Will minimum wage laws work here?

Should there be a minimum wage?

  • Yes

    Votes: 62 50.0%
  • No minimum wage

    Votes: 62 50.0%

  • Total voters
    124

P R N D

Arch-Supremacy Member
Joined
Jul 24, 2016
Messages
20,846
Reaction score
4
ITE and poly r important as they skill u for work.
Current pay for both institution graduate command less than $3k

So when basic minimum wages set at 3kper mth for a decent living.

Thus, i said why waste time study ite & poly unless both can command higher than 3k+++.

Sent from Mercedes-Benz E250 using GAGT
 

Merg91

Master Member
Joined
Dec 12, 2018
Messages
2,501
Reaction score
0
Only want to tax those richer (than you) to subsidise the poor?
You know GST 20% is affecting your pocket.

GST is the best way to tax.
The more you spend, the more you pay /help the society poor.

Serious or not, raise GST to 20%??? Sg already one of the wealthiest and most expensive city in the world.
Raising GST too much will worsen inflation wouldn't it as everything will then costs more.

You must be a ASK to say that. Think of the common man on the street please.
 
Last edited:

P R N D

Arch-Supremacy Member
Joined
Jul 24, 2016
Messages
20,846
Reaction score
4
Hmm, Sg compulsory education only up to sec school I think.
WRONG, under The Compulsory Education Act pased in 2000 requires all Singaporean children to complete six years of primary education in national schools before they turn 15.

Sent from Mercedes-Benz E250 using GAGT
 

mummy1234

Banned
Joined
Jan 30, 2014
Messages
17,103
Reaction score
31
WRONG, under The Compulsory Education Act pased in 2000 requires all Singaporean children to complete six years of primary education in national schools before they turn 15.

Sent from Mercedes-Benz E250 using GAGT

I checked before, it was 10 years of compulsory education on the MOE website.
 

BBCWatcher

Arch-Supremacy Member
Joined
Jun 15, 2010
Messages
24,497
Reaction score
5,548
WRONG, under The Compulsory Education Act pased in 2000 requires all Singaporean children to complete six years of primary education in national schools before they turn 15.

I checked before, it was 10 years of compulsory education on the MOE website.
It appears you're both wrong. ;)

The most relevant law is the Compulsory Education Act. It's written in some strange ways.

First of all, let's look at the ages. Under this act, the government has the power to compel a child's school attendance when that child is at least 6 years old (has reached his/her 6th birthday). Of course many children are nearly age 7 when the school year starts in January, in practice. Then, when the child celebrates his/her 15th birthday, the government loses its power of compulsion. If you tally up the number of years, it's 8.X. There are 8 years counting the child's 7th, 8th, 9th, 10th, 11th, 12th, 13th, and 14th years of age, plus the portion (0.X) of the year during the child's 6th year when the school year starts. The law doesn't provide for 10 years of compulsion. Hypothetically the government would be within its power to compel a child, every child, to attend "national primary school" starting on his/her 6th birthday, exactly. In practice the government doesn't do that, but as far as I can tell the law, as written, gives the government that power if it ever wants to have a system of rolling school admission instead of annual school admission.

OK, then there's some confusion about what "primary" means. The law is confusing, frankly. It defines "national primary school" not in the way we commonly think of primary school (P1 through P6). It does seem to allow secondary schools (and other schools) within that definition. And the law doesn't say that 6 years of primary education (P1 through P6) is all that's required. It certainly seems to grant the government the power to compel schooling at any/all grade levels it deems appropriate, even beyond P6, as long as the child is within the law's age range and not granted a discretionary exception.

Interestingly this law only compels citizen children residing in Singapore to attend a "national primary school." (Reminder: "National primary school" is not limited to P1 through P6.) This law does not apply to Permanent Resident or foreign children, and it does not apply to Singaporean children living outside Singapore. Those are remarkable, even distressing, omissions. Maybe another piece of legislation concerns itself with the welfare of other children (non-citizen children in Singapore, and Singaporean children outside Singapore), but this particular one does not.

