or saved data.

Once a surge is inside a building, then nothing (as in nothing) will block that surge's hunt for earth ground. Especially not near zero joules in a UPS or power strip protector. Protection always means a surge connects to earth ground before entering a structure.

A lightning rod connects to earth before a surge gets into walls. A 'whole house' protector connect low impedance (ie less than 3 meters) to earth before a surge gets into any interior wires. First is building protection. Second is appliance protection. Both mean a surge is not anywhere inside.

So in short, surge protectors are useless? In Australia, I keep seeing multiplug extension with surge protectors on them....

 

[keenklee]

IMHO, if a home is free from power surges (and interference) from within the home, I guess it would be alright not to use such devices.

I use powerline adapters for ethernet. If the powerline is ideal, I should be getting full speed for every connection - unfortunately, it is not.

 

[cybertech]

Solve my long term problem whenever changing ceiling fan speed, off/on Heater switch or even open fridge door will cause my PC USB TV Tuner and USB HDMI Capture to freeze
After getting this (suppose to protect surge and spikes) and connect the 8 ways power extension to it, so far no more problem.

 

[westom]

I use powerline adapters for ethernet. If the powerline is ideal, I should be getting full speed for every connection - unfortunately, it is not.

Power line has no relevance. Relevant is what is connected to that power line. And other factors including phase.

 

[westom]

So in short, surge protectors are useless?

In short, what was posted was not read. Will a surge protector protect from a stock market surge or a tidal surge? Of course not. Even a Asus motherboard surge has no relationship to those other three surges.

Assumed is a surge protector that is same as a surge protector. The world is that confusing when only reading subjectively. Posted previously and repeatedly is a major difference between what was called a surge protector and something completely different that you have called a surge protector.

Anything new is never understood until after, at least, a third reread. Go back to learn major differences between a surge protector and a surge protector. Only a surge protector does best protection. Meanwhile a surge protector makes surge damage easier. Same phrase (surge protector) describes two completely different items. That should have been obvious after reading first four paragraphs in that first post.

 

[lycans]

In short, what was posted was not read. Will a surge protector protect from a stock market surge or a tidal surge? Of course not. Even a Asus motherboard surge has no relationship to those other three surges.

Assumed is a surge protector that is same as a surge protector. The world is that confusing when only reading subjectively. Posted previously and repeatedly is a major difference between what was called a surge protector and something completely different that you have called a surge protector.

Anything new is never understood until after, at least, a third reread. Go back to learn major differences between a surge protector and a surge protector. Only a surge protector does best protection. Meanwhile a surge protector makes surge damage easier. Same phrase (surge protector) describes two completely different items. That should have been obvious after reading first four paragraphs in that first post.

TBH, i have read it but i dont understand it. It seems highly complicated and confusing.

 

[keenklee]

Power line has no relevance. Relevant is what is connected to that power line. And other factors including phase.

Yup, which is why if whatever is plugged in are clean, the powerline ethernet should be able to run faster.

 

[westom]

Yup, which is why if whatever is plugged in are clean, the powerline ethernet should be able to run faster.

Power line can be perfectly clean and still signal speed is subverted.

Appliances can provide a perfectly clean load at AC power frequencies. And also badly distort currents at powerline ethernet frequencies.

 

[westom]

TBH, i have read it but i dont understand it. It seems highly complicated and confusing.

Everything stated is layman simple to anyone with high school science.

One should never complain. One quotes a paragraph that is not understood, states what one thinks it says, and then asks for clarification.

Complaining with a 'woe is me' attitude is wasted bandwidth.

Others read this stuff without any problem: https://www.reddit.com/r/PC_building/comments/9ymkmh/do_i_need_an_expensive_surge_protector_for_a/

Effective protection always answers this question. As in always. Where do hundreds of thousands of joules harmlessly dissipate? A protector is only as effective as its low impedance (ie hardwire has no sharp bends or splices) connection to and the quality of earth ground electrodes. Today and over 100 years ago. That is why a telco CO suffers 100 surges with each storm - without damage.
A protector is only as effective as its earth ground. Then best protection already inside that computer (and everything else) is not overwhelmed.

 

[Kooosh]

Irrelevant are a motherboard's digital ground, floating grounds, virtual ground, and wall receptacle safety ground. To lightning, those are no different than a telephone wire and TV cabe. Protection is about how that cloud connects to earth ground.

