The Spectacles Thread. - Part 2

[jervin88]

The optician will not be able to do that by tampering with the machine. Do u expect them to tamper with it everytime a customers specificiations is off slightly? Some may need to plus some may need to minus. You're thinking too much. There is no such thing as even 100% accuracy when it comes to lens degree and accuracy. I believe even labs are given a certain range to reject the lenses before even sending it over.

Sent from GAGT Android App

 

[kaikoura]

Lensometer can be adjusted for the readings to read accurate in order to show us, no?

I ask again, can the lensmeter be adjusted by optician so that the reading on the machine can tally with what the lens prescrption should read? If lens is off, can they manually adjust at the side so that it is correct then show it to me? Understand boh?

Yes, it can be done, just like cab meters can be adjusted. But I would think they have better things to do than to learn how to hack the lensmeter, or have better things to spend the money on than to pay for someone to hack it.

Besides, if a patient feedback of blur or not comfortable, then something has to be done, regardless of what the number is on the lensmeter - in fact most patients don't care, they just want their spectacles to work for them.

The optician will not be able to do that by tampering with the machine. Do u expect them to tamper with it everytime a customers specificiations is off slightly? Some may need to plus some may need to minus. You're thinking too much. There is no such thing as even 100% accuracy when it comes to lens degree and accuracy. I believe even labs are given a certain range to reject the lenses before even sending it over.

Yes, there is an acceptable range of deviation from the ordered power.

if you're so garang as to go to another shop so often and have the staff check the lenses haven't you noticed the method of usage is the same?
most users either use straight away or change modes
not adjust anything


unless the staff is really so skilled or you were to call an hour in advance before coming , how is the staff suppose to adjust the meter to make a wrong power appear correct on the display?

Yes, agree with the above, too troublesome.

Besides, what's the point of adjusting the power to make it seem right.

 

[kaikoura]

** means ** la no need say so nice, wat different. Ya a pain in the ass is wat u really mean, ya? The more u say the more hypocrite it sounds.

Lensometer can be adjusted for the readings to read accurate in order to show us, no?

yeah adjust in front of you

when i'm at work I call it professionalism not to deny service of current customers
but all this weird reasoning explains why you have so much bad experiences doesn't it?

Well done on the professionalism.

In fact, Seannie, just to ally your doubts, I've never seen a hacked lensmeter, and even if there was one available, it certainly cannot be easily bought in the open market.

And on the patients' side, it is much easier than before to read the power with more retailers shifting to digital ones (as opposed to the manual knob-turning ones).

They are usually listed in order:
Sph - spherical power
Cyl - cylindrical power (astigmatism)
Axis - axis of cylindrical power

Just take note depending on the settings, Cyl Power can be in a positive or negative format, which then 'affects' the Sph Power.

E.g. -2.00 / -2.00 X 180 is also -4.00 / +2.00 X 090

 

[kaikoura]

Hi,

i think i need to switch to progressive lens as i have difficulty reading things near my face, like handphone. i just discovered that the different lens brands have actually have different lines.

i was curious about owndays because of the very good price they've advertised, but found a review that says there seem to be no intermediate vision on them. is this true? will there be extra tests/measurements needed for progressive lens vs the single vission one?

anything you can recommend for first time progressive lens user. pasir miki seems to have a 15% discount on their lens. anyone have experience with them before?

Thanks.

Welcome to the world of presbyopia.

There are several options you can choose depending on your lifestyle.

The usual progressive lenses give you both far and near vision - and a little of intermediate. This is usually meant for every day use, i.e. looking at bus numbers, reading the menu in a restaurant, watching the TV. But these are generally not so comfortable for computer work due to the small intermediate area.

Then there are the less-common progressive lenses that give the intermediate area and near area only. This is usually called office progressives, and as the name suggests it is meant for office use; looking at the computer, writing material, documents, etc. However for these lenses, anything in the distance will be blur, which means you cannot walk out to lunch or see bus numbers with it.

