Trust in CPF?

[dork32]

I think that at this point, it really comes down to personal preferences there’s no right or wrong answer.

this is the most important point that you must know.

there are pros and cons to everything. you need to be aware of it before making decisions.

you dont have listen to the crab the bbc is blabbering. he has a one track mind. his solution is always the best regardless your situation.

 

[Maeda_Toshiie]

The same can be said for any financial product or even cash itself. Cash in any currency subjects to its issuing government. Investment subjects to its underlying performance and market perception, of which, neither is certain.

CPF has higher transparency than any investments you have and higher visibility of future payment. What lacks is liquidity, which can be supplemented by other more liquid instruments.

It’s funny to think that CPF is a worse financial instrument than any other investment.

CPF has higher transparency than publicly listed firms and funds with independent board of directors?

 

[Maeda_Toshiie]

You mean like The Vatican? That small country has been around since at least A.D. 313. Switzerland, another small country that begins with the letter S, has been around since 1307 or so. San Marino, which also begins with the letter S and is also very small? A.D. 301.

The "Vatican City" is hardly a good example. The Holy See lost the vast majority of lands composing the Papal States to Italy, leaving just a small "city" (a "city" in name, more like a palace and its grounds) with its "citizens" being the clergy and jaintors. Monaco also lost most of its lands to France, leaving it as a mostly inconsequential urban area (ie a resort for the French elite). It is technically sovereign but it is just about a protecterate in defense matters.

As for Switzerland, it has a track record of fighting for its independence and defending it with blood (I heard high mountains help a lot too). Singapore doesn't. Oh and it is very difficult to get Swiss citizenship.

 

[fr33d0m]

CPF has higher transparency than publicly listed firms and funds with independent board of directors?

Of course.

CPF has a board of directors and issues annual report.

The strategy of CPF is very simple: invest in special SGS, which is backed by the full faith of the Singapore government.

Whether government wins or loses, the government has to pay, at worst through raising tax on everyone and every company in Singapore.


How many public listed companies tell you everything they do? How many funds tell you everything they own?

 

[BBCWatcher]

CPF has a board of directors and issues annual report.

Ernst & Young audits their financials, too.

The "Vatican City" is hardly a good example.

It's not my argument. I'm strongly in favor of reasonable global investment diversification, including multiple high quality sovereigns. However, I'm merely pointing out that, as a factual matter, plenty of small countries have endured for centuries. The Holy See is an excellent example for these purposes because the argument is about enduring money, not territory. The Roman Catholic Church hasn't had any particular problems with money-related continuity.

How about another small country, the Netherlands? The Dutch government is still paying coupons on early 1600s perpetual bonds (consols), in euro now.

 

[w1rbelw1nd]

Your definition of transparency is not the same as mine. At least for listed companies, there is AGM, we can vote for change in directors, we can demand for details, and for certain change in investment mandate for vehicles like REITS, we can vote for it.

I don't see how we can have more details with the current arrangements.

Of course.

CPF has a board of directors and issues annual report.

The strategy of CPF is very simple: invest in special SGS, which is backed by the full faith of the Singapore government.

Whether government wins or loses, the government has to pay, at worst through raising tax on everyone and every company in Singapore.


How many public listed companies tell you everything they do? How many funds tell you everything they own?

 

[Perisher]

this is the most important point that you must know.

there are pros and cons to everything. you need to be aware of it before making decisions.

you dont have listen to the crab the bbc is blabbering. he has a one track mind. his solution is always the best regardless your situation.

Problem with that is many here are beginning to see him like a best example due to his wall of text which when broken down will be retorted by many.

If one do follow his advice, do please have a critical mind.

 

[w1rbelw1nd]

And 1 MDB is also audited by big 4, Deloitte, previously. Is it any real source of comfort?

Ernst & Young audits their financials, too.

 

[Perisher]

Ernst & Young audits their financials, too.

Tell me who audit Lehman Brothers?

https://corpwatch.org/article/ernst...-settle-lehman-brothers-audit-failure-lawsuit

Auditors are not the be-all and end-all. Especially for big funds.

 

[cscs3]

Your definition of transparency is not the same as mine. At least for listed companies, there is AGM, we can vote for change in directors, we can demand for details, and for certain change in investment mandate for vehicles like REITS, we can vote for it.

I don't see how we can have more details with the current arrangements.

Sure, you can vote for it at AGM, but how much ia your voice been heard? And only once a year when everything is in black and white (audited statement) right?

What in the AGM, they tell you tgey lost all the money and share keep going down, what can you do?

 

[Perisher]

Of course.

CPF has a board of directors and issues annual report.

The strategy of CPF is very simple: invest in special SGS, which is backed by the full faith of the Singapore government.

Whether government wins or loses, the government has to pay, at worst through raising tax on everyone and every company in Singapore.


How many public listed companies tell you everything they do? How many funds tell you everything they own?

That’s the thing isn’t it? So the more they lose, the more citizens tax will be raised? So the more funds they have, the less money you would have if they loses?

 

[Perisher]

Sure, you can vote for it at AGM, but how much ia your voice been heard? And only once a year when everything is in black and white (audited statement) right?

What in the AGM, they tell you tgey lost all the money and share keep going down, what can you do?

Move your funds.

 

[cscs3]

Tell me who audit Lehman Brothers?

https://corpwatch.org/article/ernst...-settle-lehman-brothers-audit-failure-lawsuit

Auditors are not the be-all and end-all. Especially for big funds.

Very good example. Small fish, by the time you know it, is already been eaten!

 

[cscs3]

Move your funds.

Ask yourself do you still have time and chances when the news finally reach you.

 

[w1rbelw1nd]

Still better than CPF. Thats my point.

Sure, you can vote for it at AGM, but how much ia your voice been heard? And only once a year when everything is in black and white (audited statement) right?

What in the AGM, they tell you tgey lost all the money and share keep going down, what can you do?

 

[fr33d0m]

Your definition of transparency is not the same as mine. At least for listed companies, there is AGM, we can vote for change in directors, we can demand for details, and for certain change in investment mandate for vehicles like REITS, we can vote for it.

I don't see how we can have more details with the current arrangements.

CPF itself is just a fund. Like any other investment fund, you as investor has no power to change directors of its trustee or the fund managers.

You as investor, are not the owner of the trustee. So you have no power to change its strategy.

If you don’t like its strategy, you can exit the fund by renouncing your citizenship and leave Singapore and west Malaysia.

 

[crimsontactics]

Tbh, I think the point of CPF or shares in SGX going broke is a little extreme.

Most people's concern when they put money in CPF is just liquidity.

I never considered that CPF or any other financial alternatives will go broke when I topped up my CPF.

My main consideration is just liquidity and returns.

Sent from . using GAGT

 

[fr33d0m]

That’s the thing isn’t it? So the more they lose, the more citizens tax will be raised? So the more funds they have, the less money you would have if they loses?

It’s still one of the few AAAs.

I sleep better than investing in any other fund.

 

[Perisher]

Ask yourself do you still have time and chances when the news finally reach you.

Etf. Safe enough?

 

[Perisher]

It’s still one of the few AAAs.

I sleep better than investing in any other fund.

Erm... not helping. But do what you feel is comfortable.