To protect a structure, a lightning rod connects lightning to earth ground. Then a structure is not damaged.

To protect an appliance, a lightning strike to any incoming wire (AC electric, telephone, satellite dish, etc) a kilometer away must be connected to earth ground before it enters. Otherwise appliances are damaged by a surge inside and hunting for earth ground destructively via that appliance.

Previous posts said same. For example:

Protection means a surge is not anywhere inside a building. Protection means a main breaker box (or meter) connects every wire low impedance (ie less than 3 meters) to earth ground. Not floating ground, receptacle ground, or a floor beneath shoes (a static electric ground). Single point earth ground.

First question should have been for specification numbers. APC lists every relevant number often under a category called surge protection. How many joules does it claim to 'absorb'? Hundreds. A surge that tiny (that does not damage any appliance) is also the limit of (destructive to) that APC UPS protector circuit. IOW a surge too tiny to damage any appliance can also destroy near zero joules inside a UPS. Where is protection?

Since most consumers make scams easy by not always demanding numbers, then urban myths hype a UPS as hardware protection. One small problem apparent in those specification numbers. A UPS only is temporary and 'dirty' power too protect unsaved data. It does nothing to protect hardware or saved data.

Once a surge is inside a building, then nothing (as in nothing) will block that surge's hunt for earth ground. Especially not near zero joules in a UPS or power strip protector. Protection always means a surge connects to earth ground before entering a structure.

A lightning rod connects to earth before a surge gets into walls. A 'whole house' protector connect low impedance (ie less than 3 meters) to earth before a surge gets into any interior wires. First is building protection. Second is appliance protection. Both mean a surge is not anywhere inside.

This is new info to me and thanks for sharing! I don't perfectly understand everything you said but I get the gist of it.

I recently experienced some - apparently hardware related issue - with my MacBook. Doesn't want to power up. Did some basic troubleshooting here and there and managed to get it up and running again after a few days. Part of the troubleshooting was to replace my charging adaptor as it seems that it doesn't want to charge my Mac.

Alls good in a day until I can't power it up again the next day, and also can't charge. The brand new and original charging adaptor doesn't want to charge my MacBook again!

That led me to suspect that there is something wrong with either my wall outlet, or the "Power Surge Protector" extension strip.

@Weston, what checks do you think I can do without getting an electrician in? Is there a meter of some sort to check?

 

[westom]

Alls good in a day until I can't power it up again the next day, and also can't charge. The brand new and original charging adaptor doesn't want to charge my MacBook again!

That led me to suspect that there is something wrong with either my wall outlet, or the "Power Surge Protector" extension strip.

Apparently something is causing power supply damage. First and obvious - is that Mac supply for your AC voltage? Most likely is. But verify voltage numbers on its label.

So maybe a power (voltage) issue exists. Use a powerful diagnostic tool. Connect an incandescent bulb to that receptacle that also powers something else. Does that bulb change intensity when that other appliance is power cycled? Does it change intensity at any other time? If yes, then a workmanship defect probably exists. Now a clear indication that the electrician can use to first locate and later fix the defect.

Eliminate that power surge strip. If a potentially destructive transient exist, then it simply gives that transient even more and destructive paths into a Mac. Power strip reduces (bypasses) existing hardware protection.

Meanwhile surges are rare - maybe once every seven years. Plug-in protectors are often so undersized as to function only once or twice in seven years - and then require replacement. It does nothing helpful. And is not for some anomaly that clearly exists frequently.

Your efforts must identify what is causing a problem. Make that 'cause' repeatable so that the electrician can quickly find and fix it. An incandescent bulb is one superb diagnostic tool for some suspected failure reasons.

Another concept learned from experience. A dead body is always best evidence. What inside that power supply (charger) has failed. Obviously you cannot discover that. Maybe find someone who can. Even simple facts such as an output voltage (measured by a digital meter) on both a good power supply and suspect one would go a long way into identifying the defect.

BTW, is that charger sufficiently sized for that computer? Is its output voltage and amps sufficient for what that Mac requires? An obvious question that gets overlooked because it is so rare. Those numbers should be printed on each power supply and should agree with numbers in the Mac's specification sheet.

 

[Laser_bitches]

power outages

getting alot of power outages due to lightning strikes. Anythingi can do about it?

 

[numbull]

Now that I read this, surge protector seems useful