The last thing to note is that for any lens that has multiple powers inside, it will get increasingly blur as you look towards the side. Thus, you may need some time to get used to this - for instance you may have to turn your head to look at something at the side instead of simply turning your eyes as you would do with your usual pair of spectacles. Similarly, if you need to look at something on the floor, you have to turn your head downwards.

For a small group of people who cannot get used to the effects of the progressive lenses, they choose to do a pair for distance viewing, and another pair for computer to leave at their work place.

When you have problems reading near, additional steps will be done to test and adjust your near vision. Any decent refractionist will know what to do.

Hope that helps.


Don't want to comment too much on individual shops, but I would say, go to a shop that you trust, where the staff bother to find out your needs and things are explained clearly to you so that you understand what you are getting. There are many different brands, coatings, and types of lenses available in the market today.

 

[PiPiChew]

Hi I was quoted $538.40 for an IC Berlin after discount and Zeiss aspheric 1.6 lens for myopia 250 degree and slight asigmatism $240. So total is $778.40. Is the price reasonable or I can get a better price elsewhere ?

I got a quote from a shop at a shopping centre. Thanks for the advise bros

 

[jonleelk]

Recently made new specs and was recommended a lens that has a 50 degree difference between near and far vision. It is supposed to be an intermediate step until progressive lens are required, estimated two years down the road. What are such lens called technically?

 

[kaikoura]

Recently made new specs and was recommended a lens that has a 50 degree difference between near and far vision. It is supposed to be an intermediate step until progressive lens are required, estimated two years down the road. What are such lens called technically?

Would this be the Essilor Anti-Fatigue or Hoya TACT?

I would regard this as a varifocal lens (a lens that is made to have more than a single power in it), but I am not sure if the entire industry agrees with this.

Remember to keep your head still and turn your eyeballs downwards to read.

 

[kaikoura]

Hi I was quoted $538.40 for an IC Berlin after discount and Zeiss aspheric 1.6 lens for myopia 250 degree and slight asigmatism $240. So total is $778.40. Is the price reasonable or I can get a better price elsewhere ?

I got a quote from a shop at a shopping centre. Thanks for the advise bros

Prices can vary according to the model of the frame, so the best gauge would be to visit a couple more shops to look for the same model and get a quote.

Most importantly, caveat emptor. Look at the entire package - is the pricing clear and transparent, do they do a proper eye check, explain things to you, have after-sales service, do you think they will deliver the right products as promised, etc.

 

[Seannie]

Well done on the professionalism.

In fact, Seannie, just to ally your doubts, I've never seen a hacked lensmeter, and even if there was one available, it certainly cannot be easily bought in the open market.

And on the patients' side, it is much easier than before to read the power with more retailers shifting to digital ones (as opposed to the manual knob-turning ones).

They are usually listed in order:
Sph - spherical power
Cyl - cylindrical power (astigmatism)
Axis - axis of cylindrical power

Just take note depending on the settings, Cyl Power can be in a positive or negative format, which then 'affects' the Sph Power.

E.g. -2.00 / -2.00 X 180 is also -4.00 / +2.00 X 090

Its kinda hard to ask an optician to show me lensmeter. Paiseh becos its like doubting him then in the first place why patronise u knoe wat i mean? But i suspect most have errors like at least 2-5 off. So i guess i just have to live with the margins of error and see blurer lor. If i request them to replace lens for me they will also lose profits and do unwillingly right? Forget it lar. Really disappointed in optical industry already. Give up. Like u said maybe ang moh places are better like australia provide better and more honest services i guess.

 

[Seannie]

Hi I was quoted $538.40 for an IC Berlin after discount and Zeiss aspheric 1.6 lens for myopia 250 degree and slight asigmatism $240. So total is $778.40. Is the price reasonable or I can get a better price elsewhere ?

I got a quote from a shop at a shopping centre. Thanks for the advise bros

REASONABLE.

