New 10Gbps/5Gbps/6Gbps/3Gbps XGS-PON based plans

[leechoonhwee]

Noob here. Looking at starhub’s FAQ page, assuming i get 2 units of EB810v from starhub one shot & they set up as EasyMesh for me using wired backhaul, would my set up be something like this?

LIVING ROOM
- ONT to first unit EB810.
- RJ45 cable from one 2.5G lan port to tv in living room.
- RJ45 cable from one 2.5G lan port to tv in bedroom.
- 10G lan out to second unit EB810 in bedroom.

BEDROOM
- RJ45 cable from living room’s EB810 to the 10G wan port in bedroom’s EB810.
- Lan cable from bedroom’s EB810 to my mac mini.

Is this correct? If so i presume my mac mini would have 10gbps connection right?

 

[Henry Ng]

What is your point here?

As mentioned, Starhub is not th only ISP.

I am surprise that SH make it so clear openly that they will move users to 10 Gbps. Since SH did it, MR will also do it too. Other ISP may follow suit.

 

[xiaofan]

Hope by 2025 or 2026, the 10Gbps plan price start coming down to current 1Gbps price of roughly $40 and by default minimum fibre base plan will all be 2.5Gbps and telcos kill off 500Mbps or 1Gbps plan.

I don't see 1Gig going away in the near term. ISPs will probably get rid of 500Mbps to streamline their offerings like what we're seeing with Starhub and Singtel already.

I agree. 1Gbps will be the baseline, 2.5G may become the main stream and 10Gbps will be the higher end plan. I do not see much possibility of 5Gbps offering yet.

Previous prediction does not include GST. The following includes GST, probably in late 2025 only.

1) 1Gbps -- S$21.80 to S$32.70 (GST included), may bundle no router or simple router in the future

2) 2.5Gbps (true 2.5Gbps or aggregated 2.5Gbps) -- S$21.80 to S$49.05, depend on router bundle, higher cost plan is probably possible with contents bundle (Singtel/Starhub)

3) 10Gbps -- S$49.05 to S$76.30, depending on router bundle and contents bundle (mainly Singtel/Starhub)

4) Note:
Aggregated 2Gbps/2.5Gbps plan -- actually the cost is more or less the same for the ISPs compared to 1Gbps plan. No need to upgrade the GPON ONR or the backend OLT.

True 2.5Gbps --> 2.5G capable GPON ONT may be slightly more expensive than GPON ONT. Likely no need to upgrade backend OLT (hopefully experts can confirm this is correct or not).

5) Maybe there will be higher end true 10Gbps plan in the future. XGS-PON ONT/ONR in reality limit the speed to about 8.2Gbps. So the current 10Gbps plans (other than legacy VQ/SI) are 8Gbps plan in reality.

 

[xiaofan]

I am surprise that SH make it so clear openly that they will move users to 10 Gbps. Since SH did it, MR will also do it too. Other ISP may follow suit.

Moving to the same network is not equal to moving eveyone up to 10Gbps plan. It just means that the backend is the same, which makes sense in the long run. They can still offer 1Gbps, 2.5Gbps and 10Gbps (or even 5Gbps if they like).

On the other hand, Starhub/Singtel have already got rid of 500Mbps plan, they may get rid of the 1Gbps down the road and offer 2.5Gbps as the base line, but not so fast.

 

[xiaofan]

Now in 2024 SH give what brand and type of ONT for their usual 1Gbps and 2Gbps plan?

Still GPON ONT. Not so sure which brand, maybe still the same Huawei. I got the same Huawei ONT in 2014 and 2021.

Anyway, GPON ONT is kind of very mature, so the brand not so important, Nokia, Huawei, ZTE, etc, all are similar.

 

[xiaofan]

Best is all 1Gbps free speed upgrade to 2.5Gbps Not those 2Gbps plan (1+1) type which sucks so all plan become 2.5Gbps or 10Gbps.

You may get what you do not really want (aggregated 2.5Gbs plan and not true 2.5Gbps plan).

Whizcomms is basically got rid of the 300Mbps/1Gbps plan and offer only the new 2.5Gbps aggregated plan. Now you got the ONR. To me it is a downgrade for people opt for the bridged ONR (ONT). But of course that is just me as I do not like ONR.

On the other hand, 2.5Gbps aggregated plan is okay for average users, this is especially true when it is only at S$21.80 per month (GST included).

 

[Henry Ng]

You may get what you do not really want (aggregated 2.5Gbs plan and not true 2.5Gbps plan).

Whizcomms is basically got rid of the 300Mbps/1Gbps plan and offer only the new 2.5Gbps aggregated plan. Now you got the ONR. To me it is a downgrade for people opt for the bridged ONR (ONT). But of course that is just me as I do not like ONR.