This law does not compel any children to complete P1 through P6, or any particular grade levels. It only compels attendance (of a "national primary school," which again is not the same as a school teaching one or more grades from P1 to P6), and until the child celebrates his/her 15th birthday. Which makes sense, of course, because it's impossible to compel a specific, minimum educational attainment in terms of learned material, test scores, grade level, or whatever. Actual attainment can be under P6 minimum (even well under), well over, or anywhere in between. "Actual results vary," in other words. The law also doesn't compel parents to help their children with homework, for example.
 
Last edited:

theMKR

Banned
Joined
Nov 3, 2016
Messages
70,925
Reaction score
13,557
Serious or not, raise GST to 20%??? Sg already one of the wealthiest and most expensive city in the world.
Raising GST too much will worsen inflation wouldn't it as everything will then costs more.

You must be a ASK to say that. Think of the common man on the street please.

yes i am a ASK, which is why i asked for 100% inheritance tax :s8:
btw: my inheritance cant pay for my stamp duty and i lost more than that amt in stocks under 3hours.

But hey, at least i got something. Thank you govt for implementing CPF medisave account so at least almost all children have something to inherit.

GST is the most fair, becos u CHOOSE on how much you want to spend.
Progressive tax on income is unfair, people who work harder are "punished" by the govt.

The current tax structure now is preserving OLD MONEY, low consumption tax and 0% inheritance tax and 0% capital gain tax.

The current structure also restricts social mobility by making basic necessities enormously expensive restricting capital accumulation to the poor by birth.

Lazy people deserves to be poor.
but the current policy no longer allows hardworking and smart people to move up their social economic status anymore :s13::s13::s13:
 

BBCWatcher

Arch-Supremacy Member
Joined
Jun 15, 2010
Messages
24,497
Reaction score
5,548
GST is the most fair, becos u CHOOSE on how much you want to spend.
OK, so are you going to choose not to eat food?

Progressive tax on income is unfair, people who work harder are "punished" by the govt.
Please explain to me how (for example) a board member of a real estate company is working harder than the janitor who is sweeping and scrubbing the floors, carting the trash, and cleaning the pool. I'd really like to understand more about the greater hardship that board member endures. Are Mont Blanc pens harder to lift and push than full trash bins?
 

theMKR

Banned
Joined
Nov 3, 2016
Messages
70,925
Reaction score
13,557
(Emphasis mine.) Yes, exactly. For some time now it has been possible to lodge a single application with the Ministry of Manpower for EP then S Pass consideration.


No, it's now $2,300/month. For S Pass applications lodged from January 1, 2020, it'll be $2,400/month.

Existing S Pass holders are not immediately affected when the minimum fixed monthly salary is raised, so there are still some S Pass holders at the $2,200/month level. A one year S Pass renewal at the previous salary level can be permitted (but doesn't have to be -- the Ministry of Manpower has absolute discretion) if the renewal application is lodged within the first 6 months after a hike.


Yes, that's illegal under the Employment Act. Those S Pass holders would be well advised to file a complaint with the Ministry of Manpower. They may be eligible for back pay, and they can remain anonymous to their employer.

the trick here is, S-pass quota reached. then......
 

BBCWatcher

Arch-Supremacy Member
Joined
Jun 15, 2010
Messages
24,497
Reaction score
5,548
the trick here is, S-pass quota reached. then......
No trick. If a single application is lodged with a request to the Ministry of Manpower to consider both pass types in sequence, if MOM denies the Employment Pass, and if MOM then denies the S Pass in sequence (for quota or any other reason), then the whole application is rejected, with no pass approved. That's quite simple, and it happens frequently.

There are also many situations when the MOM cannot reach a decision quickly since it needs to conduct further investigation of the employee's background, qualifications, or other attributes. Some applications can be pending for months. If that's not fast enough for the employer and/or employee, "no problem," the application can be withdrawn.
 
Last edited:

theMKR

Banned
Joined
Nov 3, 2016
Messages
70,925
Reaction score
13,557
OK, so are you going to choose not to eat food?