 

[kaikoura]

Its kinda hard to ask an optician to show me lensmeter. Paiseh becos its like doubting him then in the first place why patronise u knoe wat i mean? But i suspect most have errors like at least 2-5 off. So i guess i just have to live with the margins of error and see blurer lor. If i request them to replace lens for me they will also lose profits and do unwillingly right? Forget it lar. Really disappointed in optical industry already. Give up. Like u said maybe ang moh places are better like australia provide better and more honest services i guess.

Can request to see lah, if you ask nicely. From time to time we do have curious customers so I would think a decent shop will be glad to show you more stuff and explain a little (as long as you don't demand a comprehensive tour of the premises when they are busy ).

Don't recall saying ang moh places are better, but anyway I think it's just the difference in culture.

In ang moh land, patients come in by appointments so more time can be spent on each person, and patients also tend to be more friendly and open in sharing their visual needs and how the previous pair of spectacles weren't too good, if they have any diseases or taking medications that their doctor told them could affect their vision, etc.

All these adds up to the entire eye care experience, and many times makes it easier to dispense spectacles and suggest the right products.

For instance if the staff knows you're particularly sensitive to power and axis variations, they can actually try to make it as accurate as possible (especially if you are duplicating the power from a previous pair of spectacles), and they can recommend a more sturdy frame that will sit more firmly on the face, with a rim shape that would not allow the lens to rotate, and so on.

Like Japan, the optical retail culture in Singapore is more of a staff VS customer / customer-is-always-bigger attitude, which focuses more on the products than the experience, which is why Owndays is such a big hit here (as J!NS eyewear is over in Japan). In ang moh land you go back to the same practice year after year, and patients come back to say their last goodbyes (when they sadly contract a terminal illness...). Two different worlds.

In Singapore, some customers don't like the extra talk, and prefer to keep to themselves unless asked. And some even get pissed off when the refractionist asks for more details.

I have heard of cases where patients go to multiple shops to get prescriptions and then demand for explanations when there are differences. It's like asking why one piece of bread is more brown than the other piece.

In ang moh land people are more trusting. And happier too. Even with their irritatingly reflective uncoated lenses.

 

[Seannie]

The optician will not be able to do that by tampering with the machine. Do u expect them to tamper with it everytime a customers specificiations is off slightly? Some may need to plus some may need to minus. You're thinking too much. There is no such thing as even 100% accuracy when it comes to lens degree and accuracy. I believe even labs are given a certain range to reject the lenses before even sending it over.

Sent from GAGT Android App

My astig is above 300. Slight deviation i can tell difference someting not right. Most optical staff dont realise that high astig needs extra caution. They treat as normal astig. They dont realise off 1 or 2 is v taxing for the patient caused alot of distress. As such they accept wat "deviation" theory. I suspect many of my previous specs are off.

 

[oldbreadstinks]

Yes, it can be done, just like cab meters can be adjusted. But I would think they have better things to do than to learn how to hack the lensmeter, or have better things to spend the money on than to pay for someone to hack it.

Besides, if a patient feedback of blur or not comfortable, then something has to be done, regardless of what the number is on the lensmeter - in fact most patients don't care, they just want their spectacles to work for them.




Yes, there is an acceptable range of deviation from the ordered power.




Yes, agree with the above, too troublesome.

Besides, what's the point of adjusting the power to make it seem right.

if your optician is not capable of getting the power on the lenses correct .... i really doubt he/she is actually capable of doing anything to the lensometer....

 

[Seannie]

In ang moh land people are more trusting. And happier too. Even with their irritatingly reflective uncoated lenses.

Thats becos over there opticians CAN be trusted. Not here in sg though. Maybe 2 out of a 100 can be trusted to do their job with 100% integrity. But its like looking for a needle in the ocean. Even if i do find that right optician, they dont carry the right frames buying shoes, wallets, bags, clothes are much simpler tasks and no heartaches.

 

[kaikoura]

My astig is above 300. Slight deviation i can tell difference someting not right. Most optical staff dont realise that high astig needs extra caution. They treat as normal astig. They dont realise off 1 or 2 is v taxing for the patient caused alot of distress. As such they accept wat "deviation" theory. I suspect many of my previous specs are off.