On the other hand, 2.5Gbps aggregated plan is okay for average users, this is especially true when it is only at S$21.80 per month (GST included).

May be you can share a bit on aggregated 2.5Gbs plan vs true 2.5Gbps plan.

 

[limcc]

I know ppl say not to choose ISP based on router given but considering 10gbps plans now all come with wifi 7 routers which aren’t cheap, i think the router given is quite important.

Starhub $69.95 comes with TP-Link EB810v & with $15 extra per month you get a second unit EB810v. MR $59.99 with one off $50 top up comes with TP-Link Archer BE805. Singtel $86 comes with TP-Link HB810 & with extra $16.80 per month you get a second unit TP-Link HB810.

All 3 routers not cheap of course but would like the experts’ advice on which of the 3: EB810v, BE805 or HB810 is the “best” router?

Simply base on the public specs:

EB810v
https://www.tp-link.com/sg/service-provider/wifi-router/eb810v/

1. BE22000 Tri-Band WiFi: 11520 Mbps (6 GHz, HE320) + 8640 Mbps (5 GHz, HE240) + 1376 Mbps (2.4 GHz).
2. 10G Fiber and Ethernet Internet Connections: 1× 10GE/SFP+ Combo WAN port, 1× 10GE LAN port, and 3× 2.5GE LAN ports

Archer BE805
https://www.tp-link.com/us/home-networking/wifi-router/archer-be805/

1. BE19000 Tri-Band WiFi: 11520 Mbps (6 GHz:, HE320) + 5760 Mbps (5 GHz, HE160) + 1376 Mbps (2.4 GHz)
2. Dual 10 G Ports: 1× 10 Gbps WAN port + 1× 10 Gbps LAN port + 4× 1 Gbps LAN ports + 2× USB 3.0 ports,

HB810
https://www.tp-link.com/sg/service-provider/wifi-router/hb810/

1. BE22000 Tri-Band WiFi: 11520 Mbps (6 GHz, HE320) + 8640 Mbps (5 GHz, HE240) + 1376 Mbps (2.4 GHz)
2. 10G Internet Connections: 1× 10GE/SFP+ Combo WAN port, 1× 10GE LAN port, and 2× 2.5GE LAN ports

Assuming the processor and ROM/RAM sizes are the same, the EB810v offer the most flexible ports arrangement. 1× 10GE/SFP+ Combo WAN, 1x 10GE LAN and 3× 2.5GE; The HB810 might be more appealing for family/WAF; Archer BE805 beside 1x WAN & 1x LAN as 10Gbps, the other LAN ports are only 1Gbps but 4x.

 

[Henry Ng]

Moving to the same network is not equal to moving eveyone up to 10Gbps plan. It just means that the backend is the same, which makes sense in the long run. They can still offer 1Gbps, 2.5Gbps and 10Gbps (or even 5Gbps if they like).

On the other hand, Starhub/Singtel have already got rid of 500Mbps plan, they may get rid of the 1Gbps down the road and offer 2.5Gbps as the base line, but not so fast.

If you read Q1, Starhub actually said that Ultra Speed network is 10Gbps. Then Q9 and Q10 actually said moving the users to Ultra Speed Network.

Q1 What is the UltraSpeed Network?

The UltraSpeed Network uses the latest fibre technology to deliver symmetrical upload and download that supports high-speed 10 gigabits per second (Gbps) symmetrical data transfers. This means that this StarHub fibre broadband service is now capable of delivering broadband network access at speeds of up to 10Gbps downstream and 10Gbps upstream.

Q9 If I sign up for a StarHub 1Gbps or 2Gbps plan, would I be able to enjoy the benefit of the UltraSpeed Network immediately?

Currently, only the UltraSpeed 10Gbps plan offers the immediate benefit of being part of the UltraSpeed Network. Customers on 1Gbps and 2Gbps will be migrated to the StarHub UltraSpeed Network progressively. We recommend that you subscribe to UltraSpeed 10Gbps as your preferred choice of broadband plan to enjoy the immediate benefits.

Q10 I am an existing StarHub Broadband customer, when will I be upgraded to StarHub UltraSpeed Network?

Migration of StarHub Broadband customers to the UltraSpeed Network will be conducted progressively and we will keep our customers updated.​

 

[xiaofan]

If you read Q1, Starhub actually said that Ultra Speed network is 10Gbps. Then Q9 and Q10 actually said moving the users to Ultra Speed Network.

Q1 What is the UltraSpeed Network?

The UltraSpeed Network uses the latest fibre technology to deliver symmetrical upload and download that supports high-speed 10 gigabits per second (Gbps) symmetrical data transfers. This means that this StarHub fibre broadband service is now capable of delivering broadband network access at speeds of up to 10Gbps downstream and 10Gbps upstream.