Please explain to me how (for example) a board member of a real estate company is working harder than the janitor who is sweeping and scrubbing the floors, carting the trash, and cleaning the pool. I'd really like to understand more about the greater hardship that board member endures. Are Mont Blanc pens harder to lift and push than full trash bins?

I know my post is a little bit long, but hey this isnt edmw. So please do not selectively quote.

Firstly, everyone have the choice to eat instant noodle, hawker center, DTF, HDL or waku ghin.

Secondly, I have mentioned that the current policies have made necessities overly costly.

Having a high GST, will allow the govt to redistribute the tax as GST packages. And this will benefit those who CHOSE to spend less.
 

BBCWatcher

Arch-Supremacy Member
Joined
Jun 15, 2010
Messages
24,497
Reaction score
5,548
Firstly, everyone have the choice to eat instant noodle, hawker center, DTF, HDL or waku ghin.
All are subject to GST.

There's absolutely no question that GST is a regressive tax. It can be made somewhat less regressive (but still is regressive) with GST rebates. And we know, from several high quality empirical studies, that a top marginal income tax rate of 70% or more is completely compatible with work incentives. For example, the United States had a top marginal income tax rate as high as 92% in 1952 and 1953, and the 1950s was a tremendously innovative and productive decade in U.S. economic history. There's absolutely no economic problem in that. Whether there's a political "problem" -- because people substantially subject to a 70% or higher top marginal income tax rate would complain -- is a separate question.
 
Last edited:

ftpofmpo

Banned
Joined
Jan 13, 2014
Messages
8,431
Reaction score
1,082
yes i am a ASK, which is why i asked for 100% inheritance tax :s8:
btw: my inheritance cant pay for my stamp duty and i lost more than that amt in stocks under 3hours.

But hey, at least i got something. Thank you govt for implementing CPF medisave account so at least almost all children have something to inherit.

GST is the most fair, becos u CHOOSE on how much you want to spend.
Progressive tax on income is unfair, people who work harder are "punished" by the govt.

The current tax structure now is preserving OLD MONEY, low consumption tax and 0% inheritance tax and 0% capital gain tax.

The current structure also restricts social mobility by making basic necessities enormously expensive restricting capital accumulation to the poor by birth.

Lazy people deserves to be poor.
but the current policy no longer allows hardworking and smart people to move up their social economic status anymore :s13::s13::s13:

High property taxes does not preserve old money. Any entity with substantial holdings of local property should be subjected to high taxes, and that is often old money
 

ftpofmpo

Banned
Joined
Jan 13, 2014
Messages
8,431
Reaction score
1,082
All are subject to GST.

There's absolutely no question that GST is a regressive tax. It can be made somewhat less regressive (but still is regressive) with GST rebates. And we know, from several high quality empirical studies, that a top marginal income tax rate of 70% or more is completely compatible with work incentives. For example, the United States had a top marginal income tax rate as high as 92% in 1952 and 1953, and the 1950s was a tremendously innovative and productive decade in U.S. economic history. There's absolutely no economic problem in that. Whether there's a political "problem" -- because people substantially subject to a 70% or higher top marginal income tax rate would complain -- is a separate question.

wouldn't that just generate a new way of salary payment, where people will create a special structure with a class of shares that either pays high qualified dividends (in us) or have a high growth rate?
 

theMKR

Banned
Joined
Nov 3, 2016
Messages
70,925
Reaction score
13,557
High property taxes does not preserve old money. Any entity with substantial holdings of local property should be subjected to high taxes, and that is often old money

Property tax is very low in sg la.
U see so many empty houses and land parcel

And if u have high ppty tax, ppl move their money to dividend stocks lor
 

ftpofmpo

Banned
Joined
Jan 13, 2014
Messages
8,431
Reaction score
1,082
OK, so are you going to choose not to eat food?


Please explain to me how (for example) a board member of a real estate company is working harder than the janitor who is sweeping and scrubbing the floors, carting the trash, and cleaning the pool. I'd really like to understand more about the greater hardship that board member endures. Are Mont Blanc pens harder to lift and push than full trash bins?

can't we specially impose a board of directors' tax?
 

ftpofmpo

Banned
Joined
Jan 13, 2014
Messages
8,431
Reaction score
1,082
yes i am a ASK, which is why i asked for 100% inheritance tax :s8:
btw: my inheritance cant pay for my stamp duty and i lost more than that amt in stocks under 3hours.