The official tolerance (American standards) for cylinder >1.50 is 2 degrees axis.

They actually base this on how many degrees axis rotation will cause a resultant power shift of 0.12D (which is half a 'step' of 0.25D), which could make it visible to the sensitive eye.

tolerable rotation = sin-1 ( 0.12D / (2 * F) )
where F is your cylinder power.

So for your case of 3.00D of cylinder power (I just take it as 300 because you didn't say how much above 300 ), an axis rotation of 1.15 degrees will result in a power shift of 0.12D.

In comparison, someone with 1.00D of cylinder power would, by the standard, tolerate up to 3.44 degrees of rotation.

 

[Seannie]

you're an engineer , or so you claimed
this is physics not something that's arcane lore hidden away from the masses

it's common sense to keep your cloth away from conditions that attracts dust in cases , holders

+ i have already mentioned how lenses got scratched with dust and why
it's usually because people use force instead of gently
plastic is soft, anything harder will scratch it , rubbing it hard will scratch it too, that's why so many people who used tissue to rub and try to clean their CDs only add to the scratches
i have always wiped my lenses only after rinsing if i've been outdoors , see how i mentioned previously i wipe with some water droplets left?

this is basic common sense to add a lubricant

Ok i want to tell u this is nothing to do with physics. Im lazy to put cloth in a case everytime i use it. I throw it somewhere on the table. Thats y tissues are much better they are kept in a tissue box away from dust particles and ready for use anytime anywhere.

To correct u, i wash with dettol soap under running water first before wipe with tissue, but usually dont even need to wipe cos the oil & dirt are already washed off by the soap+water so left with water droplets no need use force at all. Dont always think only u have common sense. Its just that using soap clears away all the oil & dirt and a tissue aftertat completes the job. HASSLEFREE.

 

[kaikoura]

if your optician is not capable of getting the power on the lenses correct .... i really doubt he/she is actually capable of doing anything to the lensometer....

QFT

 

[oldbreadstinks]

Its kinda hard to ask an optician to show me lensmeter. Paiseh becos its like doubting him then in the first place why patronise u knoe wat i mean? But i suspect most have errors like at least 2-5 off. So i guess i just have to live with the margins of error and see blurer lor. If i request them to replace lens for me they will also lose profits and do unwillingly right? Forget it lar. Really disappointed in optical industry already. Give up. Like u said maybe ang moh places are better like australia provide better and more honest services i guess.

-1 and above shouldn't have such huge differences in axis

assuming the test was correct, and they wrote the correct prescription in cases like mine where I send the job to the lab to cut, the fault is with the lab if there's a deviation and assuming the staff found out it's wrong it's sent back to be replaced
if the staff didn't find out and the customer felt uncomfortable, it should still be replaced in the even it's found out

even if it's cut in house, it will still need to be replaced as long as there's a forceful enough deviation

I once changed 6 pairs of normal 1.6 hmc
,
already told them customer will inspect with a microscope for hairline scratches and hold the lens against the light to check each corner
I cut the first pair myself , when i realised the customer will inspect that way i sent the frame up and let the lab decide , took them 5 warranties before they woke up
anyone know who i'm talking about?

Like u said maybe ang moh places are better like australia provide better and more honest services i guess.

if only you see how many angmoh places people come to singapore and make glasses
especially australia

 

[kaikoura]

Thats becos over there opticians CAN be trusted. Not here in sg though. Maybe 2 out of a 100 can be trusted to do their job with 100% integrity. But its like looking for a needle in the ocean. Even if i do find that right optician, they dont carry the right frames buying shoes, wallets, bags, clothes are much simpler tasks and no heartaches.

You are just a plane ride away!

 

[oldbreadstinks]

My astig is above 300. Slight deviation i can tell difference someting not right. Most optical staff dont realise that high astig needs extra caution. They treat as normal astig. They dont realise off 1 or 2 is v taxing for the patient caused alot of distress. As such they accept wat "deviation" theory. I suspect many of my previous specs are off.

most realised lah

if they dunno ..... they shouldn't be there liao . it's part of the process to know