Q9 If I sign up for a StarHub 1Gbps or 2Gbps plan, would I be able to enjoy the benefit of the UltraSpeed Network immediately?
Currently, only the UltraSpeed 10Gbps plan offers the immediate benefit of being part of the UltraSpeed Network. Customers on 1Gbps and 2Gbps will be migrated to the StarHub UltraSpeed Network progressively. We recommend that you subscribe to UltraSpeed 10Gbps as your preferred choice of broadband plan to enjoy the immediate benefits.

Q10 I am an existing StarHub Broadband customer, when will I be upgraded to StarHub UltraSpeed Network?
Migration of StarHub Broadband customers to the UltraSpeed Network will be conducted progressively and we will keep our customers updated.​

Okay good point, but I believe that will probably take some time for the 1Gbps plan users.

If you look at the pricing of current Starhub 1Gbps plan and 2Gbps plan, they can of course move the 2Gbps plan to 10Gbps as the price difference is not that much.

The price difference is still quite a bit between 1Gbps and 10Gbps. As you mentioned before, Starhub will likely not offer that kind of price to 10Gbps plan users any time soon, even without router.

True that SH is not the only isp but honestly in business everyone will want to earn more for profit so such price is very very unlikely to happen. Just wait and See. If the ultra speed launch is further postponed to December 2024 then it is sure not happening to get such price of $45/mth. I think cheapest is $49.90 or $54.90 without router in 2026. $45/mth may be not possible as isp need to cover their cost and make money too. It will not be cheaper for consumer to get plan without router too. In order to save cost i will prefer to get plan with isp router.

https://www.starhub.com/personal/broadband.html

 

[xiaofan]

May be you can share a bit on aggregated 2.5Gbs plan vs true 2.5Gbps plan.

https://forums.hardwarezone.com.sg/...nd-whizcomm-boradband.6984714/#post-150697339

Updated on 20-Feb-2024.

Quick comparison -- the recommendation is just my personal opinion. I myself consider Whizcomms 2.5Gbps plan using GPON ONR to be worse than existing Whizcomms 1Gbps plan with ONT (and worse than Starhub/M1 1Gbps plan, but that is just my personal opionion.

SIMBA 2.5Gbps plan
Pros:
1) "True" 2.5Gbps plan with GPON ONT, you can use your own router as the main router. It is possible to use a router with 2.5G WAN and 2.5G LAN to get single connection up to 2.5Gbps download (1.25Gbps upload).
2) You can use your own router with full features
3) You can use more adavnced routers with dual 2.5G ports to have wired 2.5G connection to LAN devices. Optional 2.5G switches can be added.

Cons
1) Using CGNAT as of now, no public IPv4 address. No static IPv4 add-on as of now.
2) No IPv6 support
3) No digital voice add-on as of now
4) Not yet fully deployed to all areas yet, not proven in terms of stability

Whizcomms 2.5Gbps plan
Pros:
1) With public IPv4 address
2) The ONR itself is a wired router so you may save one router in the DB Box
3) With Digital Voice add-on
4) Using Singtel network with proven stability
5) Cheaper wireless APs or mesh solutions can be used since there is no need to have 2.5G WAN port.

Cons
1) "Fake" aggregated 2.5Gbps plan with GPON ONR (each ONR LAN port is up to 1Gbps download/upload speed, total speed across all connections: up to 2.5Gbps downalod and 1.25Gbps upload.
2) No IPv6 support (to be confirmed)
3) You have to use your own router in bridged mode (AP mode) to avoid Double NAT. Or you have to live with some limitations of Double NAT if you want to use your own router in router mode
4) The GPON ONR may have limited features compared to a typical consumer router (let alone better grade routers).

Personal Recommendations: just my personal opinion
Avoid both plans as of now. Or you can get both (SIMBA+WC) if you want to have a low cost option with dual ISP redundancy

For an average user, the WC ONR limitation may not mean much and WC 2.5Gbps should work well for them. It may be more stable choice between the two and it is available now to all users whereas SIMBA is still rolling out the service.

 

[wolfrage89]

Hi masters, could any enlighten me why did the government says that they are putting in 100million to "boost" broadband network to 10Gbps starting from mid 2024 when telecos are already have such offerrings? What exactly are they doing? Are they upgrading to make increase the capacity, standardize the infrastructure or something else? What is the difference between the 10GBps service now compare to the one the government is planning to upgrade to?