But hey, at least i got something. Thank you govt for implementing CPF medisave account so at least almost all children have something to inherit.

GST is the most fair, becos u CHOOSE on how much you want to spend.
Progressive tax on income is unfair, people who work harder are "punished" by the govt.

The current tax structure now is preserving OLD MONEY, low consumption tax and 0% inheritance tax and 0% capital gain tax.

The current structure also restricts social mobility by making basic necessities enormously expensive restricting capital accumulation to the poor by birth.

Lazy people deserves to be poor.
but the current policy no longer allows hardworking and smart people to move up their social economic status anymore :s13::s13::s13:

The problem with GST is that when it runs at close to 20% it starts to distort the market. e.g. a person will buy a product priced at 100%, creating value for both parties, but not at 120%, resulting in lose-lose position caused by taxation.
 

Toni90

Senior Member
Joined
Mar 18, 2017
Messages
924
Reaction score
2
The problem with GST is that when it runs at close to 20% it starts to distort the market. e.g. a person will buy a product priced at 100%, creating value for both parties, but not at 120%, resulting in lose-lose position caused by taxation.

Are u sure or not? Most of European countries got GST ~20%.
 

Toni90

Senior Member
Joined
Mar 18, 2017
Messages
924
Reaction score
2
All are subject to GST.

There's absolutely no question that GST is a regressive tax. It can be made somewhat less regressive (but still is regressive) with GST rebates. And we know, from several high quality empirical studies, that a top marginal income tax rate of 70% or more is completely compatible with work incentives. For example, the United States had a top marginal income tax rate as high as 92% in 1952 and 1953, and the 1950s was a tremendously innovative and productive decade in U.S. economic history. There's absolutely no economic problem in that. Whether there's a political "problem" -- because people substantially subject to a 70% or higher top marginal income tax rate would complain -- is a separate question.

Why US no more this 92% tax? They are stupid or what?
 

theMKR

Banned
Joined
Nov 3, 2016
Messages
70,925
Reaction score
13,557
The problem with GST is that when it runs at close to 20% it starts to distort the market. e.g. a person will buy a product priced at 100%, creating value for both parties, but not at 120%, resulting in lose-lose position caused by taxation.

They can choose to buy or not to buy.

The 20% GST collect led will be redistribute out via gst cash vouchers to help the poor by birth
 

MatrixTwo

Arch-Supremacy Member
Joined
Jan 6, 2015
Messages
10,983
Reaction score
206
OK, so are you going to choose not to eat food?


Please explain to me how (for example) a board member of a real estate company is working harder than the janitor who is sweeping and scrubbing the floors, carting the trash, and cleaning the pool. I'd really like to understand more about the greater hardship that board member endures. Are Mont Blanc pens harder to lift and push than full trash bins?

Please explain to me how (for example) a middle income worker who slogged hard to get to through poly and uni, and then had work my way up into a lead engineering position, dealing with all the ******** office politics, heavy responsibilities that are on my shoulder, weekends that i had to burn solving issues, family life that sometimes i have to compromise on, never ending work that doesn't leave me even when i leave office at night.....please do explain to me how the hell am i more "lucky" to get to where i am and how am i somehow indebted to the rest of my more "unlucky" who are mostly in their current predicament due to their own mistakes and lack of effort.


Dont always talk about the rich. The rich always find their way out of progressive taxation. It's middle income like me who are left to pick up the slag, so that the progressive politicians can take all the credit of being generous and benevolent.

So yes, progressive taxes are a tax on the hardworking and smart people. And thats why i am a fiscal conservative, i cannot vote against my own interests
 
Important Forum Advisory Note
This forum is moderated by volunteer moderators who will react only to members' feedback on posts. Moderators are not employees or representatives of HWZ Forums. Forum members and moderators are responsible for their own posts. Please refer to our Community Guidelines and Standards and Terms and Conditions for more information.
Top