 

[Fellowes]

Simply base on the public specs:

EB810v
https://www.tp-link.com/sg/service-provider/wifi-router/eb810v/

1. BE22000 Tri-Band WiFi: 11520 Mbps (6 GHz, HE320) + 8640 Mbps (5 GHz, HE240) + 1376 Mbps (2.4 GHz).
2. 10G Fiber and Ethernet Internet Connections: 1× 10GE/SFP+ Combo WAN port, 1× 10GE LAN port, and 3× 2.5GE LAN ports

Archer BE805
https://www.tp-link.com/us/home-networking/wifi-router/archer-be805/

1. BE19000 Tri-Band WiFi: 11520 Mbps (6 GHz:, HE320) + 5760 Mbps (5 GHz, HE160) + 1376 Mbps (2.4 GHz)
2. Dual 10 G Ports: 1× 10 Gbps WAN port + 1× 10 Gbps LAN port + 4× 1 Gbps LAN ports + 2× USB 3.0 ports,

HB810
https://www.tp-link.com/sg/service-provider/wifi-router/hb810/

1. BE22000 Tri-Band WiFi: 11520 Mbps (6 GHz, HE320) + 8640 Mbps (5 GHz, HE240) + 1376 Mbps (2.4 GHz)
2. 10G Internet Connections: 1× 10GE/SFP+ Combo WAN port, 1× 10GE LAN port, and 2× 2.5GE LAN ports

Assuming the processor and ROM/RAM sizes are the same, the EB810v offer the most flexible ports arrangement. 1× 10GE/SFP+ Combo WAN, 1x 10GE LAN and 3× 2.5GE; The HB810 might be more appealing for family/WAF; Archer BE805 beside 1x WAN & 1x LAN as 10Gbps, the other LAN ports are only 1Gbps but 4x.

Meaning to say the SH Home Digital Voice is plug into the BE810v directly? Is there still a need for a ONT or this TP link router is ONR by itself? Fibre Box to TP link directly? No idea how it works, maybe expert can explain.

 

[xiaofan]

Meaning to say the SH Home Digital Voice is plug into the BE810v directly? Is there still a need for a ONT or this TP link router is ONR by itself? Fibre Box to TP link directly? No idea how it works, maybe expert can explain.

I am sorry but I can not see any places saying that they have a port for digital voice. Where do you see the mentioning of any volice port?

The TP-Link WiFI 7 routers are not ONR. So you still need an XGS-PON ONT (or ONR in Singtel's case)

As for the SFP+ port, probably can not be directly connect to the FTP through an SFP+ module, at least not yet, unless someone figured out a way to replace the XGS-PON ONT/ONR.

 

[Henry Ng]

Hi masters, could any enlighten me why did the government says that they are putting in 100million to "boost" broadband network to 10Gbps starting from mid 2024 when telecos are already have such offerrings? What exactly are they doing? Are they upgrading to make increase the capacity, standardize the infrastructure or something else? What is the difference between the 10GBps service now compare to the one the government is planning to upgrade to?

You must write in to Govt to ask them what they are doing and not ask here. We are not them so how we know?

 

[Apparatus]

I am sorry but I can not see any places saying that they have a port for digital voice. Where do you see the mentioning of any volice port?

The TP-Link WiFI 7 routers are not ONR. So you still need an XGS-PON ONT (or ONR in Singtel's case)

As for the SFP+ port, probably can not be directly connect to the FTP through an SFP+ module, at least not yet, unless someone figured out a way to replace the XGS-PON ONT/ONR.

Read how FXS ports can be used for digital voice

https://www.techtarget.com/searchunifiedcommunications/tip/Turning-analog-phones-into-VoIP-phones

 

[Infested_fred]

Hi Gurus,

If i were to sign for the Starhub 10GBPS broadband plan which provide us the TP-Link Wifi 7 router, can i still utilize my existing ASUS XT12 Pro as Imesh node, connect to the TP-Link router?

 

[jasonho]

Hi Gurus,

If i were to sign for the Starhub 10GBPS broadband plan which provide us the TP-Link Wifi 7 router, can i still utilize my existing ASUS XT12 Pro as Imesh node, connect to the TP-Link router?

No you cant, TPLink Mesh tech is diff from Asus.

However, you can wire from TPLink router to your XT12 Pro and create a diff SSID for Asus MESH.

You either can setup your XT12 Pro as access point mode or NAT into to turn into another router mode device from TPLlink Router

 

[ElZedHaitch]

Does anyone know if the TP link routers support VLANs outside of just different SSIDs

 

[xiaofan]

Read how FXS ports can be used for digital voice

https://www.techtarget.com/searchunifiedcommunications/tip/Turning-analog-phones-into-VoIP-phones

I see. Somehow I missed the two FXS ports on the EB810v, even I opened my eye big big (old man liao). Thanks.